1st Lt Guard Makes Radio Address

[Dieval]

Originally posted by Bob_Dobbs,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bob_Dobbs,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>do you deny that grave mismanagement cost us lives and stability, and is killing americans and iraqis and costing us billions every week?[/b]

Sure people are dieing, it's still a war zone..what mismanagement are you talking about? That we're not psychic and couldn't see the future correctly?

Originally posted by Bob_Dobbs,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bob_Dobbs,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> are you saying that truth and accountability end once all the votes are counted? sometimes it does feel like that, actually. if my boss made such greivous errors as bush did in iraq, i'd look for a new job.[/b]

No, I'm saying that they don't talk crap about their leader in a public forum.
<!--QuoteBegin-Bob_Dobbs,@

oh, i didn't know lives were at stake at the radio station. disobeying an order during combat is one thing. chatting about bush being a douchebag while you're under RPG attack is one thing. but this is entirely another.[/quote] Not respecting your commander and chief now will lead to you questioning orders on the battlefield...THAT'S where it costs lives..
<!--QuoteBegin-Bob_Dobbs,
shut your lies about the war. i only have time for the truth. you're a secret sophist and would hail a dictator if bush said it was necessary to eliminate terror.[/quote]
'shut my lies..."? I've only seen the lies coming from sources other than myself...

I just saw this punk on TV. What a whinning putz. I deployed many times to many different locales around the globe. Many of these deployments really SUCKED. There are always problems associated with moving thousands of troops and vehicles and equipment.
This little punk ass LT obviously has little experience in the military. To complain about equipment problems, difficulty associated with a WAR for Pete's sake. What did he expect a seaside vacation in a sandy resort? The middle East sucks, there's sand everywhere and the Biblical fly plague never ended. If this guy were in one of my old units, we would have beat the crap out of him for acting like this. Jeeze what an idiot. I can't believe some old Sergeant hasn't taken him out behind the wood shed and "taught him a lesson in life." Once again, what a whinning candy-asses punk LT. I hope the Army thows the book at him.

"Sure people are dieing, it's still a war zone..what mismanagement are you talking about? That we're not psychic and couldn't see the future correctly?"

it doesn't take a psychic to listen to advisors and fully plan a war. i am notifying you that bush lowballed the cost and troop committment of the iraq war so the public and the senate would submit to it. he worked up propaganda about saddam and 9/11 and WMD that was almost unfounded.

the current failures in iraq are the results of bush's thoughtless actions.

i expect more from a president than this vendetta-thirsting and mishandling of serious matters. i have to answer to the world for his foolishness.

[Dieval]

Originally posted by Bob_Dobbs,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bob_Dobbs,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>it doesn't take a psychic to listen to advisors and fully plan a war. i am notifying you that bush lowballed the cost and troop committment of the iraq war so the public and the senate would submit to it.[/b]

He wouldn't have to even CONSIDER such things if everyone worked together..

Originally posted by Bob_Dobbs,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bob_Dobbs,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>he worked up propaganda about saddam and 9/11 and WMD that was almost unfounded.[/b]

Only the left believes that Bush mentioned 9/11 and Saddam...now that doesn't mean there wasn't a link..that means that left believes there ISN'T a link...is that true? I've seen ar article that Saddam used a money launderer to transfer money to al-qaida...could he have funded 9/11? It's possible...probably not directly, but some of his money that found its way into al-qaida could have been used to fund it...only the left would TOTALLY rule out the possiblity that a terrorist supporter(Saddam) and a group of terrorists(al-qaida) could have nothing to do with each other...
Here's the story I mentioned..Iraq-al-qaida link...excerpts:

Originally posted by Article, According to the senior government official, Nada Management is part of the al-Taqwa group. In November 2001, President George W. Bush officially cited al-Taqwa as part of al-Qaida's money-laundering activities. The citation included the following: "Al-Taqwa is an association of offshore banks and financial-management firms that have helped al-Qaida shift money around the world." It is in al-Taqwa and Nada Management that the government investigator says he found the links to Saddam and Iraq. "Al-Taqwa was the recipient of illicit funds from Iraq's 'Oil for Food' program," the official tells Insight, and from there the financial resources went "through al-Taqwa to al-Qaida." Records show that Youssef M. Nada is, with Huber, a board member of Nada Management. An Egyptian expatriate, Nada is said by the government investigator to be central to the Iraq/al-Qaida connection and "a known associate of Saddam Hussein and Ayman al-Zawahiri," al-Qaida's second in command.

Hmmmm......make you think, doesn't it?

Originally posted by Bob_Dobbs, the current failures in iraq are the results of bush's thoughtless actions.

The current failures in Iraq are due partly to Kerry voting against the $87 billion after he voted for it...or how ever that goes...
<!--QuoteBegin-Bob_Dobbs,@

i expect more from a president than this vendetta-thirsting and mishandling of serious matters.[/quote]what vendetta? Iraq was in breech of the cease fire. The cease fire was what stopped the original gulf war. If you breech the terms of the cease fire we revert back to a state of war...where's the vendetta?
<!--QuoteBegin-Bob_Dobbs,
i have to answer to the world for his foolishness.[/quote]
YOU have to?

[Mr.Vicchio]

We need more war movies on how real war is like. Ya know, never goes as planned and bad things happen.

Could you imagine these same people in say 1944-45 screaming about the pacific campaign??

[Mia]

Originally posted by Impenitent, a sexual harrasment lawsuit is a personal matter...

A man lying about extramarital sex? OMG! I don't believe it!

Seriously, that WAS a matter of GRAVE concern to the American public. What's a war compared to a BJ?

I totally see your point.

[Mia]

Originally posted by Suburbanite,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Suburbanite,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Personally, I think a soldier should have more respect for his position, and I would dishonorably discharge him or whatever else was an option.  Of all the people, the Military and some others have a responsibility to the country, and turning their positions into political ones is not conducive to anything productive.[/b]

I agree. Civillians can say whatever they like. Soldiers and even the highest-level cabinet members can say what they like when they become civillians.

But there is no free speech at my job when it comes to criticising the president of the company.

Military people work for the President, period. And whether you agree with the war or not you don't criticise the Commander in Chief, whoever he may be, while you are in his employ.

Like him and his politics or don't, but don't undermine the position of the nation over it.

<!--QuoteBegin-Bob_Dobbs,
then why would you support a draft?
isn't discourse and planning key to winning a war? to changing tactics in a war you are losing? we need to know this kind of thing and soldiers offer the best 1st hand accoutns. if you are telling him to be silent then you are saying morale is more important than being right.[/quote]

Isn't it in certain conditions? At least temporarily?

There's a chain of command. A way to get this information to the people that need it right now. Break that and then this rule and then that, and pretty soon you give an order and the soldiers start arguing the merits and taking a poll before doing deciding whether to follow it.

Umm, did you people completely miss (ignore) the sections of the UCMJ posted showing that the Lieutenant can't be punished for the radio address? He didn't do anything wrong.

My artillery unit couldn't stand President Clinton. However, If he visited our unit we would have shown him every courtesy due a President.

...............

Vicchio,

Do some more studying before you start misapplying parts of the UCMJ. Odd that you posted a portion of the UCMJ that didn't apply to the Lieutenant and that you posted a portion of the Patriot Act while ignoring other parts.

Please do some solid research before posting again.

...........

Dieval,

Do you realize that you just lied?

"only the left would TOTALLY rule out the possiblity that a terrorist supporter(Saddam) and a group of terrorists(al-qaida) could have nothing to do with each other..."

Saddam was a secular leader hated as an infidel by bin Laden. Saddam's efforts were to crush such groups. The al-Qaida in Iraq were in the northern Kurdish portion.

[Mr.Vicchio]

He was still part of teh guard and is still subject to the UCMJ when he goes around claiming he is 1st Lt. So and So. Get YOUR facts right.

You CANNOT make a political statement and use your rank while doing so. Have a nice day.

[Zeebadee]

Geez, you just don't get it do you? He's NOT subject to the UCMJ when he's not on active duty!

[Impenitent]

Originally posted by Mia,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mia,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-Impenitent, a sexual harrasment lawsuit is a personal matter...

A man lying about extramarital sex? OMG! I don't believe it!

Seriously, that WAS a matter of GRAVE concern to the American public. What's a war compared to a BJ?

I totally see your point.[/b][/quote]

:rolleyes: of course you do... lying about extramarital sex in a sexual harrassment lawsuit

I hope you never have to sue or prosecute some man for sexual harrassment... according to you, he will be able to lie...

[dotcoma]

According to you it doesn't matter because God is Dead and stuff....

[Mr.Vicchio]

Originally posted by Zeebadee, Geez, you just don't get it do you? He's NOT subject to the UCMJ when he's not on active duty!

....

If you use your RANK say "I 1st Lt. SO and So think the president Sucks" in a public forum you bring yourself under the UCMJ.

Don't YOU get that?

[Mr.Vicchio]

It was a matter of character ya know. President lies under oath about sex, what else is he lying about?

[jcgadfly]

Originally posted by mia+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (mia)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> A man lying about extramarital sex?  OMG!  I don't believe it! Seriously, that WAS a matter of GRAVE concern to the American public.  What's a war compared to a BJ? I totally see your point.[/b]

<!--QuoteBegin-Impenitent,
[:rolleyes: of course you do... lying about extramarital sex in a sexual harrassment lawsuit

I hope you never have to sue or prosecute some man for sexual harrassment... according to you, he will be able to lie...[/quote]

And I hope you never have to be pressured to lie about sexual harassment because powerful people want to "get" a popular person.

[dotcoma]

Clinton is an evil man and lets not forget that. He's got just as much blood on his hands as Bush. They got got with what they could pin on him. End of story. If they could have gotten him for overlooking cocaine being smuggled into Mena. AR, they would have done so.

[jcgadfly]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, It was a matter of character ya know. President lies under oath about sex, what else is he lying about?

Democratic President lies about sex w/o dead soldiers = Evil

Republican President lies about war w/700+ dead soldiers = Headed for sainthood

It's a matter of character.

If Bush is ever impeached, it wil be a case of an evil bastard being hauled before other evil bastards on the charge of being an evil bastard.

He'll probably get a medal.

[Dieval]

Originally posted by StoneWT, Dieval, Do you realize that you just lied? "only the left would TOTALLY rule out the possiblity that a terrorist supporter(Saddam) and a group of terrorists(al-qaida) could have nothing to do with each other..." Saddam was a secular leader hated as an infidel by bin Laden. Saddam's efforts were to crush such groups. The al-Qaida in Iraq were in the northern Kurdish portion.

And you were aware of ALL of Saddam's actions and dealings and you know everything thing he's ever done? I think our leaders & Military might want to talk to you, if that's the case...

[dotcoma]

Originally posted by Dieval,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Dieval,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-StoneWT, Dieval, Do you realize that you just lied? "only the left would TOTALLY rule out the possiblity that a terrorist supporter(Saddam) and a group of terrorists(al-qaida) could have nothing to do with each other..." Saddam was a secular leader hated as an infidel by bin Laden. Saddam's efforts were to crush such groups. The al-Qaida in Iraq were in the northern Kurdish portion.

And you were aware of ALL of Saddam's actions and dealings and you know everything thing he's ever done? I think our leaders & Military might want to talk to you, if that's the case...[/b][/quote]

HA, the guy is not bringing up smokey conspiracy theories here. There is NO link between Saddam and Osama. To assume that there is without a shred of evidence (and please don't bring up the Atta meeting in Prague, it's been debunked a million times. Atta was in Venice, FL at the time) is rather pathetic...

[Dieval]

Originally posted by roxdog, HA, the guy is not bringing up smokey conspiracy theories here. There is NO link between Saddam and Osama. To assume that there is without a shred of evidence (and please don't bring up the Atta meeting in Prague, it's been debunked a million times. Atta was in Venice, FL at the time) is rather pathetic...

Again, you can prove that there's absolutely NO link how? Sure you can bring up the old "but he's a secular leader...blah blah blah"....he's a terrorist supporter.. it's as simple as that..and to even think that he wouldn't be involved is just plain foolish...
I posted an article, see an earlier post in this thread, showing that he was funneling money to al-quaida through a money launderer....