Why do I anti-preach?

[orgaelin]

Drops in a pond....

Absolutely! We are talking about the same thing!!

That's a damn good analogy though. So we're all drops in a pond, or a sea. Earth, then, is an imagined island within that sea. On occasions we may choose to seperate from the sea and go on land, pretending that we are a solid life form.

Though obviously we're not literally a bunch of drips!

[orgaelin]

But I envision a history to it too, like there was probably a time when no-one knew about the island, or no-one wanted to go there... then one day a bunch of us got together and decided we would seperate from God (the sea) and go there.

This would then be similar to the 'fall from heaven', in that we would have left heaven in favour of material life (on the island/earth).

Those drops that stayed behind would indeed view us as wicked for leaving.

But others would be interested and thus follow us. So myths about it over time would spread between heaven and earth (sea and island).

[Young]

Wow , You have some serious believes, and you believe them, and everything else anyone else says is False. Young doesn't mean younger, and just because my believes run contrary to yours, doesn't make me a "Fool" or "simple-minded" Satan as is real as You...The Bad things, that You know are Bad and continue to do anyway...Satan pushes that on you. Everything you see is meant to confuse you from the fact that he exists, he exists in your Heart, Satan is Sin....not some beastly creature dreamed up by simple minded christians, he is portrayed as such in order to give children the correct vision on the one who comes bearing sin, some might even take your misguided attacks on Christianity as being Satanic, but you're merely a misguided child of the Lord, and apparently a very weak one, no matter how learn'ED you are, if you aren't strong in the Lord you are lost. This feeling of being lost, not able to accept the Truth stems from you not being strong enough to fight the devil off, for if you could live with less sin and walk with the Lord, you wouldn't hold this anamosity. If your hung on contradictions, think, everything isn't black & white....stories are different and some mean what they say, and some are more like a way of thinking for a certain subject. Hello...for someone who Knows the Christianity....you'd have to have read up on the Trinity. God uses my Dreams, people, and the # 3 to speak to me, look inside yourself, then when you learn to pray nightly and try your best to be a person that respects the laws of the Lord and you find kindness for strangers....the Lord will use you and then you'll see clearly. I'm trying my best to be a good person, but good citizen, at times NO....far worse than anything you'd admit in a forum, but my Heart was pure even when i did wrong and i past my tests and listened well when the Lord spoke and many times i have had pieces of a message that were obviously an important message and my weak human mind misses a piece or a sign, that ties it together, then sometimes it just happens, along with being a Christian i Invent, but i'm not cocky or crazy enough to believe that all of my ideas come from myself, i believe that others inspire some, but others just pop into my head and aren't a result of trying to solve a problem, and i see things in my dreams that can't be imagined, i can think and fly, i just take off and when i wanna come down i think it and i slowly catch myself as i move down, look in any book about dreams and you'll know that people who claim to have this ability in their dreams are #'s in 1 in a million terms. You have some growing to do, and the best way for you to do it, get you some X, go to a Rave on a Sat night, hit an after party, then as you're coming down.....Go to Church, Methodist will work just fine. Maybe after that you can rent Passion on your way Home. I've seen this work for some of the most un religous, Soldiers who couldn't deal with the trappings of war, rolled, got blown up, passed out, and came back trying to explain what God looked like, because they had seen the Lord. Your problem, and i know you love to hear whats wrong with you :) , is you're too smart for your own good.....everything is far more complicated than your mind will ever manage to wrap itself around, so Our intelligent ancestors made it simple for troubled folks like You.


Praying for You

[orgaelin]

Originally posted by Young, Wow , You have some serious believes, and you believe them, and everything else anyone else says is False.

Ha! And you are any different than this? No!

But you did use the right word: "believe"

To believe, by its very definition, is to doubt. If there wasn't an element of doubt in the idea of 'believing' then it would be called 'knowledge'.

To know is totally different from believing. I believe what I say, but I never claim(ed) to KNOW that it is all correct. I wasn't there, I didn't see any of it. I can only use my best guesses and select what I want to believe.

Young doesn't mean younger, and just because my believes run contrary to yours, doesn't make me a "Fool" or "simple-minded"

I know. But I really don't think I am alone in the assertion that such a persistent belief in Satan is a missunderstanding that could be cleared up with a simple history lesson.

I'll continue with this post in a while. I've cut my finger peeling potatoes, and have two boys who need their nappies (diappers) changing!

[Technosoul]

Originally posted by orgaelin, As may be apparent, I do a lot of preaching against the biblical God and Jesus. Why do I do it? I feel a need to raise this topic because I have been a bit strong lately in my aggressive responses to peoples claims that their god is a good one. I want people to know that the worst thing I could ever do is sow even a tiny seed of doubt in the fields of your faith. I would hate myself for that. I do not seek to de-convert you. I do not want you to doubt your own beliefs (though I doubt you ever will!) and I do not want to shout at you. Obviously when I get carried away there is some emotion fueling my fire. This is resentment, because I resent your god for not being what I feel he should be. I resent the bible for being inconsistent and self-contradictory. I resent Jesus for claiming so much yet being so absent from the world. I resent my childhood churches and schools for teaching me so much that the bible doesn't even say. I resent the fact that this religion of yours has evolved over thousands of years (even before Christianity) and still it is not able to convince that there is a god worthy of my... worthy of even my respect. I do not believe most of what the bible says, though I recognise there is a lot of actual history contained within it. However, if I *did* believe it, or if it turned out to be all true, I would be resentful all the more. I would resent God for being so cold-blooded and ruthless and vengeful and angry and judgemental and unsupportive and such an absent parent. So whether your beliefs are true or not, I resent that I cannot find happiness or even contentment in them. My resentment is therefore not for you, but for your god, and the authors of your bible. When I argue with you, I do so only because you claim to defend your god, and I cannot speak to him of my complaints because he'll either not listen or he'll listen and danm me to hell for it! There's a question somewhere in all this: Is it right? I mean here on the board we have people who believe, and people who absolutely do not believe. What are we doing? Bantering back and forth to give our respective viewpoints... I know I for one have never come even a fraction closer to accepting the views of the believers, and I am in doubt that they have failed to come closer to my own views too. So why do we do it? If you wont change your mind and I wont change mine, what's this all about?! Is there something else we get from it? I suspect all we do is strengthen our *own* beliefs? ~ Org.

Greetings, I am responding to your original post and not the follow-up messages, but rest assured that I will not pray for you because when such prayers fail to help you convert then that would only prove your case more so.

God is not a dusty old book we take out and read when ever feel in the mood. And so belief in the Bible is what you are objecting too, and I might say for good reasons.

You have placed your faith in the indwelling spirit of truth, that truth inside of you that allows you to see clearly is in fact the best god you could honor. The god I call "the truth" is not something learned, it is the living ability to see honestly from inside the self, to give respect to the revelations of reason. In anicent Greek, the word "reason" means "of god". However not a god that is apart from, or outside of the self, but the god that we unfold from and manifest as the true self, or truth-related oneness of being.

When properly comprehended in full context the bible is simply speaking about the transformation of self from being resentful to the next level of human consciousness. Allow me to explain this philosophy.

Part one we have a god that dominates, that is mad and judgemental and even distructive. What we might call the classic male model attitude. Then that male god attitude gets in touch with it's goddess side, and weeping it transforms from it's egocentical and dominating male role to embrace the goddess concepts of unconditinal mothery love. And from out of the side of the male god springs forth Jesus and his teachings about brotherly love and the importance of mother nature as a teacher of philosophy. What Arnold might call the "girlie god" for the new transformation of humanity.

Note: You will not hear this at your local bible study classes.

And so the biblical god is reborn out of the decay of it's male dominance via the spirit of truth into the beautiful Goddess of love and compassion, understanding such that reason is liberated from anger and rapts into the enlightenment of loving life and the passions begot of that union.

Wanna sign up?

Technosoul.

[tusaki]

orgaelin, perhaps you could take a look at Buddhism it corresponds quite well to your thoughts. Although I'm not a practicing Buddhist, of all the religions, this comes closest to my believes.

The fact that it wants its followers to find the truth for themselves, not to obey some super being or an old book. That it encourages its followers to constantly reinvent Buddhism itself. That modern science seems to go hand in hand with the teachings of Buddhism. That there are no holy wars, holy warriors or 'in the name of' actions by Buddhists. That there is no hell, no god, no heaven, no damnation, only purity, humbleness, understanding, compassion and sympathy. Buddhism doesn't even lift 'humans' to some kind of elevated status, except maybe that being a human makes it easier to learn, nor does it think life is limited to this world, or even this dimension.

these are only a few reasons why I personally think it is the most honest and truthful of them all.

[orgaelin]

Originally posted by Technosoul, God is not a dusty old book we take out and read when ever feel in the mood.

Wow, that's profound! I'm going to use that one!

Part one we have a god that dominates, that is mad and judgemental and even distructive. What we might call the classic male model attitude. Then that male god attitude gets in touch with it's goddess side, and weeping it transforms from it's egocentical and dominating male role to embrace the goddess concepts of unconditinal mothery love. And from out of the side of the male god springs forth Jesus and his teachings about brotherly love and the importance of mother nature as a teacher of philosophy. What Arnold might call the "girlie god" for the new transformation of humanity. Note: You will not hear this at your local bible study classes.

You wrote that almost tongue-in-cheek, what with the references to Arnold(!), and yet it is actually a very good observation.

I have never considered a big change in God's nature.

I do believe there are massive changes afoot amongst the souls/people that compose god, but have never considered the obvious effect that might have on god. Interesting.

And so the biblical god is reborn out of the decay of it's male dominance via the spirit of truth into the beautiful Goddess of love and compassion, understanding such that reason is liberated from anger and rapts into the enlightenment of loving life and the passions begot of that union.

This fits in with my ideas of balance. Basically God started with a rather extreme nature that was most UNbalanced. Now he's swinging around to embrace the opposite, which of course will still be unbalanced if he goes too far, but hopefully he'll see reason and come back half way after that.

Wanna sign up?

Dude, send me a contract! How big is the donation, and what percentage of my income do you need?!

[orgaelin]

Originally posted by tusaki, The fact that it wants its followers to find the truth for themselves, not to obey some super being or an old book. That it encourages its followers to constantly reinvent Buddhism itself. That modern science seems to go hand in hand with the teachings of Buddhism. That there are no holy wars, holy warriors or 'in the name of' actions by Buddhists. That there is no hell, no god, no heaven, no damnation, only purity, humbleness, understanding, compassion and sympathy. Buddhism doesn't even lift 'humans' to some kind of elevated status, except maybe that being a human makes it easier to learn, nor does it think life is limited to this world, or even this dimension.

Absolutely. These beliefs are the basic building blocks of a perfect religion. I guess I don't follow the practice too much because it's all a bit open ended and vague. Kind of like there's no direct set of instructions, you just have to open the pack and work out how reality fits together by yourself... and that makes it less of a religion and more a very good code of conduct.

Scientology, though it utterly fails to live up to the building blocks which define Buddhism, is largely based on the idea of practicalising (is that a word?!) Buddhism. That is, the purpose of a Scientologist is to achieve enlightenment via a very, very thoroughly researched and experimented set of practices that can actually achieve it, within a single lifetime.

It sounds great doesn't it?!

But alas things are never so simple. The religion is corrupt at the core, a massively institutionalised entity that is so tightly controlled it runs the risk of choking itself. It's founder, Ron Hubbard, said that anyone who ever tried to charge money for the therapy he devised would have to be corrupt, and now his church does exactly that.

It's hard to say whether Hubbard intended it this way, whether he was good once but went mad (power corrupts), or whether he was good but his replacements after his death have corrupted his original intentions.

There is hope, however, in a break away group called the Freezone. This is made up of ex-scientologists who have broken free of shackles of orthodox Scientology while they were at high levels, and they make the expensive and top secret material readily available, as well as continuing to develop the processes, which Scientology forbids.

[Technosoul]

Originally posted by orgaelin,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (orgaelin,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-Technosoul, God is not a dusty old book we take out and read when ever feel in the mood.

Wow, that's profound! I'm going to use that one!

Part one we have a god that dominates, that is mad and judgemental and even distructive.  What we might call the classic male model attitude. Then that male god attitude gets in touch with it's goddess side, and weeping it transforms from it's egocentical and dominating male role to embrace the goddess concepts of unconditinal mothery love.  And from out of the side of the male god springs forth Jesus and his teachings about brotherly love and the importance of mother nature as a teacher of philosophy.  What Arnold might call the "girlie god" for the new transformation of humanity.  Note: You will not hear this at your local bible study classes.

You wrote that almost tongue-in-cheek, what with the references to Arnold(!), and yet it is actually a very good observation.

I have never considered a big change in God's nature.

I do believe there are massive changes afoot amongst the souls/people that compose god, but have never considered the obvious effect that might have on god. Interesting.



This fits in with my ideas of balance. Basically God started with a rather extreme nature that was most UNbalanced. Now he's swinging around to embrace the opposite, which of course will still be unbalanced if he goes too far, but hopefully he'll see reason and come back half way after that.



Dude, send me a contract! How big is the donation, and what percentage of my income do you need?![/b][/quote]

[orgaelin]

Um... hmmm...

Is it just me, or are you repeating what I say?!

[Technosoul]

It is free and nothing is copyrighted. Those who want to sign up for something cannot become members, sorry, but you get a 2nd chance or as many as one pleases. (kinda of a paradox for that).

Now about God repenting and changing his ways. Here is (my revelation) the untold interpretaion.

"Even as humans suffered illnesses so did Jesus take on the illnesses of many when healing them saying once "how long must I suffer for the wickedness of this generation".

Even as Adam was judged by the law of God, so was Jesus judged by the laws of man.

Even as people were caused to speak in strange tonghs because of the tower of Babylon, so likewise did Jesus once speak in tonghs no one comprehended.

Even as Adam was removed from the Garden of Eden, so was Jesus cast out of his earthly kingdom.

Even as humans sometimes suffer hungar and thirst, so likewise did Jesus fast for 40 days, suffering the same.

Even as Eve was said to have been tempted by the devil, so likewise did Jesus have to experience the attempted tempations of the devil.

Even as people had to die because of the sins of Adam, so likewise did Jesus die for the sins of Adam.

Even as the world was flooded with water, so was Jesus submerged in the waters of baptism.

And so Jesus, in effect, suffered the pains that we blame God for having created, and in fact, it was God who experienced all those "payback" suffering by indwelling in Jesus and through the human person of Jesus. Through Jesus God experienced all of our sufferings and God carried his own cross to His death and rebirth.

Whats good for the little ducks is good for the Gander and so when Jesus set forth the new rule "Do unto others as you would have others do until you" God was not fooling around, nor did God place his self above his own golden rule because he allowed humanity to do unto Him all the things done unto us by Him and his "designs for creation and history". For that suffering was channled to God via the person of Jesus as his "human manifestation" for that purpose.

So you see, Jesus did not die for our sins, but died to wipe clean the sins of God, so now the slate is clearn and we and everyone can start over as if Adam and Eve did not happen, we can start over pre-Adam in our consciouness. That historical history ended, and a new era has dawned. And the Golden Rule was suggested as something we can meditate about as a signpost for the reconstruction of our attitudes once we are no longer under the occupational forces of Pride and the police state of learned knowledge.

Liberate the Goddess within you.

That is my sermon on a soapbox, whatcha think?
Technosoul.

[orgaelin]

So, to cut a long sermon short...

Jesus didn't die so we could be forgiven for our sins aginst him, but so that God could be forgiven for his sins against us?

I like it, a lot.

You see that's what makes me angry - the lack of balance in it all. I mean, Adam and Eve take a bite of an apple, big frickin' deal, right?! God kills *millions* of people throughout history, and we're supposed to just love and adore him?!

Are we allowed to swear on here?!?! I really wanna!

[Technosoul]

Before you make up your mind about anything biblical you should study some of the many books written by Zecharia Sitchin.

http://www.sitchin.com/

He has linked biblical passages with other so-called mythologies of the anicent past, and likewise has brought into the picture evidence discovered by science and secular research.

I will sound nutty just from reading my short outline below but if you look at all his evidence the weight of it is in his favor.

Now we have a creative intelligence or "spirit" which is an network of commuication but also we have what the bible has called the gods or God who is not that creative essence. Thus we have our confusion that God did bad things to Adam and whatnot.

The gods discribed in the 2nd part concerning Adam and Eve were human like aliens which visit earth everytime their planet orbits close enough to earth for a visit.

The in effect cloned workers using a early primate and their own DNA to create a work force here on earth duing their visiting periods that would last about 1000 years per stay. Apparently these gods were interested in gold for some reason, and they gave instructions for building cities used for processing gold and had a farming industry set up to feed the workers and their self. Complete with schools and scribes, and they offered also knowledge about the planets and the universe above. Also they had them build houses for where they could live while supervising the culture the organized, those houses were called temples "houses of the Lord". Some of the areas had towers built, called "stairways to heaven" because they were used as ladders so that one could reach the elevated cockpits of their space ship and then blast off to journey into the heavens (sky).

Check it out if you wish. Even if you do not agree with his conclusions you will find lots of interesting information that is useful and educational.

Technosoul.

[orgaelin]

Technosoul, you're going to love what I have to tell you next!

I'm going to keep you in suspense a wee while though, as I've a few chores to do first! :(

[orgaelin]

OK, I have some time, but not much, so I’m going to outline stuff, rather than my usual level of detail!

Sitchin was one of the first, but definitely not the last, to wonder just what all those ancient texts were talking about. Sure it sounds far-fetched, but when you actually read them, it really is easy to interpret them in exactly the way Sitchin has.

But alas the world is just so not ready to hear any of this. If it’s true, it will be hundreds or even thousands of years before mankind as a whole begins to accept it.

Remember me mentioning Laurence Gardner once or twice or more? Well, I also mentioned he had 4 books out. They make up a series, and only the first of them deals with Jesus and the past 2000 years of history.

The second goes back in time, ending where the first book began, and beginning at the dawn of civilisation. He explains, much like Sitchin, that there are clear references to the creation of a hybrid race created by mixing the genes of the aliens/gods with primitive humans. He then details the most incredible history of the birth of civilisation, after the gods gave us kingship. He traces this kingship through right up the Jesus’ day, arguing that a single bloodline and a single organisation have been constantly at the helm, right from the beginning.

I should explain that this guy has more distinguished titles than the British Library, and is a highly respected scholar, absolutely not prone to making absurd claims without backing them up. Everything he says is either referenced elsewhere, or self evident and common sense.

The third book comes back to the future again, but still our past. It deals with more the last millennium, exploring all the myths, legends and fairytales of the era. Why? Because most of them have their origins in real life stories. The character of Robin Hood actually had a genuine historical counterpart, for example. Also, he explains how the silly idea of “pixies” is based around the story of an Irish sect known as the Pict-Shee. The church wanted to belittle these people because they understood certain aspects of history the church didn’t want people to know, and thus made up silly stories about them, culminating in the modern idea of pixies.

In all of the first three books there are repeated references to the final book, and it is truly a fine example of saving the best till last! I waited years in anticipation of this book (which is now being made into a movie!) and it absolutely didn’t disappoint!

You mentioned the aliens were, for some unknown reason, interested in gold, right?

Not so unknown today my friend!

I’m excited here to find someone I can discuss this with... not many people are on my wavelength when it comes to stuff like this, even though all the books I read claim to be best-sellers!!

Let me tell you a little story. I haven’t got the dates to hand, but a couple of years ago the British government did something very strange. It was decided that they were going to sell a MASSIVE amount of gold from the UK’s reserves. Again I don’t have the figures, but will get them if you wish. That’s not too odd, except that you have to bear in mind the effect that would have on the world economy. Basically, if a load of gold comes on the market then the market price of gold will drop.

So as you can imagine, it would be pretty unfortunate if anyone found out BEFORE you sold the gold that you were planning to sell the gold, since that would drop the price before you sold it, so you’d get less money for it.

And what do you think they did? They publicly announced it to the whole darn world, waited for the price to drop, and then sold!

Why? Because the powers-that-be needed a lot of gold (for reasons we will get to) and needed to get it cheaply. They couldn’t just take the gold, and they didn’t want to pay full price, so they made the price drop and bought it cheap.

Again, why? Well, because scientists have quietly rediscovered an ancient secret to do with gold, a secret that holds the key to an entirely new era of human technological achievement. I’m talking world-wide changes you could barely even dream of!

The ancient secret was known the aliens who put us here, and was known throughout much of ancient history. It can be readily demonstrated, with common sense and references(!), that it was even known to certain major biblical characters, and that the Ark of the Covenant held its immense power as a result of this technology.

Have I aroused your curiosity yet? Want to hear the rest?!

[Mr.Vicchio]

I pray for all mankind, no matter who, even the likes of John Kerry and roxdog, I pray for them. I pray for the terrorist, that they will see their evil for what it is, and change. I pray for lots of things. But mostly I pray that the good lord guide my steps and help me be a better servant to His Will

[Pooeypants]

You serve a benevolent dictator then?

[Technosoul]

Originally posted by orgaelin, OK, I have some time, but not much, so I’m going to outline stuff, rather than my usual level of detail! Sitchin was one of the first, but definitely not the last, to wonder just what all those ancient texts were talking about. Sure it sounds far-fetched, but when you actually read them, it really is easy to interpret them in exactly the way Sitchin has. But alas the world is just so not ready to hear any of this. If it’s true, it will be hundreds or even thousands of years before mankind as a whole begins to accept it. Remember me mentioning Laurence Gardner once or twice or more? Well, I also mentioned he had 4 books out. They make up a series, and only the first of them deals with Jesus and the past 2000 years of history. The second goes back in time, ending where the first book began, and beginning at the dawn of civilisation. He explains, much like Sitchin, that there are clear references to the creation of a hybrid race created by mixing the genes of the aliens/gods with primitive humans. He then details the most incredible history of the birth of civilisation, after the gods gave us kingship. He traces this kingship through right up the Jesus’ day, arguing that a single bloodline and a single organisation have been constantly at the helm, right from the beginning. I should explain that this guy has more distinguished titles than the British Library, and is a highly respected scholar, absolutely not prone to making absurd claims without backing them up. Everything he says is either referenced elsewhere, or self evident and common sense. The third book comes back to the future again, but still our past. It deals with more the last millennium, exploring all the myths, legends and fairytales of the era. Why? Because most of them have their origins in real life stories. The character of Robin Hood actually had a genuine historical counterpart, for example. Also, he explains how the silly idea of “pixies” is based around the story of an Irish sect known as the Pict-Shee. The church wanted to belittle these people because they understood certain aspects of history the church didn’t want people to know, and thus made up silly stories about them, culminating in the modern idea of pixies. In all of the first three books there are repeated references to the final book, and it is truly a fine example of saving the best till last! I waited years in anticipation of this book (which is now being made into a movie!) and it absolutely didn’t disappoint! You mentioned the aliens were, for some unknown reason, interested in gold, right? Not so unknown today my friend! I’m excited here to find someone I can discuss this with... not many people are on my wavelength when it comes to stuff like this, even though all the books I read claim to be best-sellers!! Let me tell you a little story. I haven’t got the dates to hand, but a couple of years ago the British government did something very strange. It was decided that they were going to sell a MASSIVE amount of gold from the UK’s reserves. Again I don’t have the figures, but will get them if you wish. That’s not too odd, except that you have to bear in mind the effect that would have on the world economy. Basically, if a load of gold comes on the market then the market price of gold will drop. So as you can imagine, it would be pretty unfortunate if anyone found out BEFORE you sold the gold that you were planning to sell the gold, since that would drop the price before you sold it, so you’d get less money for it. And what do you think they did? They publicly announced it to the whole darn world, waited for the price to drop, and then sold! Why? Because the powers-that-be needed a lot of gold (for reasons we will get to) and needed to get it cheaply. They couldn’t just take the gold, and they didn’t want to pay full price, so they made the price drop and bought it cheap. Again, why? Well, because scientists have quietly rediscovered an ancient secret to do with gold, a secret that holds the key to an entirely new era of human technological achievement. I’m talking world-wide changes you could barely even dream of! The ancient secret was known the aliens who put us here, and was known throughout much of ancient history. It can be readily demonstrated, with common sense and references(!), that it was even known to certain major biblical characters, and that the Ark of the Covenant held its immense power as a result of this technology. Have I aroused your curiosity yet? Want to hear the rest?!

In his book the 12th planet he could only guess, thinking perhaps that the gold was useful for sodering some computer like electronics, while others speculated it could be used somehow to create an ozone or whatever, to make a planet habital. But he could only specualte on that part.

So yes, interested in knowing what else it could be used for, as we know they kept gold for the gods in the anicent temples (RE: King Solomon and it was aslo found in the pyramids where kings or queens rested). Also, in South Afrrica they have found gold mines that predate any other digs suggesting human culture, yet they could not find any relics in that area or coins. As if the gold was moved somewhere else.

So what is the value of gold?

Technosoul.