Human Rights Council rebukes Israel

[jose]

A Palestinian boy, badly wounded in an apparent missile strike, is treated at Shifa Hospital in Gaza City, Saturday, July 8, 2006. An artillery shell exploded in a house on the outskirts of Gaza City, killing a 6-year-old girl and two others, hospital officials said. The Israeli military, backtracking on its previous denial of responsibility, said an airstrike in the area targeting a group of militants did not hit an open field, as it previously reported, but struck a street on the outskirts of Gaza City. It said it was checking reports of civilian casualties. (AP Photo/Laura Leon)

[ise]

shrike #15 ise It is not legitimate to cut off 750,000 people from electricity. Never happended. People still get their electricity ftom Israel.

Congratulations on learning to use the quotes format between the 29th and 30th June.

Unfortunately you got it WRONG. These quotes that you attribute to me are NOT mine!!! ALL of #4 is the work of Israel's renowned brilliant journalist GIDEON LEVY, as I acknowledge clearly in the article.

GIDEON LEVY of the Israeli daily Ha’aretz is an artist at the crafts of reportage and commentary. Prolific yet deeply thoughtful and fair, Levy delivers his subjects whole and unfiltered on the page, speaking from the heart in their own voices. His analysis is honest, insightful, and often devastating in its indictment of Israel’s occupation.

As to your

Never happended .People still get their electricity ftom Israel

Where have you been!!! You may have no TV or newspapers, but you do have Volconvo - with all its shortcomings.

jose 07-01-06, 07:56 pm #21 Israel army launches Gaza assault Gaza power plant hit by Israeli airstrike is insured by US agency

and

jose #23 Israel army launches Gaza assault it was planned the Justice Ministry said Thursday. The detention of Hamas parliamentarians in the early hours of Thursday morning had been planned several weeks ago and received approval from Mazuz on Wednesday. The same day, Shin Bet Director Yuval Diskin presented Prime Minister Ehud Olmert with the list of Hamas officials slated for detention. http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/732528.html

Gideon Levy * It is not legitimate to cut off 750,000 people from electricity. * It is not legitimate to call on 20,000 people to run from their homes and turn their towns into ghost towns. * It is not legitimate to penetrate Syria's airspace. * It is not legitimate to kidnap half a government and a quarter of a parliament. A state that takes such steps is no longer distinguishable from a terror organization.

You contested each of the points, in your own way, but not "A state that takes such steps is no longer distinguishable from a terror organization" Can I take it as reasonable to understand, as G Levy suggests, that the state is Israel. Acceptance of this would solve the Middle East problem over night!!!

As for the rest. Well most I could not fathom.

shrike #15 Its totally legitimate to arrest members of terrorist organization like Hamas. Also in War other party have full to target government officials of other side. Israeli forces have assassinated dozens of Palestinians over the years

Ise sorry for killed terrorist he would probably cry out loud if Bin laden would be assassinated.

Wrong again girl. I'm female too. I know that you have being hiding your sex from us for some reason, but it's clear to see. My proper name is Isabel.

shrike #15 Well no wonder that ise associate himself with this kind of countries the best democracies in the world.

Needs translation, but I do know that I'm from a genuine democracy and there are not many.
.

[shrike]

Israel simply ignores its obligations whenever it feels like it. I can only conclude that it desires non-stop warfare as a means of consolidating its colonization of the West Bank. It will live to regret this indulgence

You know the obligations and agreements have two sides. The Palestinians are completely ignoring their obligations and constantly targeting civilians Israel is not but it has no other option to protect itself against constants aggression by Palestinians.
If you city was under constant bombardment wouldn't you ask you government to do something about it?

[Nono]

No, shrike. Those obligations are non-reciprocal (which you'd understand if you knew anything about the law).

If you've read my posts on the subject, you'll know I'm no knee-jerk defender of the Palestinians or a constant critic of the Israelis. But this is too much.

The Israelis have been repeatedly guilty of collective punishment, a clear breach of the Geneva Conventions.

So come clean, shrike. What you're saying is that the Israelis can do whatever the hell they want with their mighty military machine whenever they want to, unless every last Palestinian is steadfastly blameless (for how long? ten years running? twenty?)

That's what you're saying.

[shrike]

Congratulations on learning to use the quotes format between the 29th and 30th June. Unfortunately you got it WRONG. These quotes that you attribute to me are NOT mine!!! ALL of #4 is the work of Israel's renowned brilliant journalist GIDEON LEVY, as I acknowledge clearly in the article.

If you quote someone you usually should use the quote function. I will disregard the ad hom.
Gedeon Levi is known for his fringe leftist views no wonder that you use his fringe views to prove you point.

Where have you been!!! You may have no TV or newspapers, but you do have Volconvo - with all its shortcomings

The fact is that Gaza people still get their electricity and water from Israel.

Wrong again girl. I'm female too. I know that you have being hiding your sex from us for some reason, but it's clear to see. My proper name is Isabel.

I have nothing with argument that I presented you just post yours red herrings to evade it.
Btw I posted my picture in the forum if you want you can search for it. I have nothing to hide.

Needs translation, but I do know that I'm from a genuine democracy and there are not many

Isn't you state are catholic theocracy. Were abortion forbidden by law?
Anyway it seems that you siding with countries that don't give a damn about human rights like Apeman proved.

[shrike]

Quote by: Nono So come clean, shrike. What you're saying is that the Israelis can do whatever the hell they want with their mighty military machine whenever they want to, unless every last Palestinian is steadfastly blameless (for how long? ten years running? twenty?)

I think that no nation can do whatever it likes. Israel have no other option but to protect its citizens .I know it's hard for the Gaza people there but it's hard for Sderot people too. There is no easy solution's if you so smart what would you except Israeli government to react on constant attacks of Palestinian terrorists?

[jose]

Quote by: shrike You know the obligations and agreements have two sides. The Palestinians are completely ignoring their obligations and constantly targeting civilians Israel is not but it has no other option to protect itself against constants aggression by Palestinians. If you city was under constant bombardment wouldn't you ask you government to do something about it?

its not ALL the Palestinians, and that's the point Israel attacks the population as a whole which is a war crime, which even if you don´t know (and i think you probably do, if you have served in the IDF) your Generals do that's why they can´t visit Europe for fear of being Arrested
quote
Israel general 'avoids UK arrest'

The warrant relates to the bulldozing of more than 50 houses
The former head of Israeli forces in the Gaza Strip has told how he dodged arrest on war crimes charges after receiving a tip-off at Heathrow.
Major General Doron Almog is accused of breaching international laws during Israel's occupation of the Gaza Strip.

He said he had flown straight home after the Israeli military attache had warned him not to leave his El Al jet.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4237620.stm
quote
Britain mulls war crimes charges against Israeli soldiers
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/conte...6/s1654375.htm

Israel's Crimes Against Humanity against Palestinians

But I want to focus for a moment on Israel's "crime against humanity" against the Palestinian People -- as determined by the U.N. Human Rights Commission itself, set up pursuant to the requirements of the United Nations Charter. What is a "crime against humanity"? This concept goes all the way back to the Nuremberg Charter of 1945 for the trial of the major Nazi war criminals. And in the Nuremberg Charter of 1945, drafted by the United States Government, there was created and inserted a new type of international crime specifically intended to deal with the Nazi persecution of the Jewish People.

The paradigmatic example of a "crime against humanity" is what Hitler and the Nazis did to the Jewish People. This is where the concept of crime against humanity came from. And this is what the U.N. Human Rights Commission determined that Israel is currently doing to the Palestinian People: Crimes against humanity. Legally, just like what Hitler and the Nazis did to the Jews.
http://www.mediamonitors.net/francis7.html
now do you begin to see how much of the world is seeing this aggression?

[Nono]

Israel have no other option but to protect its citizens

No, shrike. What Israel is doing, of course, is subjecting its citizens to violence without end. That's the opposite of protection.

As usual, the whackos on both sides are each other's closest allies.

[ise]

A black flag by Gideon Levy * It is not legitimate to cut off 750,000 people from electricity. * It is not legitimate to call on 20,000 people to run from their homes and turn their towns into ghost towns. * It is not legitimate to penetrate Syria's airspace. * It is not legitimate to kidnap half a government and a quarter of a parliament. A state that takes such steps is no longer distinguishable from a terror organization.

Again you fail to contest the latter sentence. So do you agree that Israel is no longer distinguishable from a terror organization. I would not have gone that far myself, but if the cap fits.

shrike #25 Gedeon Levi is known for his fringe leftist views no wonder that you use his fringe views to prove you point.

I'm sure this made sense when you conceived it but I'm at a loss. And...

shrike #25 I have nothing with argument that I presented you just post yours red herrings to evade it

What on earth?? Girl, get control of yourself. Please put a little more effort into your posts. It gets worse.

shrike #25 Isn't you state are catholic theocracy. Were abortion forbidden by law?

Are you trying to insult my country, ...badly?

I never mix religion and politics, mainly because I do not believe in one. I most certainly believe in the dignity of human beings and in human rights, just like most of my fellow country men and women. I certainly believe in all men (and women) being created equal.

Bedouin ask UN to help fight systemic discrimination in Israel

shrike, have you a reply to...

[ise]

Quote by: Scribbler1 It doesn't look like censorship, at least not by the government. Those links weren't blocked as much as they seemed to have been redirected to the W3C page. It's not worth the government's time to do this, especially when there is such a huge mass of OTHER negative info out there that remains untouched. It's possible it was a glitch in the system, a bad URL or something else. But I really don't think it was a government (US or Israel) action to redirect those links. Or possibly the server Volconvo uses has blocked something, although that's unlikely as they are just links.

My mistake. I was putting the http:/ in twice. Thanks for your help.

[CENTER]=======[/CENTER]

Fri, 07/07/2006 - 19:46.
The following paid advertisement was signed by 300 Jews in Britain and placed in The London Times on July 7:

Jews in Britain protest Israel's Gaza aggression WHAT IS ISRAEL DOING? A CALL BY JEWS IN BRITAIN WE WATCH WITH HORROR the collective punishment of the people of Gaza. Everything reasonable must be done to secure Corporal Gilad Shalit’s safe release but nothing Israel is doing contributes to that aim. Instead, it is using its enormously superior military might to terrorise an entire people. DESTRUCTION OF THE FRAGILE Gaza infrastructure will not release Shalit. Bombing power stations and cutting off fuel supplies deprives people of electricity, refrigeration, pumped drinking water and sewage disposal services. It holds hostage hospital patients on life support systems, or undergoing dialysis. It brings the threat of epidemics and starvation. AS GIDEON LEVY WROTE in the Israeli daily Ha’aretz, this is “not only pointless, but … blatantly illegitimate”. Gilad Shalit has become a pawn in the Israeli government’s ongoing battle to topple the democratically-elected government of the Palestinians. PRESENTING THIS AS AN ISOLATED hostage-taking incident ignores Israel’s regular snatching of Palestinians from their homes.Thousands are held in ‘administrative detention’ without trial, women and children amongst them. A doctor and his brother – civilians – were kidnapped from their home in Al Shouka, near Rafah, the day before Corporal Shalit was captured. Like him, they need to be returned to their families in the established practice of prisoner exchange. And all elected MPs, punitively imprisoned by Israel in recent days, must be immediately released. FOR THE US AND ITS ALLIES merely to call for “restraint” is desperately inadequate – and evidently ineffective. This is a situation that requires determined action by the international community. SUPPORT THOSE ISRAELIS protesting against their government’s destructive actions. WRITE TO YOUR MP to demand that the British Government act to achieve an immediate ceasefire. WRITE TO THE ISRAELI EMBASSY. Make them understand their actions are wrong, their explanations unconvincing.

Jews for Justice for Palestinians

[shrike]

Quote by: Nono No, shrike. What Israel is doing, of course, is subjecting its citizens to violence without end. That's the opposite of protection. As usual, the whackos on both sides are each other's closest allies.

Again i am asking you what would you except Israeli government to do when Israeli citizens are asking for protection from their government? The diplomatic option doesn't exist because PA don't control all the groups also most important factor that Hamas wont recognize Israel. So only military option is available right now.

[shrike]

Quote by: jose its not ALL the Palestinians, and that's the point Israel attacks the population as a whole which is a war crime, which even if you don´t know (and i think you probably do, if you have served in the IDF) your Generals do that's why they can´t visit Europe for fear of being Arrested

Its just a speculation and hot air with nothing substantial.From your article

But former legal adviser to the Israeli Foreign Ministry Robbie Sable said it was unlikely Maj Gen Almog would have been arrested. "Courts in organised countries do not act on malicious litigation and this was definitely malicious litigation," he added. The Israeli Foreign Ministry said it was taking the incident seriously and seeking clarification from British authorities. Officials at the British Embassy in Tel Aviv refused to comment.

Israel doesn't use collective punishment.

[shrike]

Quote by: ise Again you fail to contest the latter sentence. So do you agree that Israel is no longer distinguishable from a terror organization. I would not have gone that far myself, but if the cap fits.

If the four statements aren't true as I proved so the conclusion based on this statements is not true either I think it should be clear.

Quote by: ise I'm sure this made sense when you conceived it but I'm at a loss. And...

Ok I repeat it for you Gedeon Levy is an extrimst and his worldview are disorted.

Quote by: ise Quote by: Shrike Its totally legitimate to arrest members of terrorist organization like Hamas. Also in War other party have full to target government officials of other side. Israeli forces have assassinated dozens of Palestinians over the years Ise sorry for killed terrorist he would probably cry out loud if Bin laden would be assassinated. Wrong again girl. I'm female too. I know that you have being hiding your sex from us for some reason, but it's clear to see. My proper name is Isabel.

I am still awaiting real answer on my arguments not some nonsense abour your gender I don't care about it.

Bedouin ask UN to help fight systemic discrimination in Israel

I never claimed that Israel is perfect country. Israel have definitely to improve and I am sure that in every country at least one group can claim discrimination. It's nothing special.

shrike, have you a reply to...

I already replied to this .You just repeated you faulty argument again.
I am still waiting you answer for this
Israel vs Palestine - history, media coverage, viewpoints - everything. Discuss.

[Trotsky]

Quote by: shrike Its just a speculation and hot air with nothing substantial.From your article Israel doesn't use collective punishment.

What do you call what is currently happening?? I'd call it collective punishment.

I think you will also find that according to the BBC, over 50% of Gaza is still without ANY electricity and over 30,000 homes no longer have running water.
I'm all for Israel arresting and trying (and executing if found guilty) those responsible for terrorist actions or the direction of terrorist organisations. However indescriminate assassination attempts and military incursions do nowt but fuel Hamas and it's ilk. But what would I know.

[Scribbler1]

I have to say I haven't trusted Israel since the Jonathan Pollard spying incident. However, I see where Shrike is coming from. To be honest none of us can understand how she feels, living under the threat of death coming from anyplace at any time (No 9/11 references, please. I mean the CONSTANT fear of being blown to bits anywhere you go.). I don't agree with her but I think if I lived in Israel I might feel as she does. I know I'd be walking around with an ulcer, that's for sure.

[rmnunez]

The fact that this special meeting was in GENEVA (in Switzerland) may be important and a sign of things to come!

I doubt it, Geneva was where its predecessor organization, the UN High Commisiioner for Human Rights, was headquartered, if they held their meeting someplace else it could be significant.

If governmetns like Iran, Lybia and even Cuba, are still heavy-hitters in the reformed UN Human Rights body I doubt much of any consequence will emanate therefrom.

[ise]

shrike #33 isi #29 Bedouin ask UN to help fight systemic discrimination in Israel I never claimed that Israel is perfect country. Israel have definitely to improve and I am sure that in every country at least one group can claim discrimination. It's nothing special.

Very good reply. Why can you not be as upfront like this normally. Yes, Israel is FAR from being a perfect country. How about...

Arabs out!
(07.06.06, 14:00)
or
Who started? They are also "breaking the rules" laid down by Israel
Mon., July 10, 2006 Tamuz 14, 5766
or
Israel bars Palestinian Americans for first time since 1967
Last update - 00:20 11/07/2006
or
Jewish Tribalism Comes Clean

In a recent skirmish with leading members of the American Jewish activist community, the prize-winning Israeli novelist A B Yehoshua claimed that secular Jewish identity was meaningless outside Israel. Upsetting his audience in Washington, he argued that Jewishness in the Diaspora was impermanent: if China ever became the world’s foremost superpower, he warned, American Jews would migrate there to assimilate rather than in the US. “For me there is no alternative … I cannot keep my identity outside Israel. Israeli is my skin, not my jacket. You [Jews in the Diaspora] are changing jackets … you are changing countries like changing jackets,” he told the leaders of the American Jewish Committee. Delegates called his comments “impertinent,” “foolish,” “tasteless,” and “impolite.”

...and there's more.

shrike ise ...shrike, have you a reply to... I already replied to this .

Sorry shrike, it's just not there. Have another go. I'll come back on
http://www.volconvo.com/forums/show...4&postcount=286 if needed.

[GodBlessAmerica]

The Human Rights Council is usually chaired by countries that violate human rights the worst.

I doubt Israel will pay much attention to dictators and theologists telling them they should go back and get blown up again.

If the Palis want to stop all this, give the one soldier back. It's their choice!

[shrike]

Quote by: ise Arabs out! (07.06.06, 14:00) or Who started? They are also "breaking the rules" laid down by Israel Mon., July 10, 2006 Tamuz 14, 5766 or Israel bars Palestinian Americans for first time since 1967 Last update - 00:20 11/07/2006 or Jewish Tribalism Comes Clean

Don't you get tired to post extremists from left and right? I am sure that they exist in every country .But it doesn't prove anything about the stat just that we have variety of opinions and Israel is true democracy.

Quote by: ise Sorry shrike, it's just not there. Have another go. I'll come back on http://www.volconvo.com/forums/show...4&postcount=286 if needed.

You link isn't working.

[shrike]

Quote by: Trotsky What do you call what is currently happening?? I'd call it collective punishment. I think you will also find that according to the BBC, over 50% of Gaza is still without ANY electricity and over 30,000 homes no longer have running water. I'm all for Israel arresting and trying (and executing if found guilty) those responsible for terrorist actions or the direction of terrorist organisations. However indescriminate assassination attempts and military incursions do nowt but fuel Hamas and it's ilk. But what would I know.

I like to see the source of this numbers.I am sure that BBC has take it from somewhere.
Thanks