Is Obama a good choice for president?

[Captain Chaos]

I have been reading the wikipedia article on Obama.

This piece is clearly pro-obama, and yet it still paints a picture that makes me a bit leary of the man.

Here is a quote from Obama that is mentioned in the article. It comes from a conference call by a group called Wake Up Walmart:

Quote by: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama "You gotta pay your workers enough that they can actually not only shop at Wal-Mart, but ultimately send their kids to college and save for retirement."

It seems to me that Walmart really does not have to pay its workers enough to send their kids to college and pay for retirement. That might be a nice thing to do, or it might eliminate Walmart's ability to function in the free market. Do U.S. senators need to be getting involved in a corporation's inner workings like this?

As an aside, there are a variety of ways in which we, as a society, can see to it that kids get college educated. It is really quite practical in the U.S. for a person with no money, and no parental backing, to get a college education right now while working at the same time. Difficult, but still practical.



This is just a single example. Perhaps Obama does not take such a knee-jerk reaction to all issues, or perhaps he has thought it through better than I am giving him credit for.

What are your thoughts?

[Osborn F Enready]

Is Obama a good choice for president?

No.

I say that because he chose to affiliate himself with one of two of the most corrupt parties that exist in Washington, and if he actually wanted to make positive change(Constitutional re-alignment), he would know better than to do this, since they wouldn't nominate him.

I think he is another Bill Clinton wanna be.

[modcon]

I don't think he can live up to the hype. How is his platform at all different than that of a generic anti-business Democrat? Charisma and youth will only get you so far in an election. There comes a time when people look for substance, and that is something that I am not convinced that Obama has.

[Captain Chaos]

I was kind of hoping Idmaniac or another Obama fan would jump in and defend him here.

[Osborn F Enready]

Chaos said: I was kind of hoping Idmaniac or another Obama fan would jump in and defend him here.

Hard to defend him when all he has so far is words, and little actions to support his spoken intentions.

I think his party choice says more about him than any of his words.

The only reason I respect Ron Paul is because he admits his reason for picking the Republican party to get in to office, even though he is clearly by words and actions a libertarian.

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: Osborn F Enready Hard to defend him when all he has so far is words, and little actions to support his spoken intentions. I think his party choice says more about him than any of his words. The only reason I respect Ron Paul is because he admits his reason for picking the Republican party to get in to office, even though he is clearly by words and actions a libertarian.

I would be willing to start with his spoken intentions, but I am not confident of those either.

[GHook93]

Absolutely! The guy is a breath of fresh air.

He is a mixed race half black/white Christian raised by a white women (his father left when he was 2 yrs old. Havard Law student top of his class (something Bush can't say). He was elected the first African American president of the Harvard Law Review, obtaining his Juris Doctor degree magna cum laude in 1991.

He openly admitted to experimenting with pot and cocaine. He wasn't an addict, but he tried them. He admitted before he was ever asked. Not the "I never inhaled" BS Clinton pulled.

He has my vote, and not because I am biased as an IL voter.
Some of his views.

Education
In April 2005, Obama sponsored his first Senate bill, the "Higher Education Opportunity through Pell Grant Expansion Act", S. 697.[39] Entered in fulfillment of a campaign promise to help needy students pay their college tuitions, the bill proposed increasing the maximum amount of Pell Grant awards to $5,100.[40] Provision for Pell Grant awards was later incorporated into the "Deficit Reduction Act", S. 1932, signed by President George W. Bush on February 8, 2006.[41]


Immigration
Obama co-sponsored the "Secure America and Orderly Immigration Act", S. 1033, introduced by Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) on May 12, 2005.[42] Obama also supported a later revision, the "Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act", S. 2611, passed by the Senate on May 25, 2006.[43] He offered three amendments that were included in the bill passed by the Senate: (1) to protect American workers against unfair job competition from guest workers; (2) require employer verification of their employees' legal immigration status through improved verification systems; and (3) fund improvements in FBI background checks of immigrants applying for U.S. citizenship.[44] Obama also voted for a related bill, the Secure Fence Act of 2006, which authorizes construction of fencing and other security improvements along the United States–Mexico border.[45] President Bush signed the bill into law in October 2006, calling it "an important step toward immigration reform."[46]


Nonproliferation
In November 2005, Obama and Sen. Richard Lugar (R-IN) introduced the "Cooperative Proliferation Detection, Interdiction Assistance, and Conventional Threat Reduction Act" to expand the Nunn-Lugar cooperative threat reduction concept to conventional weapons, including shoulder-fired missiles and anti-personnel mines.[47][48] Provisions of the bill, also known as "Lugar-Obama", were included in H.R. 6060 and passed by Congress in December 2006.[49] The legislation requires signature by President Bush to become law.[50]


Transparency
Obama joined with Senators Coburn (R-OK), Carper (D-DE), and McCain (R-AZ) in sponsoring the "Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act", S. 2590, to provide citizens with a website, managed by the Office of Management and Budget, listing all organizations receiving Federal funds from 2007 onward, and providing breakdowns by the agency allocating the funds, the dollar amount given, and the purpose of the grant or contract.[51] President Bush signed the bill, also referred to as the "Coburn-Obama Transparency Act", into law in September 2006.[52]

Iraq War
Obama was an early opponent of Bush administration policies on Iraq. In the fall of 2002, Obama stated: "I am not opposed to all wars. I'm opposed to dumb wars...You want a fight, President Bush? Let's finish the fight with Bin Laden and al-Qaeda, through effective, coordinated intelligence, and a shutting down of the financial networks that support terrorism, and a homeland security program that involves more than color-coded warnings."[77] Speaking before the Chicago Council on Global Affairs in November 2006, he said: "The days of using the war on terror as a political football are over. [...] It is time to give Iraqis their country back, and it is time to refocus America's efforts on the wider struggle yet to be won." He is calling for a phased withdrawal of American troops to begin in 2007.[78]

[GHook93]

Quote by: Captain Chaos Here is a quote from Obama that is mentioned in the article. It comes from a conference call by a group called Wake Up Walmart: It seems to me that Walmart really does not have to pay its workers enough to send their kids to college and pay for retirement. That might be a nice thing to do, or it might eliminate Walmart's ability to function in the free market. Do U.S. senators need to be getting involved in a corporation's inner workings like this? As an aside, there are a variety of ways in which we, as a society, can see to it that kids get college educated. It is really quite practical in the U.S. for a person with no money, and no parental backing, to get a college education right now while working at the same time. Difficult, but still practical.

I think he is overstating when he says Walmart should be paying its employees enough to go to college. But he has a point Walmart is a notorious low wage payer, yet being such a retail giant. They are also know to skimp on benefits. What they do is wipe out the local competitions and employee the local (mostly uneducated public) with the US equivalent of "sweat shops."

They expoit the uneducated lower-class. This is a positive for Obama. It is again refreshing to see a politician concerned about the livelihood of the low-end worker. Obviously the rest of the politicians don't that is why all the manufacturing jobs go to China.

[Captain Chaos]

What you cited sounds pretty good...


What is his stance on universal healthcare?

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: GHook93 I think he is overstating when he says Walmart should be paying its employees enough to go to college. But he has a point Walmart is a notorious low wage payer, yet being such a retail giant. They are also know to skimp on benefits. What they do is wipe out the local competitions and employee the local (mostly uneducated public) with the US equivalent of "sweat shops." They expoit the uneducated lower-class. This is a positive for Obama. It is again refreshing to see a politician concerned about the livelihood of the low-end worker. Obviously the rest of the politicians don't that is why all the manufacturing jobs go to China.

As long as he does not start trying to control wages or place limitations on Walmart. That would not be the answer to the problem at hand.

I actually believe Walmart, in the long run, increases total wealth through an increase in efficiency. That, however, would be a different thread.

[Captain Chaos]

The fact that Obama is a smoker does not endear me to him at all. I view that, in America, as a very annoying character flaw.

[GHook93]

Quote by: Captain Chaos What you cited sounds pretty good... What is his stance on universal healthcare?

In his senate campaigns in IL, he didn't (at least I didn't hear him) address universal healthcare. He did state (as they all do - politicians that is) that we need to get more affordable healthcare.

Quotes from his website: Health Care | U.S. Senator Barack Obama

Promoting affordable, accessible, and high-quality health care was a priority for Barack Obama in the Illinois State Senate and is a priority for him in the United States Senate. He believes firmly that health care should be a right for everyone, not a privilege for the few.

Senator Obama is pursuing legislative initiatives to help improve health care quality. He helped draft and introduce the National MEDiC Act (S. 1784), which promotes patient safety initiatives, including early disclosure and compensation to patients injured by medical errors. He also introduced the Hospital Quality Report Card Act (S. 2359), which will use federal hospital quality reporting requirements to inform and assist patients and other consumers in making their health care decisions. Senator Obama strongly believes that greater use of health information technology can contain costs and improve the efficiency of our health care system. He introduced the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program Efficiency Act (S. 2247), which would leverage the federal government's purchasing power to encourage increased adoption of technology by participating health plans. In 2005, Senator Obama spoke at the commencement of the University of Chicago's Pritzker School of Medicine about the importance of health information technology

[GHook93]

Quote by: Captain Chaos The fact that Obama is a smoker does not endear me to him at all. I view that, in America, as a very annoying character flaw.

Are you saying a pot smoker? He isn't! He just tried like the rest of us (OK the majority of us). If he was still a pot-head I see your point.

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: GHook93 Are you saying a pot smoker? He isn't! He just tried like the rest of us (OK the majority of us). If he was still a pot-head I see your point.

He smokes cigarettes.

[GHook93]

Quote by: Captain Chaos He smokes cigarettes.

That is hardly a major character flaw!

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: GHook93 That is hardly a major character flaw!

I am not rational on this issue.

[Scribbler1]

As character flaws go, it beats chasing Senate Pages around.

[Gods_Mercenary]

Why is smoking pot a flaw but smoking cigarettes isn't?

[Gods_Mercenary]

Quote by: Osborn F Enready No. I say that because he chose to affiliate himself with one of two of the most corrupt parties that exist in Washington, and if he actually wanted to make positive change(Constitutional re-alignment), he would know better than to do this, since they wouldn't nominate him. I think he is another Bill Clinton wanna be.

If I could run for president, I'd run with a party, but then I'd reneg and work to demolish the party system, I'd hope that I'd endeared myself to the people enough so they'd vote me in the second term.

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: Gods_Mercenary If I could run for president, I'd run with a party, but then I'd reneg and work to demolish the party system, I'd hope that I'd endeared myself to the people enough so they'd vote me in the second term.

What second term? You'd be impeached so fast you wouldn't know what hit you.
The two-faced entity we can the Republicans and Democrats don't like to give up their power, and if you even HINTED that you would try to demolish either party or the party system they would show you TRUE bipartisanship, but good!

Or they'd have you killed.