Colin Powell: good intentions?

[Clarence]

I have a feeling Powell was against Bush to some degree for the last part of his tenure as SoS. As for the rest of the Republicans, they need to be re-elected and Bush doesn't.

I agree. Did he know he was lying at the U.N.? was he lying? you know, with the amtrax?

[Zeebadee]

amtrax??

[underbear1]

better at nearly 3000 dead, than NEVER?

[Clarence]

that's right! amtrax cracka!!

When the anthrax attacks occured, people around the banquet kitchen kept talking about amtrax. Apperently they'd never heard of anthrax. Kick ass band.

Colin P. duped or liar?

[underbear1]

I think Powell is someone who decided to serve Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld his REVENGE cold. I also believe he cares about both his reputation and the reputation of America, but if he could also stick a shiv into the three I named earlier, (at an inoppurtune time, say 7 weeks before an election).............he'd do it with a SMILE!

[Clarence]

What does he want revenge for?

[underbear1]

For making him look like a FOOL in front of the entire WORLD when they sent him to the UN with those BOGUS pictures of the "KNOWN CHEMICAL & BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS MOBILE LABS"

[Rainbow]

Quote by: Clarence I agree. Did he know he was lying at the U.N.? was he lying?

Maybe he was not telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth :-)

[Clarence]

Quote by: Rainbow Maybe he was not telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth :-)

that just seems likely. So, do we forgive him since he's taking on the bad guys?

[underbear1]

We give him a second chance to redeem his dignity, but we haven't forgotten or forgiven his part in lying to promote the Iraq War.

[JohnMK]

Are you sure he lied? "Lie" implies specific intent to deceive. When you're paranoid, anything looks like a mobile chemical weapons truck. I think Bush's administration are/were a mixture of 3 parts paranoid, and perhaps 1 part liar goading the paranoid on further. Perhaps Powell was lied to. Do you have reason to believe he lied, in turn? I will acknowledge that my intuition tells me he was less than convinced of either the facts or the philosophy behind invading Iraq -- but I think it was something he wrestled with and heed and hawed over, unsure even in his own mind.

[Clarence]

If I remember correctly, in the leadup there was talk of Colin being opposed to the invasion of Iraq. Yet he did go before the un with a vial and did not publicly voice his concerns over the issue when we had a chance to change our minds but wisdom was hard to find. What made him be silent?

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: JohnMK Are you sure he lied? "Lie" implies specific intent to deceive.

Yes, I'm quite sure he lied, and knew exactly what he was doing.

"The illustration of the set of three vehicles that purportedly portrayed Iraq's mobile BW production vehicles and which first appeared in US Secretary of State Powell's address to the United Nations in February 2003 and then in the CIA/DIA-released report on May 28, 2003, were produced by graphic artists working at Battelle under a CIA contract.

Contrary to the prevalent assumptions, the illustrations apparently were not made following any detailed descriptions provided by the Iraqi informant codenamed "Curveball," but rather on the basis of specifications made by CIA staff and its contractor as to the equipment that such a vehicle or set of vehicles would require. It does not appear that the original purpose of the CIA contracted drawings was for use in Sec. Powell's UN presentation, but that they later were used for that purpose as well." Further Information Regarding US Government Attribution of a Mobile Biological Production Capacity by Iraq

While it's possible that Powell didn't know of the origins of what he was presenting to the UN, I seriously doubt that anyone would do such a thing without verification or checking to see where his info was coming from. He must have known. I used to be a big fan of Powell's, but he has absolutely no credibility left.

[bishop]

there's a lot of documented evidence now that powell highly questioned the validity of the "intelligence" the CIA and DIA were giving him - yet he agreed to parrot those lies to the world regardless of making sure if he was telling the truth.

if it isn't lying, it's some horribly gross negligence. especially from someone like powell, whom had great respect amongst most americans.

[grandpa]

Quote by: bishop there's a lot of documented evidence now that powell highly questioned the validity of the "intelligence" the CIA and DIA were giving him - yet he agreed to parrot those lies to the world regardless of making sure if he was telling the truth. if it isn't lying, it's some horribly gross negligence.

To most people, ideology is unfortunately more important than fact.
There were no words coming from Powell at teh time indicating he doubted his "data."

But we're not alone. There are countless truth-fearing nations out there.

Grandpa h.

[Clarence]

Colins gonna be in the news for the next few months. I'm waiting for the neo-cons to start thrashing him. In todays headlines

WP: Powell explains break with Bush - washingtonpost.com Highlights - MSNBC.com

If you just look at how we are perceived in the world and the kind of criticism we have taken over Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib and renditions," Powell said in an interview, "whether we believe it or not, people are now starting to question whether we're following our own high standards. snip "Suppose North Korea or somebody else wants to redefine or 'clarify' " Geneva Conventions provisions prohibiting "outrages against personal dignity" and "humiliating and degrading treatment" of prisoners, he said. Powell's opposition marks a rare public breach with the administration he left 20 months ago. As secretary of state, he repeatedly clashed privately with Vice President Cheney and others who had more hard-line foreign policy views. But since leaving office he has declined nearly all opportunities to publicly criticize even those policies he opposed internally. Powell has said he regrets that the Iraq invasion was launched on the basis of false intelligence about Saddam Hussein's weapons programs and Hussein's relationship with al-Qaeda, information that he vouched for in an address before a hostile United Nations. He has also said that he believes the administration should have sent more troops to invade Iraq and provided a better postwar plan. Powell also allowed his name to be identified among those opposed to Bush's nomination of his former State Department subordinate, John R. Bolton, as Washington's U.N. ambassador. But he has reserved his strongest opposition for administration efforts to preserve controversial methods for interrogating terrorism suspects, techniques that others have defined as torture. While it is not clear exactly what techniques the White House wishes to keep, sources have said those previously used include nakedness, prolonged sensory assault and deprivation, the imposition of "stress" positions, and water submersion to the verge of drowning. Bush has said none of those amounts to torture. Al-Qaeda, Taliban prisoners Powell strenuously objected to Bush's February 2002 decision that the United States was not obliged to adhere to Geneva Conventions rules in its treatment of captured al-Qaeda and Taliban prisoners. Subsequent scandals over military treatment of prisoners at the U.S. facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and at Abu Ghraib in Iraq, and over the CIA's establishment of secret prisons abroad, further cemented his views that the decision was unnecessary in terms of prisoner interrogation and is harmful to the armed forces. Last fall, over administration opposition, Powell publicly supported McCain's successful effort to ensure that restrictions in the Army Field Manual outlawing torture be adopted as the definitive guidance for military treatment of detainees. His position owed as much to his 35 years as an Army officer as to his tenure as the nation's chief diplomat. The current dispute is over how the provisions of Common Article 3 of the 1949 Geneva Conventions against inhumane and degrading treatment bind the CIA and other non-military interrogators. The administration has argued that the article is too vague and ties the CIA's hands in extracting crucial information from terrorists. Last week, Powell joined dozens of other retired military officers and former government officials in objecting to proposed administration legislation "clarifying" the article to ensure that certain unspecified interrogation methods can continue. snip Bush aides said they appreciated that Powell did not make the matter personal or engage in cutting rhetoric. But the White House did not hesitate to push back strongly, even at the risk of further alienating Powell. White House spokesman Tony Snow said last Thursday that Powell was "confused" about the administration's proposal. The president followed up the next day with a stern reaction at a Rose Garden news conference, when he reinterpreted Powell's position to suggest that the former secretary of state was equating U.S. tactics to those of terrorists

...

Powell declined yesterday to address Bush's comments. "To say that we want to modify, clarify or redefine Common Article 3, which has not been modified for the 57 years of its history, I think adds to the doubt" about U.S. morality, he said. "Plus I believe that the legitimate concerns that the administration has can be dealt with in other ways." Yesterday, another prominent Republican weighed in. In a statement released by his office in California, former secretary of state George P. Shultz said he believes that a compromise can be reached that "leaves the Geneva Convention alone and achieves the specificity that the administration wants." Meanwhile, former president Jimmy Carter, a leading voice on human rights, said yesterday that he is "filled with admiration" for McCain, Powell and others who have joined in opposition. The Bush administration, Carter told Reuters, has "redefined torture to make it convenient for them," adding: "Things that are . . . globally assumed to be torture they claim . . . [are] not torture."

well that just makes me feel all mushy inside. People from both sides of the fence coming together to strike down the evilman Bush. Even little Jimmy Carter is in. Call me a cynic, looks like power is consolidating furthur right before our eyes. I love how McCain and Powell act like they haven't facilitated this madness. But hey, anything to stop Bush. McCain has been Bush's lapdog and Powell apperently knowingly lied to the american public to go to war as opposed to breaking with the administration. Another thing...both republicans. 2008 baybee!!

[macnpat]

Powell was under a mandate as a good soldier to follow orders. I am certain that if he had been asked to lie for the good of his country and he agreed it was best, he would do it. At the same time, if Powell's lie was only for his superiors political gain and was not in the best interest of the Constitution, Powell would have disobeyed that order.

That is how good soldiers think.

[nm420]

Need everyone be reminded that Colin Powell was one of the few signing members of PNAC? The media tries to portray this neocon as a moderate, but he plays the game as well as any of our Washington despots. Do a little song and dance, create a little conflict in the trenches of the Republican party, slink into the shadows for a while only to pop up a few years later in another position holding great sway over public opinion. No one but himself can say for sure what his intentions truly are, but I would be hard-pressed to take anything any of our politicians say at face-value. But, even if he has deluded himself into believing his actions are good, I can only laugh when one chooses to run with a pack of wolves and subsequently gets attacked. He was smart enough to know that some evil is afoot amongst his former peers; his complicity is enough to condemn him, IMO.

[Sonart]

.

Quote by: nm420 Need everyone be reminded that Colin Powell was one of the few signing members of PNAC?

He was??? Where? Not here. Or here. Or here. Or here.

Care to back this up?

.

[lsbskins1]

Sonart -

You beat me to that challenge. Powell was not a PNAC guy.