Atheists Do It On A Bus

[Walrus]

I think one of the positive things about this campaign, is the apparently tolerant attitude towards it by the majority Christians in this country.

[shawmutt]

Quote by: loser Of course, if you are equating Christianity with Catholicism then I agree with the superstitious part...but they are NOT the same and, in fact, are worlds apart.

It's true, the RCC has attempted to single-handedly destroy Christianity with myth and superstition. The RCC does NOT represent Christianity, no matter what they do or say.

They're not Christians except by name only. You might call yourself good but that doesn't make it so.

"No true Scotsman" fallacies.

What country doesn't believe in the superstitious myth of evolution and flying dinosaurs that were once chickens or that man was once ignorant 'cavemen' (like depicted in the Geico commercials) resembling lesser primates, in fact even going so far as saying that Homo sapiens descended from other Homos. That's too funny.

I'm also quite adept at logic and reasoning and I have concluded, with little doubt, that the theory of common descent is one of the most ignorant myths ever foisted upon humanity. It never ceases to amaze me how so many people can blindly follow such foolishness without a hint of knowledge (evidence).

Lines of evidence: The science of evolution

People are indeed blind.

People aren't blind, but they certainly can go through life with blinders.

My dad never took a DNA test to prove his paternity so I have had to rely on faith that my mother knew who my dad was and told me accordingly. This kind of faith is not blind nor is it unreasonable. Nevertheless, I really don't know who my dad is.

False analogy. Your father can certainly take a DNA test and prove his paternity.

My faith is based on knowledge...

Knowledge of...?

People wrap themselves up in a blanket of lies, only fooling themselves with their transparent disguise (from loser's poem, "Images"). Nothing odd about it at all. In psychotherapy, it's called Being In Denial.

Indeed.

[Jack]

the theory of common descent is one of the most ignorant myths ever foisted upon humanity.

So instead of just making an unfounded contention, how about providing some scientific research that supports this. Otherwise I can easily dismiss one person's opinion when it attempts to counter hundreds of experiments and mountains of evidence.
In short, I don't believe you until you can back up what you think.

But do it in the appropriate thread. Attempts to further distract this thread from its topic are not appreciated.

[Cruella]

Oh, yes, please show us where it's been dismissed, I'd like to read that a great deal.

[isaone]

CamelotPW, well said I agrtee with almost everything . However you said;

Quote by: CamelotPW Atheists have no knowledge of gods

This is not correct. Atheists have no belief in God . It is theoretically possible for there to be Gnostic Atheists. I think such a person's brain might explode from the stress but it is no more illogical then the millions of people who believe that {....fill in with disproven myths of choice...} yet still continue to call themselves {....choose your favorite irrational group, Christian, Mormon, Scientologist, Holocaust denier that relates to your above disproven myth...}

[Cruella]

BBC NEWS | UK | 'No God' campaign draws complaint The campaign is in trouble already. Stephen Green, however, has a habit of suing everyone for any kind of atheist opinion though, and stages many protests about things he dislikes, like poetry and hates the BBC because they showed "Jerry Springer the Opera" on National TV.

[Chancellor]

Quote by: Jack So instead of just making an unfounded contention, how about providing some scientific research that supports this. Otherwise I can easily dismiss one person's opinion when it attempts to counter hundreds of experiments and mountains of evidence. In short, I don't believe you until you can back up what you think. But do it in the appropriate thread. Attempts to further distract this thread from its topic are not appreciated.

I'm not sure what common descent (something acknowledged both in evolution and in creationism, though with slightly different meaning) has to do with atheism.

What irritates me about all this kind of nonsense is this sick, perverted notion that only certain groups should be allowed to express themselves freely in a secular society - whether it's so-called "Christians" suing to have a "There is probably no God" sign removed from a bus or idiot leftists pushing their political correctness crap.

[Chancellor]

Quote by: isaone This is not correct. Atheists have no belief in God.

Or, perhaps more accurately, absolutely believe that there is no God or other deities, divine/supernatural beings, etc.

It is theoretically possible for there to be Gnostic Atheists.

No, I really don't think that's even remotely possible. Gnosticism is a theistic religion. Atheism absolutely precudes any kind of theistic belief. If you really meant "agnostic atheists," then that's a contradiction in terms because agnostics don't know whether there is a God (or that one cannot know) and atheists claim to know there is no God (or at least have an affirmative belief that there is no God).

[Cruella]

I always thought that atheism was just as much a belief system as religion itself. One believes god exists, and one doesn't. I thought agnosticism was not believing either way. Am I wrong?

[Chancellor]

Quote by: CruellaDeChaCha I always thought that atheism was just as much a belief system as religion itself. One believes god exists, and one doesn't. I thought agnosticism was not believing either way. Am I wrong?

It doesn't have to be a religious belief to be a belief system.

[Cruella]

I didn't say it was, and that wasn't what I asked. Sheesh.

Atheism is a belief system, and religion/theism is a belief system. One believes in god, one believes there isn't. Therefore they are both belief systems, albeit one religious, one anti-religious (so to speak). Agnosticism is the absence of belief - or merely, just waiting to be convinced one way or the other - therefore not a belief system, and so is different to atheism and theism/religion.

I can't believe I had to clarify the question on this board of all places.

[Jack]

Quote by: Chancellor I'm not sure what common descent (something acknowledged both in evolution and in creationism, though with slightly different meaning) has to do with atheism.

It doesn't, which is why I suggested it be followed up in a more appropriate thread. Still, when someone makes a claim with nothing to substantiate it, asking for evidence is reasonable.

[CamelotPW]

Quote by: isaone CamelotPW, well said I agrtee with almost everything . However you said; This is not correct. Atheists have no belief in God . It is theoretically possible for there to be Gnostic Atheists. I think such a person's brain might explode from the stress but it is no more illogical then the millions of people who believe that {....fill in with disproven myths of choice...} yet still continue to call themselves {....choose your favorite irrational group, Christian, Mormon, Scientologist, Holocaust denier that relates to your above disproven myth...}

Excuse me, I worded that phrase wrong. When I was typing it, the way I was thinking made them go hand in hand. An Atheist does not have any knowledge in a god(s) ( An Atheist can't prove a god(s) exist), therefore, they have no belief in them.

I'm not sure, I may be mixing them up.

[isaone]

Quote by: Chancello Or, perhaps more accurately, absolutely believe that there is no God or other deities, divine/supernatural beings, etc.

Quote by: CruellaDeChaCha Atheism is a belief system

Sorry but incorrect(IMO) on both counts. A person who is without ("A") a belief in God is an Atheist. Someone who had never ever heard of God(s) and lacks the belief for that reason is just as much an Atheist as someone who has heard all about it and chosen to not believe. The act of believing is that action that makes a person a Theist. Anyone who does not 'Believe' for whatever reason becomes an Atheist. "Not believing" is the results of lacking belief . It is not a believe in and of itself.

Quote by: Chancellor No, I really don't think that's even remotely possible. Gnosticism is a theistic religion.

OK by that perfectually correct use of the term Gnostic you are correct. My usage is meant to mean 'knowing' in the general definition not the specific religion. IN other words it is possible for someone to 'know' there is a God and yet choose to believe there is not. As I said such a person deserves a award for self contradiction but they would have a lot of humans to share it with since we are all very talented in that area .

[Cruella]

Well, I still don't consider myself an atheist.

[GeminiBrian]

[QUOTE]

Quote by: loser Why do you consider Dawkin's comment "tongue-in-cheek"? Do you think that he really believes in God or just isn't really sure?

Are you serious?

Nothing odd about it at all. In psychotherapy, it's called Being In Denial.

Psychotherapy - yet another false religion based on twaddle.

[Jack]

Quote by: CamelotPW Excuse me, I worded that phrase wrong. When I was typing it, the way I was thinking made them go hand in hand. An Atheist does not have any knowledge in a god(s) ( An Atheist can't prove a god(s) exist), therefore, they have no belief in them. I'm not sure, I may be mixing them up.

It's bound to be confusing for all of us because we don't all fit into the mold that is clearly defined "atheist" or "agnostic". Dictionary definitions abound, yet many of us don't find any definition that completely defines our particular view of theism.

Just to further confuse the issue, my attitude is that agnosticism deals with knowledge while atheism addresses belief. When Huxley invented the word, he said,

When I reached intellectual maturity, and began to ask myself whether I was an atheist, a theist, or a pantheist; a materialist or an idealist; a Christian or a freethinker, I found that the more I learned and reflected, the less ready was the answer; until at last I came to the conclusion that I had neither art nor part with any of these denominations, except the last. The one thing in which most of these good people were agreed was the one thing in which I differed from them. They were quite sure that they had attained a certain "gnosis"--had more or less successfully solved the problem of existence; while I was quite sure I had not, and had a pretty strong conviction that the problem was insoluble. And, with Hume and Kant on my side, I could not think myself presumptuous in holding fast by that opinion ...

[Quoted in Encylopaedia of Religion and Ethics, 1908, edited by James Hastings MA DD]
He also wrote,

Agnosticism, in fact, is not a creed, but a method, the essence of which lies in the rigorous application of a single principle. That principle is of great antiquity; it is as old as Socrates; as old as the writer who said, 'Try all things, hold fast by that which is good'; it is the foundation of the Reformation, which simply illustrated the axiom that every man should be able to give a reason for the faith that is in him, it is the great principle of Descartes; it is the fundamental axiom of modern science. Positively the principle may be expressed: In matters of the intellect, follow your reason as far as it will take you, without regard to any other consideration. And negatively: In matters of the intellect, do not pretend that conclusions are certain which are not demonstrated or demonstrable. That I take to be the agnostic faith, which if a man keep whole and undefiled, he shall not be ashamed to look the universe in the face, whatever the future may have in store for him.

[" Agnosticism," 1889]

Atheism is, I think, rather clearly the lack of belief in gods, period. Since I lack a belief in gods, I can reasonably describe myself as an atheist. Yet in the pursuit of knowledge I employ and endorse agnosticism and skepticism. So I'm an agnostic in the quest for knowledge, but an atheist when it comes to belief in gods. I'm also an aNellyist when it comes to belief in the Loch Ness Monster and an aYetiist when it comes to belief in Big Foot.

[linda_mary_13]

Quote by: isaone I see two important reasons for such advertising To let the majority believers get used to the fact we exist. This will greatly in our getting respected and listened to when we ask for fairness To allow people who are unsure of their beliefs and afraid of 'coming out' ti think about Atheism as a viable option instead of something that is too terrible to consider

What fairness haven't you received and who doesn't give you respect?

What people are afraid to say they don't know or are unsure of their belief in God? You can say you believe in elves in America and America accepts you. Americans say what they believe, they are not afraid.

Atheism has always been an option. It sounds like you want to make it a "cool" choice more than just the personal choice of people.

If you could imagine God to be the most perfect existance why would you not consider that?

The majority of believers know you exist, and live side by side each day as neighbors. What more are you looking for in recognition?

[Maryjane]

What fairness haven't you received and who doesn't give you respect?

Shall we start with the president of the United States?

No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God. President George Bush, to Robert Sherman of American Atheist Press, at the Chicago airport while announcing federal disaster relief for Illinois

Imagine dating as an atheist. There's that whole unequally yoked thing.

Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? What harmony is there between Christ and Belial? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever? What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: “I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people.” Therefore come out from them and be separate, says the Lord. Touch no unclean thing, and I will receive you. I will be a Father to you, and you will be my sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty. 2 Corinthians 6:14-18

From personal experience, when an atheist announces their non belief in god(s), the religious person they tell often literally takes a step back away from them. Their jaw drops. Then they eye them up and down, as if they can't fathom the notion.

If you could imagine God to be the most perfect existance why would you not consider that?

Who says atheist haven't considered it? Better yet, why do we have to? Because it's the cool thing to do?

The majority of believers know you exist, and live side by side each day as neighbors. What more are you looking for in recognition?

The majority of believers know non believers exist, yes that's true .I came out to my neighbor three years ago. His initial response? "I can't believe that!" Why would my neighbor, who I've lived next door to for 8 years be so shocked at my announcement? He knows I'm a hard working citizen and a good mother. He knows I take care of my property and am friendly, happy, and upbeat most of the time. I'll tell you why....Because there are so many misconceptions about atheists. (our own president's words didn't help matters much) Is it so incredible that we too want to speak freely about the things that are important to us?
Indeed, why should we have to hide who we are spiritually? I guess getting told you are going to hell several times over the course of you life makes that kind of impact on you?

[Maryjane]

Quote by: CruellaDeChaCha BBC NEWS | UK | Atheists launch bus ad campaign Would it work elsewhere?

In the States? Tell you what, to any atheist here with a prominent home location, put a sign up stating the same, I'll put up $25 to the first one just to see the reaction you get and if the sign lasts a week.

$50 if you are in the bible belt.