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zynner · Jul 15, 2006, 08:18 pm

Heard about this poll on the radio today.

Did you vote for George Bush in 2004?
49% said yes.

Would you vote for George Bush today?
34% said yes.

Did you vote for John Kerry in 2004?
35% said yes.

Would you vote for John Kerry today?
23% said yes.

Did you vote "other" in 2004?
5% said yes.

Would you vote "other" today?
32% said yes.

Interesting. Maybe the R's and D's will finally f*ck things up so badly that the people will demand an end to the R/D conspiracy to lock out third parties.

On a related note: I make my living by trading in the stock market. The US (and worldwide) markets have begun selling off into a bear market the past several weeks -- the financial press won't call it a bear market yet, but they never do until it's too late. The market is an excellent forcaster of the economy. What this means to me is that the economy will be showing signs of weakness right around the time of the November elections. I think the D's will pick up much more power in Congress and among the governorships than anyone currently expects. I'm not exactly rooting for it, but I do prefer gridlock over what we have now. And we could have a constitutional showdown between a D-controlled Congress vs. a R in the White House who seems to have lost his mind when it comes to constitutional government.

~ zynner

Osborn F Enready · Jul 16, 2006, 02:14 pm

Interesting post, and perspective.

I would agree that in current times, the market is a great forecaster of the corruption about to play on the official record for all to hear in the news.

I don't think any elections will matter after 2008, if either major party gets back in. I see the endgame scenario being played out between 2008 and 2012, and so far the U.S. U.N. and all Security Council members are playing that hand.

I sure am glad I have party favors well in advance of the party. Something tells me that the markets will be loaded. (pardon the pun)

zynner · Jul 16, 2006, 05:23 pm

Hey Osborn,

Good to see you're still around.

Check this out: According to a Canadian reporter, the Bilderbergs had a meeting in Ottawa recently and the newcomer invitees were Hillary Clinton and George Pataki. Look for them to be the two Demopublican candidates in 2008.

~ zynner

Sonart · Jul 16, 2006, 06:35 pm

.

Quote:

Quote by: zynner

Interesting. Maybe the R's and D's will finally f*ck things up so badly that the people will demand an end to the R/D conspiracy to lock out third parties.

I wouldn't count on it. I suspect that "other" referred to some other mainstream candidate, not some other party. Other than Joe Lieberman's desperate efforts to run, I don't see any whiff of third party interest.

.

Milton Bradley · Jul 17, 2006, 10:52 am

Quote:

Quote by: Sonart

.

I wouldn't count on it. I suspect that "other" referred to some other mainstream candidate, not some other party. Other than Joe Lieberman's desperate efforts to run, I don't see any whiff of third party interest.

.

Try watching the C-SPAN call in shows. There are a significant number of people out there that seem to be waking up to the tyranny of their own government.

Osborn F Enready · Jul 17, 2006, 11:47 am

Sonart, I don't know where you are from, or who you talk to, but all I heard over my 6000+ mile trip was how the overwhelming majority are fed up with both major parties.

I almost fell over laughing in Pismo Beach, California. I was sitting on the patio outside the Coin-Op laundry waiting for my clothes to wash, smoking a cigarette and I couldn't help but overhear a conversation taking place between 3 local residents.

They were trading comments on Al Gore's film about global warming, with mixed takes on whether or not any of it was true. They argued amongst each other over this for about 20 minutes. After that, they moved on to talking about the war, and politics in this country in general. ALL, all of them said they were disgusted with their political parties.

I took that time to introduce myself, say I was from Ohio, and ask them if they have ever heard of the Libertarian party as I apologized for not being able to ignore their private conversation.

One of them had heard of the party, but not read or seen anything from them. I gave them the website for the National Libertarian Party, and the Free State Project, and then I gave them a very brief summation of the party saying simply "they stand for all of our rights, all of the time".

They listened for a minute to what I had to say, and I had to check on my laundry, so I left them on a high note saying that the overwhelming number of people I have talked to, support any third party over their major parties based on previous experience and what their support has won them.

They all smiled and chuckled, while making a comment about the "new police state" that seemed obvious on the horizon.

3 more people made aware of the Libs, that didn't know a thing about them before, and in Kalifornia no less, and they not only appreciated what I had to say, but agreed.

I made a point to talk about politics at least once with one person, in each place we stayed. I only found 3 die hard supporters of either party, at least that would admit they were.

I see big political change coming, and if not, I see angry masses of people refusing to sit down much longer without representation.

Neither party represents a MAJORITY of people anymore, and if it wasn't for the "wasted vote" theory pushed by both parties, and the media, we would see that clearly on election day. (assuming we still count ballots, or give a damn about them anymore.)

Osborn F Enready · Jul 17, 2006, 11:47 am

Quote:

Zynner said:
Hey Osborn,

Good to see you're still around.

Check this out: According to a Canadian reporter, the Bilderbergs had a meeting in Ottawa recently and the newcomer invitees were Hillary Clinton and George Pataki. Look for them to be the two Demopublican candidates in 2008.

I say:
Thanks for the welcome back, and the heads up.

Krazyjuice · Jul 17, 2006, 11:18 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Osborn F Enready

Quote:

Zynner said:
Hey Osborn,

Good to see you're still around.

Check this out: According to a Canadian reporter, the Bilderbergs had a meeting in Ottawa recently and the newcomer invitees were Hillary Clinton and George Pataki. Look for them to be the two Demopublican candidates in 2008.

I say:
Thanks for the welcome back, and the heads up.

I'm a registered dem and I seriously doubt the democratic candidate will come from new york. Especially not hillary. I liked bill, but hillary seems like a psychotic soccer mom during her speeches.

GodBlessAmerica · Jul 18, 2006, 12:11 am

People don't usually vote for third parties in large numbers because most of the time their third party candidates seem to need a padded room and they scare people.

A big example of a big protest voting mistake was Ross Perot who totally took votes from George Bush #1 to give you Bill Clinton with maybe only 44% of the vote. That means 56% did NOT want Clinton in who voted.

I think third party candidates are the only hope for Democrats winning in 2008. They most certainly screwed Gore in 2000 with Ralph Nader, but that benefited the USA in the end since Gore was an empty suit that would probably have surrendered a long time ago to terrorism.

In times of dissatisfaction, most normal folks that want to file a protest vote decide to throw away their vote on a third party. A third party won't ever win President in our lifetimes IMO.

Conservatives who fell for protest voting have been learning their lesson and NOT voting third party again. It was like being hit in the head by a brick for them when they found that throwing away your vote to a third party was like passive enabling of Democrats.
Lord knows Republicans aren't by any measure perfect these days, but conservatives know either a Republican or Democrat will win and a Republican these days is a much better choice than the typical fire breathing leftist/socialist/progressive/communist/liberal Democrat.

Jul 15, 2006, 08:18 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
zynner Hot Lava Posts: 817	Third Party Politics Heard about this poll on the radio today. Did you vote for George Bush in 2004? 49% said yes. Would you vote for George Bush today? 34% said yes. Did you vote for John Kerry in 2004? 35% said yes. Would you vote for John Kerry today? 23% said yes. Did you vote "other" in 2004? 5% said yes. Would you vote "other" today? 32% said yes. Interesting. Maybe the R's and D's will finally f*ck things up so badly that the people will demand an end to the R/D conspiracy to lock out third parties. On a related note: I make my living by trading in the stock market. The US (and worldwide) markets have begun selling off into a bear market the past several weeks -- the financial press won't call it a bear market yet, but they never do until it's too late. The market is an excellent forcaster of the economy. What this means to me is that the economy will be showing signs of weakness right around the time of the November elections. I think the D's will pick up much more power in Congress and among the governorships than anyone currently expects. I'm not exactly rooting for it, but I do prefer gridlock over what we have now. And we could have a constitutional showdown between a D-controlled Congress vs. a R in the White House who seems to have lost his mind when it comes to constitutional government. ~ zynner

Jul 16, 2006, 02:14 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
Osborn F Enready Principled Observer Location: Toledo, Ohio Posts: 13,873	Interesting post, and perspective. I would agree that in current times, the market is a great forecaster of the corruption about to play on the official record for all to hear in the news. I don't think any elections will matter after 2008, if either major party gets back in. I see the endgame scenario being played out between 2008 and 2012, and so far the U.S. U.N. and all Security Council members are playing that hand. I sure am glad I have party favors well in advance of the party. Something tells me that the markets will be loaded. (pardon the pun) Petition of Redress of Grievances: http://www.givemeliberty.org/default.htm Canadian Lawsuit Against Their National Banks: http://www.freewebs.com/classaction/ Osborn F. Enready

Jul 17, 2006, 11:47 am	#6 (permalink) (top)
Osborn F Enready Principled Observer Location: Toledo, Ohio Posts: 13,873	Sonart, I don't know where you are from, or who you talk to, but all I heard over my 6000+ mile trip was how the overwhelming majority are fed up with both major parties. I almost fell over laughing in Pismo Beach, California. I was sitting on the patio outside the Coin-Op laundry waiting for my clothes to wash, smoking a cigarette and I couldn't help but overhear a conversation taking place between 3 local residents. They were trading comments on Al Gore's film about global warming, with mixed takes on whether or not any of it was true. They argued amongst each other over this for about 20 minutes. After that, they moved on to talking about the war, and politics in this country in general. ALL, all of them said they were disgusted with their political parties. I took that time to introduce myself, say I was from Ohio, and ask them if they have ever heard of the Libertarian party as I apologized for not being able to ignore their private conversation. One of them had heard of the party, but not read or seen anything from them. I gave them the website for the National Libertarian Party, and the Free State Project, and then I gave them a very brief summation of the party saying simply "they stand for all of our rights, all of the time". They listened for a minute to what I had to say, and I had to check on my laundry, so I left them on a high note saying that the overwhelming number of people I have talked to, support any third party over their major parties based on previous experience and what their support has won them. They all smiled and chuckled, while making a comment about the "new police state" that seemed obvious on the horizon. 3 more people made aware of the Libs, that didn't know a thing about them before, and in Kalifornia no less, and they not only appreciated what I had to say, but agreed. I made a point to talk about politics at least once with one person, in each place we stayed. I only found 3 die hard supporters of either party, at least that would admit they were. I see big political change coming, and if not, I see angry masses of people refusing to sit down much longer without representation. Neither party represents a MAJORITY of people anymore, and if it wasn't for the "wasted vote" theory pushed by both parties, and the media, we would see that clearly on election day. (assuming we still count ballots, or give a damn about them anymore.) Petition of Redress of Grievances: http://www.givemeliberty.org/default.htm Canadian Lawsuit Against Their National Banks: http://www.freewebs.com/classaction/ Osborn F. Enready

Jul 16, 2006, 05:23 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
zynner Hot Lava Posts: 817	Hey Osborn, Good to see you're still around. Check this out: According to a Canadian reporter, the Bilderbergs had a meeting in Ottawa recently and the newcomer invitees were Hillary Clinton and George Pataki. Look for them to be the two Demopublican candidates in 2008. ~ zynner

Jul 18, 2006, 12:11 am	#9 (permalink) (top)
GodBlessAmerica Look Stuff Up Posts: 810	People don't usually vote for third parties in large numbers because most of the time their third party candidates seem to need a padded room and they scare people. A big example of a big protest voting mistake was Ross Perot who totally took votes from George Bush #1 to give you Bill Clinton with maybe only 44% of the vote. That means 56% did NOT want Clinton in who voted. I think third party candidates are the only hope for Democrats winning in 2008. They most certainly screwed Gore in 2000 with Ralph Nader, but that benefited the USA in the end since Gore was an empty suit that would probably have surrendered a long time ago to terrorism. In times of dissatisfaction, most normal folks that want to file a protest vote decide to throw away their vote on a third party. A third party won't ever win President in our lifetimes IMO. Conservatives who fell for protest voting have been learning their lesson and NOT voting third party again. It was like being hit in the head by a brick for them when they found that throwing away your vote to a third party was like passive enabling of Democrats. Lord knows Republicans aren't by any measure perfect these days, but conservatives know either a Republican or Democrat will win and a Republican these days is a much better choice than the typical fire breathing leftist/socialist/progressive/communist/liberal Democrat.