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Thread: Why do the religious seek to decieve or distort, what about the truth?

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    Hot Lava Aussie's Avatar
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    Why do the religious seek to decieve or distort, what about the truth?

    I've seen it all my life, and now on this site also. You only have to read creationist threads to see it at full tilt here.

    Why are you so afraid of the truth? Will it bring Christianity down? Will your whole world come crashing down? Science is now providing the answers for what used to be attributed to Gods. As time goes on the god gaps will slowly be filled, what then?

    Believe what you will, good on you! But why try and stop progress? I dont believe in the Bible but I respect peoples beliefs, but not when it flies against all logic and common sense and attempts to cloud many many issues.

    What do you think your God wants for you? It seems the religious are quick to defend their book, but never seem to read it. YOu know those parts, do unto others, etc. It seems people are able to read the Bible, but aren't getting the message.
    I reject your reality and insert my own!

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    Life's A Ball! loser's Avatar
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    Your question is based on a false premise. The truth is the exact opposite. What Christianity is about is REJECTING deception and distortion of truth. Since you are a non-believer you can't see this.

    Christians DELIGHT in the truth! However, truth is quite elusive and not everyone can grasp it. For most, it is easier to be deceived by lies.

    Science has always been a friend of God because science bears out the truths of God and His creation. However, sinful scientists, deceived by Satan, believe that they are WISER because they reject God's wisdom. They are not. They are believing lies. Professing to be wise, they have become fools.

    Christians aren't trying to stop progress. What makes you say that? Because they are against abortions? Birth control? Against cloning? Homosexuality? Evolution? How do you feel that any of these things are helping mankind to progress?

    My religion doesn't fly in the face of reason and logic or common sense. Instead, it is BASED on those things! I am Logic User ; logic is what moves me! If God was not logical or reasonable, I simply wouldn't believe. It frustrates me to no end because other say they don't believe in God because they ARE logical. Bull hockey! If they WERE logical, they would use reason and see that the Christian religion is NOT based on superstition and myth but on cold, hard facts. The Bible contains scientific facts that, at the time of its writing, flew in the face of everything that was currently being taught. It is full of wisdom, not ignorance.

    Your last question was the hardest: "What do you think your God wants for you?" I'm not sure if you really meant "for" or if you meant to say "from". What he wants for SOME of us is the same that the Marines wants: a few GOOD men! God is looking to CHOOSE a very few who He will elect to serve with Jesus to rule over humanity here on earth in the future.

    What he wants FROM us is to act like humans (created in His image) instead of animals (our deceived fallen sinful nature). IOW, He wants us to be altruistic. This is the opposite of what Ayn Rand taught. It's no wonder she is a favorite of those who reject religion.

    My question, in reply, is to ask why non-believers feel they must smear believers with mindsets and attitudes they simply don't possess. Why?
    There is only one right answer and, yet, you still argue with me..

    I'm the proof that evolution works...

    You're the proof that it doesn't.


    Ask your doctor if thinking is right for you.

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    Becoming Unstable Thanatos's Avatar
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    If you delight in truth why are you always so poorly researched? You once told me you had no idea how radioactive dating was done and didn't believe there were microscopes powerful enough to see any atom. Either you're afraid or just so confident in your truth that you didn't even try.
    Doesn't that mean most people are trolls?

    No, it means most people on forums are called trolls at one point or another for stating their opinion honestly.

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    100% Agnostic Rogue Cardinal's Avatar
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    As a recovering Christian.....in other words agnostic, I understand the allure of religion. It's really damn hard to leave something that been so ingrained into your persona.

    To any religion it's not that they are scared of the truth, but they do have issues with the truth being different from what their perception of a truth is. They really believe what they think is real, IS real. In the back of their mind there is the eternal question, "What if I am wrong?" If they leave the religion then the price is HIGH. Do you want to risk going to Hell? So they are scared of leaving. it's the stranglehold the religions (not all) put on people. The wagered price of being wrong is simply to great to leave it even if something else proves to be true.

    Why would religion or God be against abortions? Birth control? Against cloning? Homosexuality? Evolution?

    Abortions are a really simple matter in terms of religion, especially Christianity. "Thou shall not murder".....Abortion is murder in the eyes of a christian so you don't do it. Also that one less potential Christian in the long run!

    Birth Control? Again this comes from Catholic ideas and is really a matter of saving a life to convert a life.

    Cloning....if man can play God...then who is God really? This allows the doors to all sorts of worms to be opened that Christians don't want to deal with. If man can make what God can make then man is God. Man shouldn't be god....even though we all know man is God.

    Homosexuality? This is my favorite one. God allows the creation of abominations ans we as people are to treat them badly based on some cryptic passages in the bible at best. The GREAT thing about the homosexuality stuff as that it's not something you find in the NEW Testament. It's something that Christians take from the OLD testament (you know the covenant between God and the JEWS), it's old law that doesn't even apply to Christians. What's more awesome than that is how they pick and choose which of those old laws they will adhere to and which ones they will toss. Can't eat pork in the Old Testament but you know as well as I do the there are plenty of Southern Baptists that get down on some bacon on Sunday, right before they go off to church to freak out about homosexuals.

    So how does homosexuality HELP the world?? Population control I guess. If you have too many people you use up all your resources. Man doesn't like homosexuality....therefore God has to not like it also.

    I ask you how does birth control, abortion, homosexuality and the likes HURT the world? You can't even think of a good answer other than God doesn't like it.

    loser simply scoffs in the face of logic. As of yet.....and I'm new here....he/she has yet to provide any logic as to why you are illogical for not believing in something that he/she cannot remotely prove exists.
    Christians don't know God anymore than you or I do.

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    Hucking Fuskies HelioPrime's Avatar
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    I still don't get why some people place science as so hostile to religion. I don't personally know of anyone who believes in the exact creationist story but according to some people the disproving of that story means my religion is debunked?
    What do you say to an atheist who sneezes?
    Yourdeadthatsit!


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    Hot Lava gela's Avatar
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    Christians aren't trying to stop progress. What makes you say that? Because they are against abortions? Birth control? Against cloning? Homosexuality? Evolution? How do you feel that any of these things are helping mankind to progress?
    Abortions:
    Are helping overpopulation.
    Birthcontrol:
    same thing. Condoms also stop the spread of disease.
    Against Cloning:
    Cloning and other forms of genetic engineering have the potential to feed more people, with less resources.
    Homosexuality:
    Do I really need to explain this one?
    Humanity does not need more divisions amongst us. The more time and energy we spend bickering over what people do with their private sex life, the less time and energy we have for more important things.
    Evolution:
    Everyone wants to know the nature of life. By shutting your eyes and screaming 'god did it', you are stunting any future progress towards that goal.

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    100% Agnostic Rogue Cardinal's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: HelioPrime View Post
    I still don't get why some people place science as so hostile to religion. I don't personally know of anyone who believes in the exact creationist story but according to some people the disproving of that story means my religion is debunked?
    Well if your religion emphatically states that God created the universe and everything in it and it's proven that your absolutely wrong and your religion is wrong....then yeah, that by itself pretty much does debunk your religion.

    Your religion starts at that place with a point of showing just how powerful God is. But if science can answer that God didn't create it then what do you have to cling to, to believe that God did?

    Would you then argue that because God "teaches" morals and values to people that they should cling to say Christianity? Many religions teach the same types of things. Many people that aren't religious just figure it out because it's common sense.
    Christians don't know God anymore than you or I do.

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    Hot Lava Aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: loser View Post
    Your question is based on a false premise. The truth is the exact opposite. What Christianity is about is REJECTING deception and distortion of truth. Since you are a non-believer you can't see this.

    Christians DELIGHT in the truth! However, truth is quite elusive and not everyone can grasp it. For most, it is easier to be deceived by lies.

    Science has always been a friend of God because science bears out the truths of God and His creation. However, sinful scientists, deceived by Satan, believe that they are WISER because they reject God's wisdom. They are not. They are believing lies. Professing to be wise, they have become fools.

    Christians aren't trying to stop progress. What makes you say that? Because they are against abortions? Birth control? Against cloning? Homosexuality? Evolution? How do you feel that any of these things are helping mankind to progress?

    My religion doesn't fly in the face of reason and logic or common sense. Instead, it is BASED on those things! I am Logic User ; logic is what moves me! If God was not logical or reasonable, I simply wouldn't believe. It frustrates me to no end because other say they don't believe in God because they ARE logical. Bull hockey! If they WERE logical, they would use reason and see that the Christian religion is NOT based on superstition and myth but on cold, hard facts. The Bible contains scientific facts that, at the time of its writing, flew in the face of everything that was currently being taught. It is full of wisdom, not ignorance.

    Your last question was the hardest: "What do you think your God wants for you?" I'm not sure if you really meant "for" or if you meant to say "from". What he wants for SOME of us is the same that the Marines wants: a few GOOD men! God is looking to CHOOSE a very few who He will elect to serve with Jesus to rule over humanity here on earth in the future.

    What he wants FROM us is to act like humans (created in His image) instead of animals (our deceived fallen sinful nature). IOW, He wants us to be altruistic. This is the opposite of what Ayn Rand taught. It's no wonder she is a favorite of those who reject religion.

    My question, in reply, is to ask why non-believers feel they must smear believers with mindsets and attitudes they simply don't possess. Why?
    Loser, most of this applies to you. You should finish every comment of yours with "I insert your reality and insert my own!"

    Bible full of scientific facts, like people living to 800? You are whats wrong with religion.
    I reject your reality and insert my own!

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    Sapere Aude Jack's Avatar
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    Let's remember to civilly debate the topic. Personal comments aren't necessary.
    [do not respond]


    The Forum Rules

    Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.
    [John F. Kennedy]
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    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    I've seen it all my life, and now on this site also. You only have to read creationist threads to see it at full tilt here.
    Okay. And what is this Thing that you have seen, Mr. Aussie? What is this {great} and terrible Thing that you have seen on creationist threads?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    Why are you so afraid of the truth?
    And one would conclude that those whom you have tried to vilify and calumniate will be asking you the same question: Mr. Aussie why are you so afraid of truth?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    Will it bring Christianity down?
    Will it bring atheism down? Will it cause atheism and all that it has established to fall as lightening?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    Will your whole world come crashing down?
    Will your whole world come crashing down? Will the whole world of atheism come crashing down?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    Science is now providing the answers for what used to be attributed to Gods.
    And may also be said, that science is now providing answers for those things which were said to only be myths, fables, and legends.

    I. Scientists and Aesop’s Fables and Other Odd Labels

    II. Draco

    III. " MYTHS" OF THE PAST TURN OUT TO BE TRUE HISTORY; Archaeologists Demonstrate That Herodotus Was Not "The Father of Lies," That the Old Legends Were Facts, and Even the Maiden Tribute to the Minotaur Is Historic.



    By the way, if the atheist argument says that God does not exist, and science is providing answers for those things which are attributed to a God who is said not to exist, then what does the fact that science is providing answers for things which are attributed to a being who is said not to exist, say about the atheist argument that says that God does not exist?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    As time goes on the god gaps will slowly be filled, what then?
    Atheism will have to recede and retreat back from whence it came?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    Believe what you will, good on you! But why try and stop progress?
    Then why are you?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    I dont believe in the Bible but I respect peoples beliefs, but not when it flies against all logic and common sense and attempts to cloud many many issues.
    Don’t you mean your {logic} and your {common sense?}

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    What do you think your God wants for you?
    And what do you think your god wants for you?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    It seems the religious are quick to defend their book, but never seem to read it.
    Then how are they able to defend their book?

    Quote Quote by: Aussie View Post
    YOu know those parts, do unto others, etc. It seems people are able to read the Bible, but aren't getting the message.
    Now, which message would that be, Mr. Aussie? Which message are they not getting?

    Secondly, which people are you referring to? Which people are not getting the Bible’s message? Atheists? Christians? Muslims? Jews?




    By the way, who are the {religious} people that you are referring to in the title? Who are the religious people who seek to deceive and distort the truth? Care to name those people? They wouldn’t happen to be the members of the group who have been identified as America’s most distrusted minority?

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    Stephen Best barts's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: loser View Post

    My religion doesn't fly in the face of reason and logic or common sense.

    What [God] wants for SOME of us is the same that the Marines wants: a few GOOD men! God is looking to CHOOSE a very few who He will elect to serve with Jesus to rule over humanity here on earth in the future.
    God is, apparently, omniscient, omnipresent (in time and space), omnipotent, and omnibenevolent. Why would such a Being want anything? What's to want? A few good men? Create them. A Being that can create an infinite universe, and manipulate it at will ought to be able to conjure up a few good men without breaking a sweat. According to Christians, He created quite a few bad ones. So many he had to destroy them all except one family with a flood.

    Why does God need or want anyone to rule over humanity with Jesus. Can't God, who seems pretty competent, and Jesus do it on their own? Take you, for example, loser, what do you think you might have in the way of skills or knowledge to help God rule humanity that he/she/it doesn't already have?

    If God wants something He mustn't be perfect, it would seem to me.

    No doubt my quibbles lack common sense and aren't logical.
    Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd - Voltaire

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    I'm the camel samsara15's Avatar
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    HE's taking Creation Science 101, Barts, and this is HIS first universe. I don't think HE's going to get an A or a B...
    Today's ideological enemies may be tomorrow's allies, and vice versa. So be nice to your enemies, you may need their help tomorrow.

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