the holocaust

[bob60292]

For anyone that might have any doubts, I like to suggest that the evidence shows that the holocaust really happened. It happened when Lenin and Stalin unleashed their murderous evil on their own people.It happened under Mao. It happened in Cambodia and Viet Nam. It happened in the Balkins. It happened to European Jews in Hitler's Germany over 63 years ago.; and it is happening to the Palestinians under the European Jews in Palestine.

[Chaossaber314]

What a way to stimulate discussion... by starting a thread that's Op compares one side to Hitler.

Godwin's Law FTL.

[Abdullah]

Before anyone says anything about Muslims and the holocaust, YES (believe it or not :eek: ) I do believe there was a holocaust.

and it is happening to the Palestinians under the European Jews in Palestine.

How very true.

[Georgia]

Evidence?

[underbear1]

sorry the holocaust was a one time event, it was Hitler's genocide of 6 million jews and others. The other events you list are mass murders, they are not the holocaust.

[Jern_Sandyer]

Quote by: underbear1 sorry the holocaust was a one time event, it was Hitler's genocide of 6 million jews and others. The other events you list are mass murders, they are not the holocaust.

True, The holocaust is a name given to a single Genocide. Just like the genocide in Rwanda is called the Rwandan Genocide. The proof is that 6 million Jews (plus other minorities) for some odd reason were no longer living on this planet after the second world War and they weren't killed on the battle front but in camps where thier dead corpses were found.

[shield772]

Quote by: Abdullah Before anyone says anything about Muslims and the holocaust, YES (believe it or not :eek: ) I do believe there was a holocaust. How very true.

There is far more than enough attrocities on both sides of that conflict, but it is continued because of the palestinians leaders refusing deal after deal for their own state. Both sides are equally to blame for killing, lets not pretend that what is happening there in anyway compares to the other genocides that were mentioned.

[Atlas]

Quote by: bob60292 For anyone that might have any doubts, I like to suggest that the evidence shows that the holocaust really happened. It happened when Lenin and Stalin unleashed their murderous evil on their own people.It happened under Mao. It happened in Cambodia and Viet Nam. It happened in the Balkins. It happened to European Jews in Hitler's Germany over 63 years ago.; and it is happening to the Palestinians under the European Jews in Palestine.

Lenin and Stalin might have systematically murdered masses of people, but their intentions weren't complete extinction of one ethnic group or another,
The genocide in Rwanda, as horrible as it might been wasn't any near the proportions, efficiency and hatred that where in the holocaust.
The holocaust wasn't given a name for no reason, its unique proportions, intentions and results make it a symbol of the evil capability of men.

I think your comparison of the Holocaust to the situation in the Palestinian territories is not only sick but has no place in reality whatsoever.

By the way, Jews from all 6 continents are living in Israel today, they referred commonly as "Israelis"...

[bob60292]

Quote by: Georgia Evidence?

Ask abdullah

[bob60292]

Quote by: underbear1 sorry the holocaust was a one time event, it was Hitler's genocide of 6 million jews and others. The other events you list are mass murders, they are not the holocaust.

If someone were holding a gun to your head the last thing you would want to do is distinguish between whether to call it by one name or the other. Either way your _ss is grass.

[GHook93]

Quote by: bob60292 Ask abdullah

Your the one that started a boldly inaccurate thread why don't you.

[bob60292]

Quote by: shield772 There is far more than enough attrocities on both sides of that conflict, but it is continued because of the palestinians leaders refusing deal after deal for their own state. Both sides are equally to blame for killing, lets not pretend that what is happening there in anyway compares to the other genocides that were mentioned.

Sheild
I'm neither a muslim nor a Palestinian; but I know that if the Israeli army, or any other foeiign army came into my state or country, claiming the right to take my ancestral home, killed my children, parents,siblings and/or friends for the crime of not giving it all up gracefully, I would also be less than enthusiastic to negotiate on lopsided terms. I am an American and a Christian from the very depths of my soul, but I believe that both Christians and Jews have been deceived by the Anglo-American establishment into supporting what is basically a colony in the strategic Middle East that is beholden to American and British support for it's survival. Both Jews and Palestinians have lived together in the region in a relatively peaceful and harmonious way before 1948. Both Christians and Jews have been duped into believing a disingenuous explanation for the the crimes against the native people of Palestine.
Furthermore, the narrow Biblical interpretation that has been used to justify the Palestinian tragedy is horrific. With all due respect for my Christian and Jewish brothers and sisters, it must also be recognized that God is loving and good. As I study scripture I discover more and more that His desire to to be the Saviour of mankind: not the bloody conquerer of the land He created and on which man temporarily lives. In the words of Jesus "heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away" He also says "Whatsoever you do unto the least of my bretherin you do unto me" " Love thy neighber as thy self".
I think we must all respect the right of European Jews in Palestine to believe whatever they want; but that right ends when a situation is created where a group of settlers, whose genetic link to the ancient Hebrews is itself dubious, claim the right to invite their own kind in from any country in the world, while they deny the right of its native inhabitants to return.
I think the real culprits in this tragedy are not as much, Christians, Jews, or Muslims. The real enemy is the ignorance, and gullability of all of us who fail to recognize the devious scheme for a beholden Anglo-American colony in Palestine. This disastrous plan has only fostered hatred, death, and misery, and often in the name of a God whose most profound desire is for us to show love for one another regardless of race, color or creed.

[bob60292]

Quote by: GHook93 Your the one that started a boldly inaccurate thread why don't you.

OK Abdulla we would like to hear from you?
Satisfied?

[bob60292]

Quote by: Atlas Lenin and Stalin might have systematically murdered masses of people, but their intentions weren't complete extinction of one ethnic group or another, The genocide in Rwanda, as horrible as it might been wasn't any near the proportions, efficiency and hatred that where in the holocaust. The holocaust wasn't given a name for no reason, its unique proportions, intentions and results make it a symbol of the evil capability of men. I think your comparison of the Holocaust to the situation in the Palestinian territories is not only sick but has no place in reality whatsoever. By the way, Jews from all 6 continents are living in Israel today, they referred commonly as "Israelis"...

If you think I'm incorrect, then tell me so. As far as "sick" is concernd, you need to quality your statement. What kind of a quack physician could you be to diagnose "sick". .
It is a perhaps telling tale about you when you have to lablel an oppinion that does not fit into your narrow, biased box "sick".

[shrike]

Quote by: bob60292 Sheild I'm neither a muslim nor a Palestinian; but I know that if the Israeli army, or any other foeiign army came into my state or country, claiming the right to take my ancestral home, killed my children, parents,siblings and/or friends for the crime of not giving it all up gracefully,.

Yous statement has nothing to do with real historical facts that actually happended.

real enemy is the ignorance

Yes you absolutely right.

[jose]

snip
IS IT TRUE that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered all European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their property in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that:
a) none of the deportees travel from Spain to Palestine; and
b) all the deportees be transported from Spain to the USA or British colonies, and there to remain; with entry visas to be arranged by the Jews living there; and
c) $1000.00 ransom for each family to be furnished by the Agency, payable upon the arrival of the family at the Spanish border at the rate of 1000 families daily

IS IT TRUE that the answer of the Zionist leaders was negative, with the following comments:
a) ONLY Palestine would be considered as a destination for the deportees.
b) The European Jews must accede to suffering and death greater in measure than the other nations, in order that the victorious allies agree to a "Jewish State" at the end of the war.
c) No ransom will be paid



Rabbi Michael Dov Weissmandl ZT"L
Dean of Nitra Yeshiva and author of min hametzar
Ten Questions to the Zionists

[shrike]

Quote by: JOSE IS IT TRUE that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered all European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their property in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that:

No Its not true.

IS IT TRUE that the answer of the Zionist leaders was negative, with the following comments:

Its not true either.
Though many Jews did flee to Spain becouse law of return and were saved by this.

[Atlas]

Quote by: bob60292 Sheild Both Jews and Palestinians have lived together in the region in a relatively peaceful and harmonious way before 1948.

True to some point, except in the violence of Arabs against Jewish settlements in 29', 36', and 47' witch escalated into the 1948' war

Quote by: bob60292 Both Christians and Jews have been duped into believing a disingenuous explanation for the the crimes against the native people of Palestine.

Both Jews and Christians have been duped into believing the ridiculous exaggerations of Israeli actions against Palestinian terrorists, I'm not saying injustice never happened and mistreatment never occurs but people often generalize them and take them out of their proportions, just like in your own case.

Quote by: bob60292 whose genetic link to the ancient Hebrews is itself dubious,

Definitely not for you to question even if there where any doubts about it.

Quote by: bob60292 claim the right to invite their own kind in from any country in the world, while they deny the right of its native inhabitants to return.

As any nation, the Arabs who chose to live equally in Israel after 48' have too the right to leave and return as they please, the ones who fled in 48' to Arab countries gave up the right to live there as citizens.

Quote by: bob60292 and gullability of all of us who fail to recognize the devious scheme for a beholden Anglo-American colony in Palestine.

I don't see any British and American flags in Israel except in their embassies, as there are no British or American authorities there, Israel had no military support from any of those countries in 48', in fact, the RAF was fighting against Israel alongside the Egyptians in that war, the American financial support it gets now is economically important but Israel could and would survive on its own without it.

Quote by: bob60292 God whose most profound desire is for us to show love for one another regardless of race, color or creed.

From Israels declaration of independence:

[/quote]it [Israel] will ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or sex; it will guarantee freedom of religion, conscience, language, education and culture; it will safeguard the Holy Places of all religions; and it will be faithful to the principles of the Charter of the United Nations.[/quote]

Guess your gods are the same...

Quote by: bob60292 If you think I'm incorrect, then tell me so. As far as "sick" is concerned, you need to quality your statement. What kind of a quack physician could you be to diagnose "sick". . It is a perhaps telling tale about you when you have to lablel an oppinion that does not fit into your narrow, biased box "sick".

I'm only going to explain this once, there is no systematic and calculated annihilation of Palestinians based on their ethnic status, as there is no forceful confinement of them to a few blocks in a city based on that, and if there were such plans, with all the mass destruction weapons Israel (and not only Israel) possesses all 3 million Palestinians would be dead in a couple of months.

As for "sick" in your case, I think "sick" is to accuse a nation witch has been through such atrocities as the holocaust in doing the same thing to another when the reality is far from it...

[bob60292]

Quote by: Atlas True to some point, except in the violence of Arabs against Jewish settlements in 29', 36', and 47' witch escalated into the 1948' war Both Jews and Christians have been duped into believing the ridiculous exaggerations of Israeli actions against Palestinian terrorists, I'm not saying injustice never happened and mistreatment never occurs but people often generalize them and take them out of their proportions, just like in your own case. Definitely not for you to question even if there where any doubts about it. As any nation, the Arabs who chose to live equally in Israel after 48' have too the right to leave and return as they please, the ones who fled in 48' to Arab countries gave up the right to live there as citizens. I don't see any British and American flags in Israel except in their embassies, as there are no British or American authorities there, Israel had no military support from any of those countries in 48', in fact, the RAF was fighting against Israel alongside the Egyptians in that war, the American financial support it gets now is economically important but Israel could and would survive on its own without it. From Israels declaration of independence:

it [Israel] will ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or sex; it will guarantee freedom of religion, conscience, language, education and culture; it will safeguard the Holy Places of all religions; and it will be faithful to the principles of the Charter of the United Nations.[/quote]

Guess your gods are the same...



I'm only going to explain this once, there is no systematic and calculated annihilation of Palestinians based on their ethnic status, as there is no forceful confinement of them to a few blocks in a city based on that, and if there were such plans, with all the mass destruction weapons Israel (and not only Israel) possesses all 3 million Palestinians would be dead in a couple of months.

As for "sick" in your case, I think "sick" is to accuse a nation witch has been through such atrocities as the holocaust in doing the same thing to another when the reality is far from it...[/quote]
Who are you trying to fool? and
Who do you think you are to tell me whether or not I should have the liberty to decide anything for myself. ( like genetic linkage to the ancient Hebrews, for example)
Noone, not even a biased individual like you might be, can really be foolish enough to believe that there would ever be an Israel today if it weren't for the billions of dollars and pounds of tax money that our governments confiscate from taxpayers to send to Israel.You'd be a fool to deny it; and I don't think you are. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know how a small nation like Israel gets the cash to defend itself against the whole Muslim world: not to mention the nuclear capability.
Also, according to your account of the Palestinian diaspora many Palestinians left out of their own free will. Why? Why? Why? Was Israeli kindness to them simply too overwhelming? Perhaps, for some strange reason, they were unhappy about being treated like second class citizens.
I happen to personally know Arab Americans who were thrown out of their homes before arriving in the U.S for no valid reason. The Israeli army came in. I am neither pro Israeli nor pro Arab. I am pro- fairness to all human beings, and extremely anti bullshit. I don't deny the right of Jews to live in Palestine, but I believe that the displaced Palestinians who are willing to seek a truly peaceful solution should have equal representation in the government as well as have a right to come and go when they please and where they please regardless of why they left. It is only reasonable that they have an emotional bond to what has been their ancestrial home for generations.There has been brutality and inhumanity on the part of both sides, but neither side should have the upper hand. There has to be a sharing, hand in hand.
And, with all due respect, if you think not agreeing with you is sick, you better get your own thoughts "examined." Maybe a dose of openmindedness would help.

[bob60292]

Quote by: bob60292 it [Israel] will ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or sex; it will guarantee freedom of religion, conscience, language, education and culture; it will safeguard the Holy Places of all religions; and it will be faithful to the principles of the Charter of the United Nations.

Guess your gods are the same...
I'm only going to explain this once, there is no systematic and calculated annihilation of Palestinians based on their ethnic status, as there is no forceful confinement of them to a few blocks in a city based on that, and if there were such plans, with all the mass destruction weapons Israel (and not only Israel) possesses all 3 million Palestinians would be dead in a couple of months.

As for "sick" in your case, I think "sick" is to accuse a nation witch has been through such atrocities as the holocaust in doing the same thing to another when the reality is far from it...[/quote]


_______________________________________________________________________
Who are you trying to fool? and
Who do you think you are to tell me whether or not I should have the liberty to decide anything for myself. ( like genetic linkage to the ancient Hebrews, for example)
Noone, not even a biased individual like you might be, can really be foolish enough to believe that there would ever be an Israel today if it weren't for the billions of dollars and pounds of tax money that our governments confiscate from taxpayers to send to Israel.You'd be a fool to deny it; and I don't think you are. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know how a small nation like Israel gets the cash to defend itself against the whole Muslim world: not to mention the nuclear capability.
Also, according to your account of the Palestinian diaspora many Palestinians left out of their own free will. Why? Why? Why? Was Israeli kindness to them simply too overwhelming? Perhaps, for some strange reason, they were unhappy about being treated like second class citizens.
I happen to personally know Arab Americans who were thrown out of their homes before arriving in the U.S for no valid reason. The Israeli army came in. I am neither pro Israeli nor pro Arab. I am pro- fairness to all human beings, and extremely anti bullshit. I don't deny the right of Jews to live in Palestine, but I believe that the displaced Palestinians who are willing to seek a truly peaceful solution should have equal representation in the government as well as have a right to come and go when they please and where they please regardless of why they left. It is only reasonable that they have an emotional bond to what has been their ancestrial home for generations.There has been brutality and inhumanity on the part of both sides, but neither side should have the upper hand. There has to be a sharing, hand in hand.
And, with all due respect, if you think not agreeing with you is sick, you better get your own thoughts "examined." Maybe a dose of openmindedness would help.[/quote]