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This topic in Philosophy & Religion is about Do the Past and Future exist?.

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Old Apr 27, 2008, 11:26 am   #1 (permalink) (top)
sdbest
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Do the Past and Future exist?

We have memories. We call them the "Past." We can anticipate what might happen in a few minutes, tomorrow, a millennium from now, and we name that the "Future." But in reality do the Past or the Future truly exist or are they merely figments of our memories and imaginations?


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 11:59 am   #2 (permalink) (top)
Jack
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I'm fairly Taoistic on this subject. I believe the present moment is the only reality. The rest is just a function of our brain, a side-effect of consciousness.


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 12:04 pm   #3 (permalink) (top)
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Scientifically, time is relative, so past and future are really the present, just bent.


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 12:05 pm   #4 (permalink) (top)
suijurisfreeman
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Several years ago I read Julian Barbour's book The End of Time: The Next Revolution in Physics. Interesting reading, if I remember correctly his concept of time is that there is no past or future only the now.


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 12:38 pm   #5 (permalink) (top)
Walrus
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I would say that only the present can be said to exist, but if we get into the realms of metaphysics I am equally sure that I am probably wrong.


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 01:47 pm   #6 (permalink) (top)
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If the past and future did not exist then there would be no chain of causality. Without past and future, I would never be able to make it to the next word in this sentence because what lies before this exact letter is the past and what lies after this exact letter is the future.

The "present" is only the smallest fraction of an instant. I think I would have a more successful time arguing that the "present" doesn't exist. It could be argued that every action a human takes and every piece of sensory input we receive take place in the past.

The computer I am looking at right now does not actually exist in the present. There is a lag time for the light to bounce off it, hit my eyes, and be interpreted by my brain. There is a lag time as my fingers touch it, register resistance, and move over its keyboard. That lag time means that the object I am interacting with in what I perceive as the "present" actually only exists in the past and all of my actions that interact with the object are also occurring in the past.

The past sets the precedent for the future. The present, if it can even be said to exist, suffers from being infinitely divisible so why bother attempting to live in such an infinitesimal speck of time when you have the limitless fields of precedent and possibility on either side of it?
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Old Apr 27, 2008, 02:17 pm   #7 (permalink) (top)
Walrus
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In human terms, I would say the present exists for as long as it takes us to comprehend it, which isn’t long, but in order for us to function; we must also have the ability to use memory and forethought.


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 09:01 pm   #8 (permalink) (top)
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Spaceballs - when will then, be now?


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 09:58 pm   #9 (permalink) (top)
Jack
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By the time you say, "now", it's no longer that now. The present moment is incomprehensible, but it must exist since we're all experiencing it, eh?


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 10:20 pm   #10 (permalink) (top)
LadiesMan217
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Quote by: sdbest
We have memories. We call them the "Past." We can anticipate what might happen in a few minutes, tomorrow, a millennium from now, and we name that the "Future." But in reality do the Past or the Future truly exist or are they merely figments of our memories and imaginations?
I do not think they exist in the sense that we usually think of them, such as destinations for time travel, which is why I don't think time travel is possible or will ever be possible.


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Old Apr 27, 2008, 10:21 pm   #11 (permalink) (top)
Dadoo
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as soon as it is,

it is gone


Perhaps there is no present, nor past nor future.
Perhaps causality is a product of a circular river; always changing, ever the same.

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Unseen is another sun at your midnight dream.
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Old Apr 28, 2008, 12:40 am   #12 (permalink) (top)
Winter wind
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However, past and future must exist to some degree. Like there was a time before I ate the cookie, there is a time when I am eating a cookie and there is a time when I'm through eating the cookie. This is undeniable. So past and future must exist, somehow


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Old Apr 28, 2008, 11:38 am   #13 (permalink) (top)
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However, past and future must exist to some degree. Like there was a time before I ate the cookie, there is a time when I am eating a cookie and there is a time when I'm through eating the cookie. This is undeniable. So past and future must exist, somehow
The concept of "eating" takes place in the past, present, and future though. The bite you just swallowed is eaten. Your teeth closing down on the next bite is what will be eaten. The actual present moment of "eating" is so small it is immeasurable. Couple that with the fact that your sensation of eating in "real time" is delayed due to sensory lag and it would seem that there is no definable moment where you are actually "eating" a cookie in the textbook application of the term.

I think that all concepts of actions and events that take place in "present" time are 49.999999999999999% past, 49.999999999999999% future, and .000000000000001% in a present moment that is so short and disconnected from our perception of it that it can hardly be said to even exist.
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Old Apr 28, 2008, 01:09 pm   #14 (permalink) (top)
Winter wind
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Well the present is measuring something in the absents of time. When things aren't changing.


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Old Apr 28, 2008, 02:52 pm   #15 (permalink) (top)
Morality Games
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I typically take the eternalist approach to this subject, which is that past, present, and future exist all at once. I wouldn't be too disappointed if presentism turned out to be true, however.


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Old Apr 28, 2008, 03:50 pm   #16 (permalink) (top)
Rainbow
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do the Past or the Future truly exist or are they merely figments of our memories and imaginations?
Both.

Example :
Freeze the Universe for a moment.
All the elements within that Universe are being mapped on XYZ scale.
That includes every single atom your heart is made of ; all the tissues ; all the organs ; etc. within your body.
A guy next to you ; and/or walking down the street ; a desk your computer stands on ; a plane with all passengers on the board ; etc.
That applies to all species in the water, sky, ground, etc. It applies to planet Earth ; MilkyWay Galaxy ; Andromeda Galaxy ; etc. All the Galaxies within the Universe we live-in.
All the atoms have their own and unique position on that XYZ scale, in that particular moment.
That is the configuration what we call : Present - Configuration #1
After a time elapses, that Configuration #1 is being erased and/or re-freshed and a new configuration emerges - that is the most actual and/or updated one, what we call Configuration #2.
That new Configuration #2, we call Present as well. However, Configuration #1 becomes the Past - since it is outdated, and does not reflect actual events and/or state any longer.
The Future, is an alleged Configuration #3, that May appear after elapsed period of time and it is greater than the value for the next most-actual Configuration that stands for Presence.
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Old May 1, 2008, 03:02 pm   #17 (permalink) (top)
Dadoo
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Yet in the moment,I needn't think of all that.
When asked how he kept all his feet in order, the millipede tripped and fell down.
Glass ceilings and our wonderful ignorance of them!
Don't trip,
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Old May 1, 2008, 03:35 pm   #18 (permalink) (top)
Thanatos
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Scientifically, time is relative, so past and future are really the present, just bent.
Correct, more or less. Relativity implies strongly that time is a dimension, just like up or down and left or right. Just because we're so used to going in one direction does not mean one could not go backwards.

Whether the future exists is open for more debate. Relativity implies yes, but quantum physics implies that the future is perpetually uncertain because its impossible to know anything with infinite detail in the present.

Quantum physics also implies that things that are not being observed behave in very, very odd ways. Its not at all clear what would happen if you tried to travel to the future at anything other than the normal rate.


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Old May 1, 2008, 06:13 pm   #19 (permalink) (top)
Lullaby Chainer
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well, if you think of time as another dimension, then yes.. every point in time exists


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Old May 6, 2008, 12:38 pm   #20 (permalink) (top)
Rainbow
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Whether the future exists is open for more debate. Relativity implies yes, but quantum physics implies that the future is perpetually uncertain because its impossible to know anything with infinite detail in the present.

Quantum physics also implies that things that are not being observed behave in very, very odd ways. Its not at all clear what would happen if you tried to travel to the future at anything other than the normal rate.
That may not be the issue of the Future (itself), but Time-Space dimension and the approach we take, using a comparison scale and/or chart with concern to all events that take place (with)in the Universe.
Yet, the speed of Light is the key factor.
(It seems we are trapped within the Light, since we are Unable to break the Light's limitations. I believe that by manipulating the speed of Light we would be able to enter different dimensions.)
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