Butter Fingers - The Failings of Organized Religion

[Buzz62]

I was baptized a Catholic as a baby, and spent many years trying to justify and understand the things I heard and saw in Church and Sunday School. Admittedly, the Church started off at a distinct disadvantage with me, because I have always felt uncomfortable with the worship of a dead guy nailed to a cross...to this day it both freaks me out a bit, and confuses me.

I know that Jesus supposedly allowed himself to be crucified in order to cleanse mankind of his sins...but quite frankly, when a 5 year old is rational enough to question this...well...like I said...we were off to a bad start. But I was never able to shake this odd feeling that there is indeed some sort of binding, organizational force in the universe, and that all living creatures have a soul.

I eventually found a belief that felt OK to me, and made sense out of some of the more mysterious qualities of the life experience. This search of mine also lead me to the conclusion that, by and large, organized religion IS the evil the wholly speak of. It enslaves, it warps, it destroys, and perhaps most importantly, it is diametrically in opposition to nature and the human condition.

Over the last century, mankind has granted himself the ability to question...everything. We are no longer afraid to ask, "Is there a God?". Yet religions insist on using the same play-book, albeit with a much smaller stick. This, coupled with the truly gross displays of abuse and confrontation of late, and you have a formula for disaster.

Which, if you've had the where-with-all to read all this, brings us to my premise for this discussion. It is my observation that the more these religions try to hold on to their power, the more it simply slips through their fingers. Would it not be better in the long run, to just provide this spiritual service to those who want it, and quit trying to expand their spheres of influence?

[Grogybear]

Which, if you've had the where-with-all to read all this, brings us to my premise for this discussion. It is my observation that the more these religions try to hold on to their power, the more it simply slips through their fingers. Would it not be better in the long run, to just provide this spiritual service to those who want it, and quit trying to expand their spheres of influence?

I suppose they just can't help themselves. Seems to me that theres a kind of subconscious sadist streak in humans where if they're losing grip of something, rather than taking the hit and ending up with less but still having some, they'd rather go kicking and screaming into oblivion.

Its either that or the likes of the Catholic hierarchy are so deluded (I really wouldn't put it past them) that they believe they have a future.

[Buzz62]

They DO have a future...as an example of megalomaniacs acting badly.
If things work out as I think they will, our great grandchildren will be able to read about the various religions and wonder how we put up with such BS for so long.

[Peter]

Religion is big business. I'll bet half the people in the god business are having second thoughts but they can't stop now. After investing 20 or 30 years of your life in a lie what can you do?

[grandpa]

Religion is big business.
I'll bet half the people in the god business are
having second thoughts but they can't stop now.

Religion is also a cheap political ploy.
As Jonathan Freedland noted in 2006, "gay marriage is back,
evoked anew by the man in the White
House to scare 'values voters', most of
them Christian conservatives, into voting
Republican one more time. It did the
business in 2004, when Bush's efforts to
turn the election into a referendum on
same-sex unions may well have tipped
the pivotal state of Ohio, chiefly by
persuading social conservatives to get
out and vote.
So it's no surprise to see a beleaguered
Bush, facing second-term poll numbers in
the Nixon depths, reaching for the same
stick now."
Jonathan Freedland: Big business, not religion, is the real power in the White House | Comment is free | The Guardian

Grandpa h.

[Buzz62]

agreed.
BIG BUSINESS!!!

The God Business is disgusting as far as I'm concerned.
Which is why I look forward to finding out how the Popes have fared in the "after-life" arena.

"Luxury! I had to come back as a cock roach."

[Anguspure]

[QUOTE=Buzz62;755248]I have always felt uncomfortable with the worship of a dead guy nailed to a cross...to this day it both freaks me out a bit, and confuses me.

The whole idea of the cross is that it is an offense and a horror, hopefully not simply uncomfortable.
The failing of this idea in religous iconology makes us all comfortable with the idea of the innocent being slaughtered on a savage Roman gallows on our behalf.
The pictures of an undamaged man on looking a bit miserable with loin cloth to protect the modesty miss the point completely.
The cross is supposed to be an earthly image of the hell that we are all destined for and that the son of man suffered in our place so that we don't have to remain.

[Anguspure]

[QUOTE=Buzz62;755248] This, coupled with the truly gross displays of abuse and confrontation of late

Are you aware that the RC heirachy were confronted with the strong potential for sexual perversions and abuse resulting from celebacy of the priesthood from the very first days of this doctrine?
I personally was staggered to read a document a number of years ago (apologies can't remeber the exact reference) that dates from the 15th century condeming the doctrine on this basis.
These people and other religous organisations like them have been hell bent on perverting the true and obvious message of the gospel at every turn, throughout history and don't seem to give a stuff who they destroy in the process.

[Grogybear]

These people and other religous organisations like them have been hell bent on perverting the true and obvious message of the gospel at every turn, throughout history and don't seem to give a stuff who they destroy in the process.

That's what you get with power. Religions have held tremendous power over large proportions of the population for a long time. I think that if any organisation holds the amount of power that religious institutions do over their believers corruption is inevitable.
The debate on the merits and veracity of religious texts and beliefs is one thing but there shouldn't even be a debate that organised, hierarchal religion is bad for humanity.

[Anguspure]

The debate on the merits and veracity of religious texts and beliefs is one thing but there shouldn't even be a debate that organised, hierarchal religion is bad for humanity.

Absolutely. The biblical picture presented by Jesus is that of a tree that grows from a mustard seed. As the tree grows in stature the birds come and nest in the branches.
There is a tree like this up the estuary from where I live. The birds have crapped in its branches and it is quite dead. The tree poses a danger to anyone who comes near to it and nothing grows around it.
I guess there is a debate to be had of the relative merits of living trees, but it should be pretty obvious to everybody that a dead and rotten tree should be cut down and that the larger it is the more danger it presents.

[Judicator]

After reading the OP, was I the only one who though to of the quote: "The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers?"

[BlackSheep]

Over the last century, mankind has granted himself the ability to question...everything. We are no longer afraid to ask, "Is there a God?".

Actually mankind has always asked questions. The reason is is now more common is because we are less afraid of being killed for asking the questions.