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| Igneous Magma Posts: 649 | Inquisitor, First my apologies to you regarding this particular subject. It is not aimed at you but rather at those who have accused so many of us of not competing with your brilliant logic. I disagree with, but completely respect your right to voice, your opinion. Especially since I have not seen you condone any violent acts against those you dispise. Regarding the actual subject matter being debated under "holocaust" and the "Jewish question" I could not care less if Inquisitor were arguing that grey rocks are more stupid than brown rocks. This is in response to: Quote:
BUT also OMHO the substance of his arguments AND his supporting evidence is the same old tripe marched out by every bigot I have ever encountered. THEREFORE it seems to me that in the glare of his courage at being so anti PC some have neglected to really read the posts with a detached and critical eye. I wish to highlight what I feel has been skimmed over. Quote:
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Please note any boldface are comments my me (M5) Let us now look at the statements objectively. Forget the actual subject being right or wrong and concentrate on the logic, the evidence, or lack thereof..... Quote:
1. He is rejecting the notion of the Holocaust in light of "no factual evidence". Please note his definition of factual evidence. It is tremendously relevant in that his claims are not backed by any such "factual evidence" using his own definition. 2. He rejects eye whitness accuonts based on his belief that all Jews are pathological liars. However all survivors of the Holocaust were NOT Jews. Quote:
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OK. Quote:
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In fact here is his justification for blaming the Jews for his rather dubious clame of the WORST massacre in history.... Quote:
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I think it is more logical to say "when you are predisposed to look for certain things you tend to find them." Quote:
First Chezare Lombrozo stated an opinion with no statistcal facts to back himself up. Besides...he is a jew and according to the author of this statement that makes him a pathological liar. Second, taking schizophrenia and attributing it more commonly to Jews will take a LOT more that the convoluted path of logic noted above for proof. Read what you are defending people!!!!! Quote:
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In light of Suburbanites skepticism of our ability to send back comments, lets look at a few of our responses..... Quote:
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Inquisitors counter? Quote:
Then to go on and call criminals a minority as if they are some kind of ethnic group unto themselves? This is the "logic and debating style that impresses you? I thought LLuvatar did beautifully... where is his (her) pat on the back? Quote:
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I asked for evidence... I got this Quote:
The point is the abosoluteness and its indefensability. KKK ws evil and I do not NEED numbers. They were all white americans. The SS were overwhelmingly German. AlQueda is overwhelmingly Arabic And this... Quote:
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Protester against the culture war!!!! | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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| | #3 (permalink) (top) |
| Igneous Magma Posts: 649 | Inquisitor, You are being a very good sport through all of this. I hope I do not sound condescending but, in light of your apparent desire for honest critique, here are some suggestions. 1. Avoid using absolute words like "all", "every", "always" etc.. It forces you into comapritive defense and distracts from your message. In nearly all (notice the avoidnece of saying every ) cases absolutes are impossible to prove.2. If you demand a specific type of evidence for proof of something be absolutely sure you have that type of proof available for your own claims. 3. Be wary of depending on published opinions as proof. Liars and buffoons get published too. There usually has to be some statement of credibility for a person if you are referring only to an opinion rather than gathered stats. For example, as I pointed out above, if your premise is that Jews are pathological liars, it does not do you much good to use them for a source. 4. Question your own sources. Ask yourself if you would believe that if it were information against your beliefs. For example, linking to a site that shows Jews are prone to certain deseases does not necessaryly lead to proof of genetic inferiority since it can be done for almost any ethniticy that exists. My wife is professor of medicine and she teaches genetics. This is meant as friendly advice, not a criticism (I did enough of that above). Protester against the culture war!!!! |
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| | #4 (permalink) (top) |
![]() Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,760 | Thanks for going to the trouble of drafting that exhaustive and telling post, m5lange1. I agree that Inqui is a good sport and admire his humility. Here's a challenge for Paavo and Suburbanite (and any others whose prejudices have been titillated by Inquisitor's views and have leapt to his defence with hogwash about his debating strengths): go back through this thread and draw his points together into a cogent and convincing summary. Well guys? Dare ya. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne |
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| | #6 (permalink) (top) | |
![]() Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,760 | Quote:
<!--QuoteBegin-Suburbanite So far (Inquisitor) has done an amazing job of not only remaining tamer than his opponents but done quite an eloquent job justifying his positions.[/quote] Yeah, awesome power of recall you have there. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne | |
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| | #7 (permalink) (top) |
| BANNED Location: Los Angeles Posts: 3,203 | It doesn't mean I agree with him though, nor does it mean that all his sources check out, most sources don't. But his expression of those ideas were as sturdy as any others I've seen, but far too many replies just called him a bigot. |
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| BANNED Posts: 129 | Quote:
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Paul Rassinier's The Holocaust Story and the Lies of Ulysses (former title: "Debunking the Genocide Myth") David Hoggan's The Myth of the Six Million Michael Connor's Dealing in Hate Richard Harwood's Did Six Million Really Die? Fred Leuchter's Forensic Examination and Engineering Report on the alleged Nazi gassing facilities at Auschwitz, Birkenau, and Majdanek (aka The Leuchter Report) As evidence I present these works. So one has to disprove their facts. Quote:
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That 1917 revolution took place? That it was organised by jews? That number of victims was higher than of any other government? I am happy to provide the evidence requested, if you specify which of the above facts looks doubtful to you. Quote:
Of course one can argue that 6 million jews are more valuable than say 60 million people of other ethnicity. In which case you are right. Quote:
In 1869 there were; 1 insane per 1775 catholics 1 insane per 1725 protestants 1 insane per 384 jews Quote:
Also please direct me to Centre for study of ( insert ANY ethnicity) genetic disorders. True there are groups of people who due to historical and geographical reasons have higher tendency for genetic disorders. Yet, plese identify one such group ( let alone ethnicity) which compares to jews in this respect. | ||||||||
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| | #9 (permalink) (top) | ||||||||||||||
| Igneous Magma Posts: 649 | Please keep in mind the topic of this thread is debating technique and the use of logic/evidence. My debate points here have to do with Inquisitors logic and evidence, not Jews or raceism. All quotes by Inquisitor, exceptions are noted. OK Inq here we go.... Quote:
It would never fly in competition, rather you would have to prove the quality of your sources but.... I will use your methods. Quote:
Firstly, you are changing your justification from lying jews to greedy authors of all sorts. Changing your justification is not defending your position it is running away from your first argument. Secondly, Anti Holocaust revisionism is very popular. Reasonable assurance that you book will be published. Hardly sruprising that not only anti-semites but other hate-mongers jumped on the band wagon. Hey.... If it works for you it works for me. If you use a technique to dismiss a mass of works out of hand... that same technique can be turned on you with equal rationality... As just noted. Quote:
You say a country is based on elections.. You say the candidates are dependant on media.. You say jews control almost all influential media.. You therefore conclude that the governments are controled by jews. This is blatant conspiricay theory logic. There are yawning gaps in the facts and the links in your chains. Quote:
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You are, all too obviously, not playing by the same rules you expect your opponants to play by. You weaken your own case. Quote:
Yet your whitnesses are somehow pure and truthful? This is not logic, this just says 'if they do not agree with me they lie if the do agree with me they are credible.' In reference to Chezare Lombrozo..... Quote:
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Or are they liars who are incapapble of making up numbers? This is really weak. Remember how I advised you to substantiate the credentials of your sources. Calling them a liar yourself does NOT meet this criteria. Quote:
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However let me change the word to race. Seceptability to various conditions does NOT prove genetic disorders in the way you are presenting the term. As if "genetic disorders" somehow equate to degeneracy and mental ilness. That is something you have just stated as fact that is simply innaccurate. While your knowledge of history is impressive, you need to brush up on your medical information. Quote:
First a quote from your own link: Quote:
http://gslc.genetics.utah.edu/units/disord...ders/whataregd/ This one is a bit hard to navigate so I have just included a quote from it below: http://www.marchofdimes.com/professionals/681_1221.asp Quote:
http://www.nigms.nih.gov/news/science_ed/g...enepop/faq.html Quote:
It is easy to do but it does NOT prove degeneracy nor infiiriority. In other words the eveidence is not relevant to the point and anyone with a rudimentary knowledge of medicine and genetics will know that. Edited for a PS. I have to concede thatn I fell into the "any" trap. Data cannot be found on "Any" race. I should have known that and it was astute of you, Inquisitor, to point out my falling into a pit I should know better than to walk across. Some races simply have no data available. The Basks (sp?). The various west indian nations such as the Incas as opposed to the Souix. It is either too obscure to find or (more likely) the data does not exists. See? Those absolutes will getcha every time.. ![]() Protester against the culture war!!!! | ||||||||||||||
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