Cuba Is Not As Bad As You're Told To Think

[PatrickHenry]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, There is NOTHING good about Cuba right now. Its a country run by a sick dictator, its a place where human rights are a joke, a place where people are told how to vote, how to think, what to say and what to do... Its sad and the embargo is just and needs stay till Communist Cuba falls.

Your sources?

[Mr.Vicchio]

Sources? SOURCES???

erg do I have to post 50 links to common knowoledge all the time?

[PatrickHenry]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, Sources? SOURCES??? erg do I have to post 50 links to common knowoledge all the time?

Sir, will you follow the format?

[Mr.Vicchio]

http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/5/1/143641

http://www.hermanos.org/docs/washpost061902.htm

http://www.cubanet.org/CNews/y00/apr00/24e20.htm

http://www.nationalreview.com/goldberg/gol...rint040700.html

That should be a good start.

[Mr.Vicchio]

The format? I don't see you posting 500 links with each post, quit hounding me to back up if you aren't gonna harress everyone else.

[PatrickHenry]

Originally posted by castille, Er....you do realise that its illegal to conduct trade in Communist nations right? So the embargo is HELPING Castro conduct his grand Anti-Capitalist paradise. And if Cuba is a Workers Paradise....who are those thousands of Cuban refugees who risk everything to travel to America?

Is the People's Republic of China no longer a communist nation? Or do you allege that the US doesn't trade with them?
Excerpt from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peoples_Republic_of_China

After the death of Mao, Deng Xiaoping succeeded to power and mainland China remained under Communist rule. Since then, the government has gradually loosened governmental control over people's personal lives and engaged in reforms to transform its planned economy into a market-based one. Nevertheless the government remains intent on maintaining the political control of the Communist Party of China and has maintained repressive policies against groups which it feels are a threat to its political control. (see Falun Gong and Tibet).

No, in answer to your question, I believe that the embargo against Cuba is not just because they're commies. It seems to be specifically targeted at Cuba.
My question is, "Why?" Is the US afraid of Cuba? China seems more fearsome...

It seems evident that Cuba is poverty stricken. That may very well be the reason for Cuban immigrants coming to America. Mexico sends many more to the US, but you don't accuse that nation of wrongdoing... Wages are better in the US than in many parts of the world.

Now if you will answer my questions regarding Castro's allegations about his nation's "progress"...

[Mr.Vicchio]

We embargoed Cuba for the 63 missile crisis, and until they do as we asked concerning that time period, they stay embargoed... thats that.

Mr.Vicchio

And the US sponsored invasion attempt, the Bay of Pigs, you think perhaps that might have encouraged Cuba to take steps to deter any further US aggression?

I'm further curious, your nation already had nukes pointed at half the world, probably including Cuba. So, quite why was Cuba doing the same such an issue?

Of course, the US was rather happy when Batista was in power though Batista wasn't the nicest kid on the block was he. US organised crime also seemed to like Cuba.

Quite a situation, but of whose making?

[dismal]

Cuba can trade with the entire rest of the world. They export all they can grow now. Those who think communism doesn't work because of the embargo are nuts.

Besides, simple logic dictates that if you want or need someone else to give you something then you shouldn't piss them off.

If Castro knows that trade with the US is critical to his nation's prosperity he's done a pretty piss poor job as a leader.

And yet he keeps getting re-elected.

[Ross]

Er....you do realise that its illegal to conduct trade in Communist nations right?

Shut up you blithering idiot. As has been mentioned before MULTIPLE times, that is NOT a communist ideal. Trade is fine and required for self-sustainment, but PROFITING and making individuals rise over others would be violative of communist doctrine.

Ross

Erm, believe it or not time, capitalism is permitted, in Cuba, but only to a degree. Private citizens can own small busniesses, restaurants and bars being a good example. It has been that way since about 1993 if memory serves me correctly. And yes, they get to make profit, provided the business succeeds of course.

China however is probably a mcuh better example of how communism seeks to make capitalism work for it.

[dotcoma]

Originally posted by RebelWithanAK, Joe: It's called an embargo. We have an embargo on Cuba, hence they can't import nor export a lot of shit - including Coke, an American product. Where have YOU been the last 50 years?

There is coca cola in Cuba. Mexico sells it to them.

[dismal]

Originally posted by PeterWolf, Ross Erm, believe it or not time, capitalism is permitted, in Cuba, but only to a degree. Private citizens can own small busniesses, restaurants and bars being a good example. It has been that way since about 1993 if memory serves me correctly. And yes, they get to make profit, provided the business succeeds of course.

Yes, this is the amusing part. Cuba loses its aid from the Soviet empire and its economy craters. The economy needs stimulus. What does Fidel do?

Enagages in capitalist reforms!

From this it seems reasonable to conclude that Fidel understands that economic freedom brings prosperity but opts for communist rhetoric and poverty instead.

And yet he keeps getting elected...

[dotcoma]

Elections? We don't need no stinking elections!

[dismal]

Originally posted by roxdog, Elections? We don't need no stinking elections!

Well, if you want to quote el jefe máximo correctly it's:

"The revolution has no time for elections."

But that was in 1961 and the revolution has more time on its hands these days.

[PatrickHenry]

Will anyone answer the questions I asked above? Or should anyone posting on this topic without sources and a reasoned argument be labeled an opinionated poser?

[dismal]

Originally posted by PatrickHenry, Will anyone answer the questions I asked above? Or should anyone posting on this topic without sources and a reasoned argument be labeled an opinionated poser?

Sure, it is my opinion (hence no sources needed) that you are asking questions that are essentially irrelevant.

The primary reason Cuba is embargoed is because of Castro actions and rhetoric. It has nothing to do with China or his success as the Big Chief.
Castro could achieve an end to the embargo almost immediately if he chose to, but his external PR machine is otherwise occupied and he has effectively silenced internal dissent.

If it helps, try imagining a John Kerry in Cuba ranting about how "Fidel's disastrous foreign policy has alienated foreign leaders". Then imagine him dead or in a cell instead of on the ballot.

I remain curious, how many of you posting to this thread have any first hand experience of Cuba?
Surely one or two of you experts must have some first hand knowledge?
Are you all afraid to answer?

[dotcoma]

Afraid to answer? Your apologizing for f@cking Fidel Castro.

roxdog

Um, that's an interesting response. I'm curious, how do you come to that conclusion? I'm apologising for no one by the way, so I look forward to your resoning here. Are you the type of person that thinks an alleged pedophile has no right to a legal defense?