Investigation of a crop circle.

[Technosoul]

Some crop circles can be found to be man made, while others are more difficult to explain.

Are some of them made by aliens? Or are they all just the pranks of some collage kids or people who have nothing better to do all night?

Here is a link page to one investigation of one location where Crop Circles were found.

http://www.crystalinks.com/cropnj.html

What do you think?

[Gorgo]

http://www.skepdic.com/cropcirc.html

[PatrickHenry]

http://www.volconvo.com/forums/index.php?s...%20circles&st=0
I already shot my wad on this one Technosoul. They are beautiful, they are mysterious. Some ARE frauds, but some anomalies are unexplainable by anything save advanced technology. To what purpose? I dunno, but don't get the "fear-monger" in me riled up...

[Technosoul]

Sorry I missed that debate Patrick.

I think perhaps the one mentioned in my post might have been a fake. But some of the photos I've seen of other crop circles were amazing and seemed to be too artistic for someone to create just by stomping around in the weeds.

Humans have the habit of looking down when we move around, and so if something wanted to leave a message then the logical place would be on the ground in a field, instead of in the sky.

It is possible that some of them could have been created by some kind of energy event in Nature that we are not fully aware of yet. (like a whirwind side effect or simular motion).

Some would think that perhaps a alien space craft landed there and left the marks, or they might have left a sign for other UFOs to see when they fly over that area?

I would not interpet them as being scary - if they do contain a secret message for humans it would be a positive one.

They appear to be intelligent designs - human or otherwise, but a snowflake would have the same kind of design and so they could also be natual.

Anyway I guess everyone can review the link you provided for your original debate and make up their minds.

Technosoul.

[Starboy]

The so called experts cannot detect a known fake. Why should anyone listen to them at all?

Crop Circle Confession - Scientific American

The most ludicrous assertion was that "experts" could distinguish "genuine" circles from "hoaxed" ones. Even after one such expert, G. Terence Meaden, asserted on camera that a circle was genuine when in fact its construction had been filmed by Britain's Channel Four, the program let him off the hook by saying he might just have made a mistake this time. I soon met other crop-circle makers, such as Robin W. Allen of the University of Southampton and Jim Schnabel, author of Round in Circles, who also found it all too easy to fool the self-appointed experts but all too hard to dent the gullibility of reporters. When Bower and Chorley confessed, they were denounced on television as frauds. My own newspaper articles were dismissed as "government disinformation," and it was hinted that I was in the U.K. intelligence agency, MI5, which was flattering (and false). The whole episode taught me two important lessons. First, treat all experts with skepticism and look out for their vested interests--many cerealogists made a pot of money from writing books and leading weeklong tours of crop circles, some costing more than $2,000 a person. Second, never underestimate the gullibility of the media. Even the Wall Street Journal published articles that failed to take the man-made explanation seriously.

Starboy

[Sonart]

Some crop circles can be found to be man made, while others are more difficult to explain

Complete and utter nonsense, proof that people believe what they want to believe. When Doug Bower and Dave Chorley finally admitted that they had been making crop circle designs in England since 1978, where the phenomena started, people refused to believe them. So they took the press out one night and under stop action photography, produced a magnificent crop circle design in 6 hours.

Yet people STILL refuse to believe that people create these phenomena.

--"While many designs are clearly and admittedly made by people (even veteran crop circle researcher Colin Andrew estimates that up to 80 percent of them are probably manmade), some researchers insist that many formations are not - in fact, cannot be - made by humans."--

Crop Circle Confession Scientific American , August 2002

--"But to my astonishment, throughout the early 1990s the media continued to report that it was impossible that all crop circles could be man-made. They cited "cerealogists"--those who study crop circles--and never checked for themselves. There were said to be too many circles to be the work of a few "hoaxers" (but this assumed that each circle took many hours to make), or that circles appeared in well-watched crops (simply not true), or that circle creation was accompanied by unearthly noises (when these sounds were played back, even I recognized the nocturnal song of the grasshopper warbler). "--

So you folks go ahead and believe what you want to believe. Personally, I think Leprechauns did it.

[Technosoul]

I would agree that Leprechauns did it, those are the little green people who live in the forest, right?

Well, we had reports of little green men in flying saucers during the 1950s and so perhaps the tiny forest green folks evolved their technology ahead of us and now have UFOs to fly around in. Hmmm?

[PatrickHenry]

Too many atheists and professional skeptics on this board. I'm leavin'.

[Nono]

Ah, stick around Pat. I'm too skeptical to be a convinced atheist. :)

[Technosoul]

Yeah Patrick, don't go. Next time I post here on this chain of messages I will state the spiritual meaning for the yet unexplained crop circles.

I am a little tiired tonight to give it proper wording.

I was just kidding around about the little green men, but not totally because that image has re-surfaced in human history over and over, from tree people, the elf, the pixie, and most currently the little green men in flying saucers. Not even renouned researchers of the human phychic are really sure why this keeps happening. Somehow it contains a message that people can witness but cannot explain. None the less those images, the angels, the spirit guides, the so-called imaginary friend of a innocent child, are part of the human phycic - which is a known fact as depicted by art down through the ages, and in some cases to the astonishment of a rare real life experience.

Even if crop circles were a man-made prank that does not explain why they are important to many people who believe that those circles contain some more profound meaning. because if fact they do. Not because of thier paranormal potential, but because they trigger a long forgotten memory within the historical mind that we have receaved from those who came before us, for our brain is the sum-total of millions of years of pass-me-down experiences and generations are within it.

So watch for my next posting.

Technosoul.

[Technosoul]

First - a link page that looks at crop circles as science would.

http://www.ufoevidence.org/topics/CropCircles.htm

Now for my theory.

In the days of the anicents people would never say the name of the Great Spirit out loud, to do so would be concidered not showing respect, for hallowed is it's name.

However a symbol was used for the name of the Great Spirit (God/dess) which was a circle.

The circle represented the No-Thingness out of which everything proceded in the birthing of the beginning. And as well, because the line of the circle goes around and around, it represented the eternal nature of the Great Spirit of life.

That name (the symbol) was written everywhere in creation as the signature of the Most High Mind. The sun, moon, and earth are circles, we see circles within he rings of a tree, in the shape of a sunflower, in a drop of water, in the patterns of a human face, the egg, and I could make a big long list but if you look around you can do that your self.

If you draw the shape of a square or a triangle, poke a hole in the center and then spin that shape, the spinning motion will create a circular shape with it's other edges.

And so it is that the circle is also represent in the circular pattern of nature and most human activity. Around and around it goes.

Example: you have a seed in the soil, it grows to become a tree with limbs that produce seeds that fall to the soil to repeat that circular pattern. The "name" is thus everyplace and all things are in the name of the Great Sprirt of life.

I could sit here for hours giving many examples and additional information ( I once wrote a 15 page report about this topic).

And so that is also the message behind the Crop Circles, at least those that were not man made (they have been around for about 25 years now). People used (and mostly still do) think that the anients worshipped the sun because of the design of things like the Mayan Calendar, but in fact it was the understanding about the circle symbol that was the main focus of those more original belief systems.

Even if you look down upon a turtle from dirctly above you would see a circle, that has designs simular to some of the crop circles. This is universal and everywhere, in the orbits of the planet, the the circular system of our blood, in the turning of the seasons, and even relative to many man-made inventions that are based on the idea of a wheel, such as the face of a wind-up clock, a wagon or car, etc.

And so those crop circles are saying "pay attention to the Circle, and comprehend also the circular nature of life, and then you will comprehend the Great Spirit".

I cannot refer you to anyother person, webpage, or book, for that information as I translated that vision directly from out of the Blue.

Technosoul.

[PatrickHenry]

My Wackaloid theory: That an agency of government or industry has acquired advanced technology able to cause patterned disruptions to surfaces and temperatures. This agency is experimenting with various patterns as an exercise in puzzlement for the public. This surface disruptor is mounted on high-flying aircraft or satellite and beams its patterns onto agricultural fields.

True purpose unknown.

[Technosoul]

A number of years ago a bunch of people had filmed some strange lights in v-shape formation flying over a city in Arizona and everyone was sure that was a real siting of UFOs, then some person presented the theory that the USA government was experimenting during a top secret project - in that experiment they would project lights from the ground up into the foggy night so that the light would reflect back and look like airplanes or choppers flying overhead, something (spell check on this) called Hallergraphics. Making illusionary images so the enemy would waste their shots of fake targets, useful during war because then you could attack moments later and catch them with their guns and missle sites empty of amo.

But being "top secret" no proof could be manifested. I attempted to find old ariticles about that but I guess they have now been deleted from internet resources.

The problem with these seemingly paranormal events about aliens is that we get a mixture of governmental top secret speculation and speculation about aliens both trying to become the unproven proof and no one can confirm.

That the government might even use and promote crazy ideas about aliens just to use that as a distraction so people will not know what they are testing out, as they know it would fall into the bracket of conspriacy only, and no logical person would pay that much attention to wide-eyed crazy talk about visitors from another planet.

AKA - Distraction in action.

Hiding facts inside of a modern mythology to misslead the foolish and stupid majority.

Hmmm? Good point.

But as Starboy pointed out (or one of our posters) is that some people demonstrated how they were making those crop circles and so we cannot overlook such facts, could have been such a prank. What I was drawing attention too however is why those circles became important to the phychic relative to our historical belief systems which have dominated our consciousness for generations.

If they are man made, how did those people come up with such an idea? What put that idea into their heads to do that and to keep the prank a secret for 25 or so years?

Mr. Webster once said "sometimes reality is stranger then fiction".

Technosoul.

[PatrickHenry]

Some of them are waaay too complicated to be done by foot stompers in a short summer night in the UK. As I mentioned in the other thread, there are instances of them appearing in daylight, though no one has said they saw one appear before their very eyes, yet. Some of the crops have been "crosslaid" and there are other physical and biological anomalies, as well.

I am not too interested in the spiritual significance of circles.

[Technosoul]

I recall seeing on one link that the early crop circles in the U.K. appeared (below) in areas that were the restricted fly zones only for military or governmental planes. That would be somewhat supportive of your claim that it might have been a military project at one time.

Perhaps even a unexpected by-product of an experiment which was not the original or intended purpose.

Also we know that much modern mythology is thought up surrrounding any kind of secret military base or operation, such as the mythology about Area 51, etc. Secrets cause both myth and conspiracy thinking.

Crop circles take on a little different aspect because, let's face it, we are looking at something that we could also call "art". The artistic designs set it apart from what we might normally connect to a military project. The very art contained in that novelty draws one towards the spiritual and emotional idea.

The UFO connection is perhaps related to the idea that UFOs are discribed as being circular objects in most cases. Disk like shapes that would fit into the circular design of a crop novelty.

If complex crop circles can only be explained by some sort of super technology that is unknown to the average public then we can assume it must be the work of advanced human thinking that is keep a secret for military reasons, or that it is done by aliens with such advanced and unknown about technology. And we are stuck with just picking one over the other, and logically we would be more apt to pick military because we know that is something real and that such projects are conducted in secret. Where-as aliens being near-at-hand is debatable and absolutly not certain, relative to "nuts and bolts" evidence is concerned.

Technosoul.

[PatrickHenry]

Good logic, I think, Technosoul. They can only be called ART in some of their manifestations. See the thread I quoted for a few images.

The logic thing brings us to approximately three theories:

• A hoax by those who enjoy that type of thing.
• Advanced human technology, possibly military.
• Extraterrestrial technology, to an unknown purpose.

Some are hoaxes, no doubt. Not all. But there is no proof of aliens whatsoever. That leaves the remainder to secret advanced human tech.

[Compugasm]

Aliens like baseball

[Technosoul]

Pat - I would agree with that stand. I am sure if I wanted I could go out an make a mashed down circle in some farmers wheat field to try and get media attention as the world's greatest prankster. But just because someone could imitate a real crop circle does not mean all of them were made by such people.

Of interest is Carl Jung's book called Flying Saucers, many of the UFO "visions" are what he calls "projections" - you would have to read about that to comprehend the phychology involved.
Just like our mind can project images when we are dreaming it is possible that we can subconsiously project images in a wakened state. Example: If we learn from religion that we have a soul which is "the light" and that the soul is like a vechicle spirit that we use when we depart our body at death, then that imaginary image could be projected by our subconsious mind such that we believe we see it as a lighted vechicle (UFO) in the night sky.

That would leave us with advanced technology that is unknown about to the public but is known of by top secret experimenters and inventers who work behind closed doors for governments.

My only problem with that is that most top secret technologly does become known about after a few years. Lots of leaks I guess or intended sharing. Our top secret nuclear technology is now well known around the globe. Secrets are hard to maintain and so far after many years no sound evidence has leaked out about crop circles.

And so I am starting to lean towards something more natual, as you know energy in a storm cloud as well as energy from the earth can merge to create a lightening bolt. The earth does produce energy - otherwise not lightening flashes. Now the U.K. is often a damp and foggy place (like a low flying cloud) nd so if some natual earth generated energy was triggered because of the fog it might swirl around and cause a crop circle effect. That would be rare but some locations on earth might be more sensitive to the expression of some energy that science is not yet fully aware of documenting. Perhaps science could create some technological equipment to monitor those areas common to crop circles to see what is happening, for if it was the result of natual energy then that might be a source we could tap for the electrical needs of the U.K.?

whatcha think?
Technosoul.