Firing Squads

[SoylentGreen]

Firing squad prepare for grisly duty - World - NZ Herald News

Utah is the only state to allow firing squads, widely seen as an unnecessarily brutal and archaic means of execution.

Asked by the judge to choose between lethal injection - the more common method in Utah - or the firing squad, Gardner was quick in his response. "I would like the firing squad, please."

The identities of the five marksmen chosen to be part of the firing squad will be kept secret, but it is certain they have already been practising for the execution. If and when the moment arrives, they will each receive a rifle, one of which will be loaded with a wax bullet. No one will know for sure whose rifle fires the fatal shot - a precaution designed to protect all of them from subsequent remorse

All five men belonged to the Salt Lake Police Force. "I wrestled with the morality. I'm not a super-religious or spiritual person," one said. "I go to church every Sunday. I did wrestle with `thou shall not kill.' But I still felt that it was part of my job."

Two told the Tribune last week that they slept easy when they got home. Shooting Taylor was like "returning a defective product to the manufacturer", one said. Another betrayed a sliver of uncertainty. "I had issues about shooting a guy strapped in a seat, helpless," he said.

"But the state had ordered us to do this and we had a job to do. I don't regret doing it, but I would never do it again."

Instead of engaging in another round of DP right or wrong, this time i would like to debate the specific part in bold.
The idea that one gun will fire a blank and therefore the 5 men can take comfort in that they might have been the one to fire the blank is a false argument given to make a firing squad sound comfortable for the executioners and those who support execution.
The testimonies of the five police men is not that of "well, at least i had the blank" kind of thinking, but one of a regretable job well done.

The only real use of a blank is to give a pretence of humanity.

[Peter]

The only real use of a blank is to give a pretence of humanity.

A pretense of humanity? As in 4 bullets is less brutal than 5? I don't think that's what you mean. The reason for the blank in one gun is exactly as stated which is understandable since it's damn difficult to shoot another human being and still sleep well at night.

From wikipedia:

Capital punishment was suspended in the United States between 1972 and 1976, as a result of several decisions of the United States Supreme Court. The process resumed with the execution of Gary Gilmore on January 17, 1977, at Utah State Prison in Draper. The five executioners were equipped with .30-30 caliber rifles and off-the-shelf Winchester 150 grain (9.7 g) SilverTip ammunition. The condemned was restrained and hooded, and the shots were fired at a distance of 20 feet (6 m), aiming at the chest. According to his brother Mikal Gilmore's memoir Shot in the Heart, Utah's tradition dictated that a firing squad comprise five men — four of them with live rounds, and one with a blank round, so that each of the shooters could cast doubt to having fired a fatal shot. However, upon inspecting the clothes worn by Gary Gilmore at his execution, Mikal noticed five holes in the shirt — indicating, he wrote, that "the state of Utah, apparently, had taken no chances on the morning that it put my brother to death"

.30-30 Winchester silvertip - 150grain, velocity 2390fps
"Specially alloyed aluminum nose cap protects the lead core and allows for deep penetration delivering controlled expansion" Recommended for thin skinned big game.

Yep, those should do the trick.

[Angry Citizen]

It's to salve the squad's conscience. It's all psychological. It has nothing to do with 'humanity'. Some people are uncomfortable killing people, even if they've clearly earned it like the vast majority of death penalty victims. That said, it's somewhat inconsistent. We don't have five men throwing electric switches with one being a dead switch (no pun intended).

[DavidSupreme]

Firing squad prepare for grisly duty - World - NZ Herald News


Instead of engaging in another round of DP right or wrong, this time i would like to debate the specific part in bold.
The idea that one gun will fire a blank and therefore the 5 men can take comfort in that they might have been the one to fire the blank is a false argument given to make a firing squad sound comfortable for the executioners and those who support execution.
The testimonies of the five police men is not that of "well, at least i had the blank" kind of thinking, but one of a regretable job well done.

The only real use of a blank is to give a pretence of humanity.

I am technically for the Death Penalty but not in our nation as we have to much racism and discrimination, it would work in a more civilized and advanced country like Denmark or Sweden as they do not arrest people for being black and such.

Regarding the execution, yes, it is clear that the entire point is to give the officers a way of excusing themselves if they feel remore or regret "maybe the bullet I got was a blank" and so on, its silly but it seems to work.

Hell, if they said that the Victim was Atheist or Foreigner they would gladly done it without the vax bullet wouldn't they?

Sorry.

[Philip Lu]

A pretense of humanity? As in 4 bullets is less brutal than 5? I don't think that's what you mean. The reason for the blank in one gun is exactly as stated which is understandable since it's damn difficult to shoot another human being and still sleep well at night.

From wikipedia:



.30-30 Winchester silvertip - 150grain, velocity 2390fps
"Specially alloyed aluminum nose cap protects the lead core and allows for deep penetration delivering controlled expansion" Recommended for thin skinned big game.

Yep, those should do the trick.

The wax bullet is not to help the prisoner, he is dead and he will probably feel pain on the way there. The wax bullet is to comfort the firing squad. Any one of them could be the lucky one who did not kill the prisoner.

[NoJingoLingo]

The death penalty is revenge killing and abhorrent. The use of the wax bullet is evidence that killing an unarmed person who poses no immediate threat to you is also abhorrent.

[Angry Citizen]

The death penalty is revenge killing and abhorrent.

So? That's why I support it -- so long as the perp is linked through incontrovertible evidence. In fact, I think Kennedy v. Louisiana was one of the worst decisions ever made.

[Peter]

The death penalty is revenge killing and abhorrent. The use of the wax bullet is evidence that killing an unarmed person who poses no immediate threat to you is also abhorrent.

I learned recently that the primary reason for all punishment is revenge (retribution/getting even) and yes, I too find that fact abhorrent. I feel that punishment, especially punishment administered by a state, should have a useful purpose like deterrence but deterrence is only a side effect apparently.

Your second comment got me thinking... Maybe we should have some kind of deathmatch for the condemned like in the movie Running Man. You know, give them an AK-47 and let them shoot it out with the firing squad. Can you imagine the revenue if such an event was televised! Move over super bowl. Sorry, my cynical streak is showing.

[Angry Citizen]

Your second comment got me thinking... Maybe we should have some kind of deathmatch for the condemned like in the movie Running Man. You know, give them an AK-47 and let them shoot it out with the firing squad. Can you imagine the revenue if such an event was televised! Move over super bowl. Sorry, my cynical streak is showing.

Ever seen Death Race?

[Peter]

Ever seen Death Race?

Nope, but it's on my list now!

[DavidSupreme]

I learned recently that the primary reason for all punishment is revenge (retribution/getting even) and yes, I too find that fact abhorrent. I feel that punishment, especially punishment administered by a state, should have a useful purpose like deterrence but deterrence is only a side effect apparently.

Your second comment got me thinking... Maybe we should have some kind of deathmatch for the condemned like in the movie Running Man. You know, give them an AK-47 and let them shoot it out with the firing squad. Can you imagine the revenue if such an event was televised! Move over super bowl. Sorry, my cynical streak is showing.

Actually, sounds like a good idea, then the useless trash would be of some use, atleast helping out giving Coca Cola or McDonald's some extra revenue (being that they would sponsor it)..

The question is, what would the prisoners have to GAIN? Could the "Winner" be set free? He would need some sort of incentive else why even bother, right?

[Peter]

Actually, sounds like a good idea, then the useless trash would be of some use, atleast helping out giving Coca Cola or McDonald's some extra revenue (being that they would sponsor it)..

The question is, what would the prisoners have to GAIN? Could the "Winner" be set free? He would need some sort of incentive else why even bother, right?

The obvious reward would be to have their death sentence commuted to life in prison but I'm sure we can come up with something more original than that.