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casual timmy · Mar 4, 2006, 06:10 am

I appologize that i'm only dealing with Christianity with this thread, simply because I do not know what other religions have to say on the subject.

I've always been puzzled by the fact that in biblical times, God and Jesus, on countless occasions performed such blatant miracles that anyone who witnessed them would believe in the creator or at least bow down in respect.

These " blatant miracles " , as I like to call them, pretty much stop when the Bible ends.

Can anybody explain why feeding 5000 thousand starving people with minimal fish and bread, and other miracles such as these, which are sorely needed in today's day and age, no longer happen?

A rational mind would come to the conclusion that the blatant miracles were in fact, made up. Why would a God, so eager earlier on in his hay day, flex his muscles without even blinking, and now, radically decides to stop these types of miracles and make his believers run on blind faith?

This thread is not intended to mock Christianity. I am simply looking for other view points.

LetThereBe · Mar 4, 2006, 10:29 am

Well, though I doubt any of you would give any credibility to this, and I myself doubt, I have heard of many miracles occuring today. In my church missionaries have reported healings, raising of the dead, exorcisms and the like.

Also, even were all those miracles true I would not expect to see any today as great as those performed by Jesus. The magnitude of those miracles were signs that He was the Christ.

FFT · Mar 4, 2006, 05:30 pm

There are still people that insist Elvis is alive, and/or that he never did drugs. A little bit of exaggeration over time is not unexpected for these "miracles." They could well have been little more than parlor tricks to begin with.

Plasma Snake[D] · Mar 4, 2006, 05:34 pm

Or maybe the faith of people that want someone to come along and rescue them.

IndieC · Mar 4, 2006, 07:00 pm

Well, on the subject of modern miracles i have a perfect example. I met someone at my Church who was healed only a few months ago. She had strayed from God, and had been in a wheelchair for the past 15 or so years. Her son, who's about 15, had never seen her walk. She was waiting for a double hip replacement, and, as you might know, with the NHS any kind of major but non-emergency operation takes ages to actually happen.

A few months ago, she went on a weekend with some people looking to become Christians, or strengthen their faith. She admitted hating the very idea, but being dragged along by her husband. He prayed for her one evening, and almost immediately fell on the floor and sobbed for about an hour. No exagerrations here! The next morning, his wife, who had left the meeting early and gone to bed before the incident (from what i gather) found that she could actually walk. I heard about it when her husband and son came up to describe what had happened in Church that evening, which happened to be Sunday. She came up and descibed what had happened a few weeks later, and it really was incredible to actually see her walking on her own two feet. None of the doctors she had been seeing could explain it. It was absolutely impossible, couldn't have happened medically speaking, and yet it did. I can see but one explanation: God working in her. She has, incidentally, started actually coming to Church since then, and is now a really passionate Christian.

IndieC · Mar 4, 2006, 07:06 pm

Sorry... one more comment: The reason miracles are recorded in the New Testament in particular is to illustrate the fact that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, or God in other words, and that he had the power to do what no-one but God could do. The miracles only seem to stop at the end of the Bible because the Bible stops then, and there is no real need to continue recording their happening since the point has already been made. More miracles than just those recorded in the Bible actually happened at the time, as John states at the start of his gospel, and since the last book of the Bible was written we have still seen miracles. I, so far, have heard of two (the one above, and one which involved a friend's brother), and considering the very small amount of people I actually know (only a few hundred out of the 6 or so Billion people on the planet), I can say that it's quite impressive a figure already!

**Jack** · Mar 4, 2006, 11:04 pm

Quote:

church missionaries have reported healings, raising of the dead...

Wow, that must have made the news or been reported by an outside agency. Could you provide links?

IndieC · Mar 7, 2006, 08:23 pm

I haven't heard of that, but there we are... i don't personally think that anyone but Jesus could raise people from the dead, but i could be proven wrong... (Jesus was God, so God is included in that statement)

Mar 4, 2006, 06:10 am	#1 (permalink) (top)
casual timmy up in your gut Location: austin texas Posts: 37	Christianity and Miracles I appologize that i'm only dealing with Christianity with this thread, simply because I do not know what other religions have to say on the subject. I've always been puzzled by the fact that in biblical times, God and Jesus, on countless occasions performed such blatant miracles that anyone who witnessed them would believe in the creator or at least bow down in respect. These " blatant miracles " , as I like to call them, pretty much stop when the Bible ends. Can anybody explain why feeding 5000 thousand starving people with minimal fish and bread, and other miracles such as these, which are sorely needed in today's day and age, no longer happen? A rational mind would come to the conclusion that the blatant miracles were in fact, made up. Why would a God, so eager earlier on in his hay day, flex his muscles without even blinking, and now, radically decides to stop these types of miracles and make his believers run on blind faith? This thread is not intended to mock Christianity. I am simply looking for other view points.

Mar 4, 2006, 10:29 am	#2 (permalink) (top)
LetThereBe Always Seeking Location: Ohio Posts: 720	Well, though I doubt any of you would give any credibility to this, and I myself doubt, I have heard of many miracles occuring today. In my church missionaries have reported healings, raising of the dead, exorcisms and the like. Also, even were all those miracles true I would not expect to see any today as great as those performed by Jesus. The magnitude of those miracles were signs that He was the Christ. It is just.

Mar 4, 2006, 07:00 pm	#5 (permalink) (top)
IndieC Igneous Magma Location: UK Posts: 303	Well, on the subject of modern miracles i have a perfect example. I met someone at my Church who was healed only a few months ago. She had strayed from God, and had been in a wheelchair for the past 15 or so years. Her son, who's about 15, had never seen her walk. She was waiting for a double hip replacement, and, as you might know, with the NHS any kind of major but non-emergency operation takes ages to actually happen. A few months ago, she went on a weekend with some people looking to become Christians, or strengthen their faith. She admitted hating the very idea, but being dragged along by her husband. He prayed for her one evening, and almost immediately fell on the floor and sobbed for about an hour. No exagerrations here! The next morning, his wife, who had left the meeting early and gone to bed before the incident (from what i gather) found that she could actually walk. I heard about it when her husband and son came up to describe what had happened in Church that evening, which happened to be Sunday. She came up and descibed what had happened a few weeks later, and it really was incredible to actually see her walking on her own two feet. None of the doctors she had been seeing could explain it. It was absolutely impossible, couldn't have happened medically speaking, and yet it did. I can see but one explanation: God working in her. She has, incidentally, started actually coming to Church since then, and is now a really passionate Christian. "Never before in the history of warfare had destruction been so indiscriminate and universal" - makes you think of Hiroshima... -H.G. Wells, The War of the Worlds

Mar 4, 2006, 07:06 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
IndieC Igneous Magma Location: UK Posts: 303	Sorry... one more comment: The reason miracles are recorded in the New Testament in particular is to illustrate the fact that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, or God in other words, and that he had the power to do what no-one but God could do. The miracles only seem to stop at the end of the Bible because the Bible stops then, and there is no real need to continue recording their happening since the point has already been made. More miracles than just those recorded in the Bible actually happened at the time, as John states at the start of his gospel, and since the last book of the Bible was written we have still seen miracles. I, so far, have heard of two (the one above, and one which involved a friend's brother), and considering the very small amount of people I actually know (only a few hundred out of the 6 or so Billion people on the planet), I can say that it's quite impressive a figure already! "Never before in the history of warfare had destruction been so indiscriminate and universal" - makes you think of Hiroshima... -H.G. Wells, The War of the Worlds

Mar 7, 2006, 08:23 pm	#8 (permalink) (top)
IndieC Igneous Magma Location: UK Posts: 303	I haven't heard of that, but there we are... i don't personally think that anyone but Jesus could raise people from the dead, but i could be proven wrong... (Jesus was God, so God is included in that statement) "Never before in the history of warfare had destruction been so indiscriminate and universal" - makes you think of Hiroshima... -H.G. Wells, The War of the Worlds

Mar 4, 2006, 05:30 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
FFT Sedimentary Rock Posts: 10	There are still people that insist Elvis is alive, and/or that he never did drugs. A little bit of exaggeration over time is not unexpected for these "miracles." They could well have been little more than parlor tricks to begin with.

Mar 4, 2006, 05:34 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
Plasma Snake[D] Cause for Concern Location: Planet Earth Posts: 664	Or maybe the faith of people that want someone to come along and rescue them.