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Young · Apr 27, 2004, 08:42 pm

If Cheney is off duck hunting with one of the Justices, would'nt this be a flawed system to start with? Why should Cheney's Energy meeting minutes be off-limits? Why does Cheney get to hold Bush's hand in private not under oath? Clinton did it over question involving a personal matter. If the minutes are de-classified and horrible things are found, maybe then the brainwashed right will awake from their slumber and understand that this Administration is Horrible!

Young

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 09:11 pm

Uhm... Seperation of powers.

Talk about a biased, freaking thread.

OMG Cheney went duck hunting and Scalia was there too!!!

How about we talk Ruth Bater Ginsberg. Former Legal council with the ACLU. Should she recuse herself from EVERY case that the ACLU brings forth?

http://reference.allrefer.com/encyclopedia...GinsbrgRJB.html

But NOO we gotta smear the Bush adminstration as some sort of evil entity with friviolus posts... fine lets go at it.

Justice Ginsberg recuses herself from EACH and EVERY case the ACLU brings forth, then Scalia can do the same with anything involving Cheney

Apr 27, 2004, 09:19 pm

Really. Come on Young you can do better than this. Your original post is nothing but unsubstantiate hyperbole.
wouldn't this be...
why does...
If the...

How is anyone supposed to respond to what you've said.
Well maybe...
Well because...
It might...

You are asking hypothetical questions that can only result in hypothetical responses.
This is no way to start a thread. Find some serious matter to start a dialogue with.

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 09:54 pm

Cheney is piece of shit. We don't need to point out the most obvious conflicts of interests to know that. And the Ginsburg/ACLU conflict is not the same situation (for the record I think the ACLU is worthless).

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 10:04 pm

Of COURSE her sitting on teh supreme court isn't a problem hearing cases brought by the ACLU, but Cheny is a POS who went duck huniting and Scalia was there too...

Okay whatever.

I love that line of debate. Cheney is a Peice of Shit. Very intelligent. Seriously.

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 10:27 pm

No bid contracts to him and his cronies? Just calling it like I see it...

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 10:42 pm

His cronies... I see. Lets see, VP was head of the most sucessful oil company in America, Prez looks at him and askes him to run with that ball because of his expertize in teh field... thus Cheny is "enriching" his cronies by default?

Is that your basicc arguement?

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 10:57 pm

By GINA HOLLAND

(AP) Thomas Fitton, left, President of Judicial Watch, speaks in front of the Supreme Court as Judicial...
Full Image

WASHINGTON (AP) - The Supreme Court appeared troubled Tuesday by the prospect of letting the public have a look into private White House policy meetings, a hopeful sign for the Bush administration's aggressive defense of secrecy in the case of Vice President Dick Cheney's energy task force.

The court is the latest stop in a nearly three-year fight over access to records of the task force that prepared a national energy strategy. The president put Cheney, a former energy industry executive, in charge and the group's recommendations were friendly to industries. Most stalled in Congress.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040428/D.../D827FH080.html

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 11:05 pm

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 11:08 pm

And??

AND???

AND?????

And nothing.

OMG OMG Ken Lay tried ot get Bush's attnention to soemthing that would hamper his bnusiness! OMG thats SOOO wrong! 1000000000000 times a year government officials get this daily and do act on such at times, but OGM OMG BUSH OIL ENRON!!! OMG OMG OMG!

Bush let Enron collapse because they were corrupted, but Bush acted in thier interest here cause he was buddy buddy... riiiiiight.

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 11:11 pm

You're right. Bush and Ken are obviously not very close and there is no corruption at the highest levels. History shows us that our almighty leaders never do anything wrong. Chances are you never saw these before. Figures...They don't really mean anything anyway.

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 11:15 pm

They mean waht man?

Seriously?

I mean this, I have one simple question for you.

How is government supposed to work if the leadership of the government cannot in anyway shape fashion or form, interact with the private sector.

YOu see corruption at the highest levles, because Bush worked oil, cheney worked oil, and omg enron. Automatically you assume corruption.

What policies put forth by the Bush Cheney team would be consideered Corruption? Unduly friendly to Enron or other oil business? What did they do? Hmm?

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 11:26 pm

Interact with the private sector? The two are MERGING for Christ's sake.

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 11:33 pm

Proof of this? As if this is something new?

Now you could argue for seperation of the two, more of a wall, perhaps open dealings of government officials with private sector interests, now THAT I could understand and support. But to assume blanketly that EVERY dealing of govenrment officials with private intersts is corrupt, corruptive and wrong.. I cannot accept that.

One must have some article of faith in government or government becomes powerless leading to anarchy.

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 11:37 pm

I never said "all". But look at companies like RAND and Wackenhut. Ex-military starting gigantic corporations that are making record profits from our newly polarized police state. All these guys are connected at the Federal level. Look at Carlyle. All those f#ckers are making millions in the "war on terror". It's disgusting.

Mr.Vicchio · Apr 27, 2004, 11:40 pm

Are they making money because they saw an oppurtunity to make money? Or because they made the oppurtunity come about.

I think they are just taking advantage of the situation. Its called capitalism.

dotcoma · Apr 27, 2004, 11:47 pm

I see it as CRONY capitalism: Socalism for the rich and slavery for the poor.

harumscarum · Apr 28, 2004, 12:13 am

I guess to the original point of the thread I don’t see it being a problem. I do think it was stupid for Cheney to go hunting with him but they are both professionals. I don’t think that Judge would have gotten where he did by being corrupt or shady. The reason I say it is stupid is that whatever that judge decides there will always be a conspiracy cloud hanging over the decision. I guess that will make for some good reading. :)

I am not a big lawyer buff but lets say I have to go to court and it turns out that the Judge and I were hunting buddies....would they prosecuting attorney be able to do anything to get a new judge?

Apr 27, 2004, 08:42 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
Young Hot Lava Location: western NC Posts: 1,088	If Cheney is off duck hunting with one of the Justices, would'nt this be a flawed system to start with? Why should Cheney's Energy meeting minutes be off-limits? Why does Cheney get to hold Bush's hand in private not under oath? Clinton did it over question involving a personal matter. If the minutes are de-classified and horrible things are found, maybe then the brainwashed right will awake from their slumber and understand that this Administration is Horrible! Young Young I guess all we've got Left......are these darned "Internets"

Apr 27, 2004, 09:11 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	Uhm... Seperation of powers. Talk about a biased, freaking thread. OMG Cheney went duck hunting and Scalia was there too!!! How about we talk Ruth Bater Ginsberg. Former Legal council with the ACLU. Should she recuse herself from EVERY case that the ACLU brings forth? http://reference.allrefer.com/encyclopedia...GinsbrgRJB.html But NOO we gotta smear the Bush adminstration as some sort of evil entity with friviolus posts... fine lets go at it. Justice Ginsberg recuses herself from EACH and EVERY case the ACLU brings forth, then Scalia can do the same with anything involving Cheney Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 10:04 pm	#5 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	Of COURSE her sitting on teh supreme court isn't a problem hearing cases brought by the ACLU, but Cheny is a POS who went duck huniting and Scalia was there too... Okay whatever. I love that line of debate. Cheney is a Peice of Shit. Very intelligent. Seriously. Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 10:42 pm	#7 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	His cronies... I see. Lets see, VP was head of the most sucessful oil company in America, Prez looks at him and askes him to run with that ball because of his expertize in teh field... thus Cheny is "enriching" his cronies by default? Is that your basicc arguement? Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 10:57 pm	#8 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	By GINA HOLLAND (AP) Thomas Fitton, left, President of Judicial Watch, speaks in front of the Supreme Court as Judicial... Full Image WASHINGTON (AP) - The Supreme Court appeared troubled Tuesday by the prospect of letting the public have a look into private White House policy meetings, a hopeful sign for the Bush administration's aggressive defense of secrecy in the case of Vice President Dick Cheney's energy task force. The court is the latest stop in a nearly three-year fight over access to records of the task force that prepared a national energy strategy. The president put Cheney, a former energy industry executive, in charge and the group's recommendations were friendly to industries. Most stalled in Congress. http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040428/D.../D827FH080.html Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 09:19 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
dave654 Guest Posts: n/a	Really. Come on Young you can do better than this. Your original post is nothing but unsubstantiate hyperbole. wouldn't this be... why does... If the... How is anyone supposed to respond to what you've said. Well maybe... Well because... It might... You are asking hypothetical questions that can only result in hypothetical responses. This is no way to start a thread. Find some serious matter to start a dialogue with.

Apr 27, 2004, 09:54 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154	Cheney is piece of shit. We don't need to point out the most obvious conflicts of interests to know that. And the Ginsburg/ACLU conflict is not the same situation (for the record I think the ACLU is worthless).

Apr 27, 2004, 10:27 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154	No bid contracts to him and his cronies? Just calling it like I see it...

Apr 27, 2004, 11:05 pm	#9 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154

Apr 27, 2004, 11:08 pm	#10 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	And?? AND??? AND????? And nothing. OMG OMG Ken Lay tried ot get Bush's attnention to soemthing that would hamper his bnusiness! OMG thats SOOO wrong! 1000000000000 times a year government officials get this daily and do act on such at times, but OGM OMG BUSH OIL ENRON!!! OMG OMG OMG! Bush let Enron collapse because they were corrupted, but Bush acted in thier interest here cause he was buddy buddy... riiiiiight. Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 11:11 pm	#11 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154	You're right. Bush and Ken are obviously not very close and there is no corruption at the highest levels. History shows us that our almighty leaders never do anything wrong. Chances are you never saw these before. Figures...They don't really mean anything anyway.

Apr 27, 2004, 11:15 pm	#12 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	They mean waht man? Seriously? I mean this, I have one simple question for you. How is government supposed to work if the leadership of the government cannot in anyway shape fashion or form, interact with the private sector. YOu see corruption at the highest levles, because Bush worked oil, cheney worked oil, and omg enron. Automatically you assume corruption. What policies put forth by the Bush Cheney team would be consideered Corruption? Unduly friendly to Enron or other oil business? What did they do? Hmm? Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 11:26 pm	#13 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154	Interact with the private sector? The two are MERGING for Christ's sake.

Apr 27, 2004, 11:33 pm	#14 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	Proof of this? As if this is something new? Now you could argue for seperation of the two, more of a wall, perhaps open dealings of government officials with private sector interests, now THAT I could understand and support. But to assume blanketly that EVERY dealing of govenrment officials with private intersts is corrupt, corruptive and wrong.. I cannot accept that. One must have some article of faith in government or government becomes powerless leading to anarchy. Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 11:37 pm	#15 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154	I never said "all". But look at companies like RAND and Wackenhut. Ex-military starting gigantic corporations that are making record profits from our newly polarized police state. All these guys are connected at the Federal level. Look at Carlyle. All those f#ckers are making millions in the "war on terror". It's disgusting.

Apr 27, 2004, 11:40 pm	#16 (permalink) (top)
Mr.Vicchio Navy Veteran Location: Texas Posts: 6,031	Are they making money because they saw an oppurtunity to make money? Or because they made the oppurtunity come about. I think they are just taking advantage of the situation. Its called capitalism. Einstein's "Theory of Relativity" is still being challenged to this day, but by consensus Global Warming is a fact... that's REAL science at work, why didn't Albert just go that route?

Apr 27, 2004, 11:47 pm	#17 (permalink) (top)
dotcoma Volcanic Erupter Posts: 3,154	I see it as CRONY capitalism: Socalism for the rich and slavery for the poor.

Apr 28, 2004, 12:13 am	#18 (permalink) (top)
harumscarum Igneous Magma Posts: 183	I guess to the original point of the thread I don’t see it being a problem. I do think it was stupid for Cheney to go hunting with him but they are both professionals. I don’t think that Judge would have gotten where he did by being corrupt or shady. The reason I say it is stupid is that whatever that judge decides there will always be a conspiracy cloud hanging over the decision. I guess that will make for some good reading. :) I am not a big lawyer buff but lets say I have to go to court and it turns out that the Judge and I were hunting buddies....would they prosecuting attorney be able to do anything to get a new judge? under construction....