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Thread: What makes you atheists so sure there isn't a God? Any Christian input?

  1. #1141
    Hot Lava Offeror's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Angry Citizen View Post
    That Mohammed is the Last Prophet. That Christianity and Judaism were 'corrupted' in some way (I recall it was due to the imperfections of the people themselves, as the prophets were supposedly perfect). I know there are five pillars of Islam, although I only recall two off the top of my head (the pilgrimage and charity). I know that idolatry is taken extremely seriously under Islam. I know that you must pray towards Mecca, where the Prophet is apparently buried. I know that Jesus is supposedly going to herald the last days, and will be buried next to Mohammed. I know that Islam is fiercely against the concept of Trinity (there is no god but God). Shall I continue?
    Prophet is not buried in Mecca,
    Muslims do not pray towards Mecca because Prophet is buried in that direction.

    Carry on, the rest is fine.

    Haven't made up my mind yet.

  2. #1142
    Hot Lava Offeror's Avatar
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    The book provided visuals and you are entitled to your "opinion", but it is clutching at straws etc. won't do. If you don't agree be more specific. Otherwise, you would lose the moral ground of criticizing religious people who reject evolution or other scientific things.

    I wonder if that was clutching at straws then what the theory that man evolved from ape-like animal is!

    Haven't made up my mind yet.

  3. #1143
    fit ee oan aboot? Dodds's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Offeror View Post
    Sure thing. Any specific reason?
    The first line sums it up pretty well. "we created man from clay". I am pretty sure I have no clay DNA in me.

    The second part of suspended in a place. Again thats like a horoscope. It could mean Man was in caves, it could mean in trees, it could mean anything you want it to mean. Thats the point really.

    Again with the chewed substance line. It kinda looks like something is chewed so therefore god is right. Its taking a passage and applying what you want it to mean to it. I found that hilarious by the way. You could say the same about prawns looking like a fetus. But thats not in the Quoran.

    No mention of why fetus's have gills, no mention of how similar humans, chickens, dolphins etc look so similar when they are embryos. (Heckles embryos, a creationist favorite argument that has been disproved so many times.) Its a nice story, but thats all it is, a story.

    You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. : Dick Cheney

  4. #1144
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    Quote Quote by: Dodds View Post
    The first line sums it up pretty well. "we created man from clay". I am pretty sure I have no clay DNA in me.

    The second part of suspended in a place. Again thats like a horoscope. It could mean Man was in caves, it could mean in trees, it could mean anything you want it to mean. Thats the point really.

    Again with the chewed substance line. It kinda looks like something is chewed so therefore god is right. Its taking a passage and applying what you want it to mean to it. I found that hilarious by the way. You could say the same about prawns looking like a fetus. But thats not in the Quoran.

    No mention of why fetus's have gills, no mention of how similar humans, chickens, dolphins etc look so similar when they are embryos. (Heckles embryos, a creationist favorite argument that has been disproved so many times.) Its a nice story, but thats all it is, a story.
    The second part you suggested very bizarre interpretations. Lets just take this for a moment assuming Quran was written by man. We created man from clay and suspended him to trees (pathetic), to caves (pathetic still). Deny if you like but its no horoscope its common sense that reference is to the womb. Suspension to the uterine wall. A suggestion is good enough. God was not teaching us science he was telling us what we were, and yet we show arrogance in accepting Him.

    And you can't criticize Quran for not having this, not telling that, not saying how, etc.

    So, the only objection that remains is man was made from clay. I'll deal with that as well shortly.

    Haven't made up my mind yet.

  5. #1145
    fit ee oan aboot? Dodds's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Offeror View Post
    The second part you suggested very bizarre interpretations. Lets just take this for a moment assuming Quran was written by man. We created man from clay and suspended him to trees (pathetic), to caves (pathetic still). Deny if you like but its no horoscope its common sense that reference is to the womb. Suspension to the uterine wall. A suggestion is good enough. God was not teaching us science he was telling us what we were, and yet we show arrogance in accepting Him.

    And you can't criticize Quran for not having this, not telling that, not saying how, etc.

    So, the only objection that remains is man was made from clay. I'll deal with that as well shortly.
    How is it? It could mean that God made man from clay then held him in heaven until the world was safe for him. As he loved man so much. Waiting for the dinosaurs to die off so man could inherit the earth.

    See its so easy to attach the verse to whatever I want it to be attached to.


    The mountains passage is equally as vague.

    You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. : Dick Cheney

  6. #1146
    Hot Lava Offeror's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Dodds View Post
    The first line sums it up pretty well. "we created man from clay". I am pretty sure I have no clay DNA in me.

    .
    Check link for clay explanation.

    Clay's matchmaking could have sparked life - 23 October 2003 - New Scientist

    Haven't made up my mind yet.

  7. #1147
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    Quote Quote by: Dodds View Post
    How is it? It could mean that God made man from clay then held him in heaven until the world was safe for him. As he loved man so much. Waiting for the dinosaurs to die off so man could inherit the earth.

    See its so easy to attach the verse to whatever I want it to be attached to.


    The mountains passage is equally as vague.
    Ok, I'll agree for argument's sake that man could be suspended everywhere. What about the reference to other stages? Was the chewed form, and other forms also reference to something else. They have been specifically mentioned as to how man has been created. Its certain that the verses are not so vague as you make them to appear.

    Haven't made up my mind yet.

  8. #1148
    fit ee oan aboot? Dodds's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Offeror View Post
    Ok, I'll agree for argument's sake that man could be suspended everywhere. What about the reference to other stages? Was the chewed form, and other forms also reference to something else. They have been specifically mentioned as to how man has been created. Its certain that the verses are not so vague as you make them to appear.
    OK lets look at Quran verses. They are the word of Allah and cannot be wrong or contradictory?

    25:54 It is He Who has created man from water: then has He established relationships of lineage and marriage: for thy Lord has power (over all things).

    [11:61] To Thamoud we sent their brother Saaleh. He said, "O my people, worship GOD; you have no other god beside Him. He initiated you from the earth, then settled you in it. You shall seek His forgiveness, then repent to Him. My Lord is always near, responsive."

    [19:67] Did the human being forget that we created him already, and he was nothing?

    [38:71] Your Lord said to the angels, "I am creating a human being from clay.

    [35:11]GOD created you from dust, then from a tiny drop, then He causes you to reproduce through your spouses. No female becomes pregnant, nor gives birth, without His knowledge. No one survives for a long life, and no one's life is snapped short, except in accordance with a pre-existing record. This is easy for GOD.

    [30:19] He produces the live from the dead, and produces the dead from the live, and He revives the land after it had died; you are similarly resurrected.

    OK so here we have from the Quran life being created from dust, earth, water, clay, nothing and dead people. Which one is it?

    You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. : Dick Cheney

  9. #1149
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    Quote Quote by: Offeror View Post
    Click for the differences between RNA and DNA.

    DNA vs RNA - Difference and Comparison | Diffen

    You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. : Dick Cheney

  10. #1150
    Emperor of Rome
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    Kind of a belated response, but:

    "YOU" atheists?!


  11. #1151
    busy Chris the Chees's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Offeror View Post
    Baby I can't read that stuff. Maybe you're right. I'm not sure.
    They are passages from two gospels, the parts in red, you will note, are identical. The reason for that is that they either both have the same initial source, or Luke steals, word for word, from the other Gospel.

    Society may be formed so as to exist without crime, without poverty, […] no obstacle whatsoever intervenes at this moment except ignorance to prevent such a state of society.

    Robert Owen

  12. #1152
    World Hack Affluence's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Theseus View Post
    Christians vs. Atheists. Yep.
    Well now we are here arent we? We are dialoguing and debating with our creative minds here on this forum amongst each other. We have free will to do so or not do so. I propose we have learned through antiquity that Love is the greatest ability we have as humans; an ability bestowed by God.

    Now. I site (refer) God for all this. There is an other Theory. It is to site Star Dust. Which is cool if you believe in that theory. Peace.


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