christianity vs. Aethism

[christianmathew]

Well, being a christian I obviously have my own views on this topic. But I was wondering what other people thought about christianity vs. aethism. Post, write what you want, whatever. I just want to hear your opinions.

[Zhavric]

MG summed it up nicely in the other thread:

Quote by: Morality Games Like most of the religious, Christians use double-standard logic in a very ignoble way. They will affirm their religion is true so long as there is a logical possibility it is true, but will not affirm evidence that contradicts their religion's authenticity so long as there is a logical possibility it is false. Since virtually anything can be possible under the conditions of their theoretical logic, they work themselves into a desire-driven paradigm where the only outcome can be their religion is true, irregardless of how implausible this seems scientifically, historically, or psychologically.

Christianity is intellectually dishonest. Atheism isn't because it uses the same set of logical rules for all claims. Jesus coming back from the dead is just as silly as Elvis or JFK coming back from the dead.

You're going to want to give this thread more focus or folks will be talking about Panda bear conservation by page 3.

[tommy5x]

Logically, you just said that atheism is a better argument because you don't use double standards. While this is true, constantly saying 'no' is no better.

If there is a God, in the Christian sense at least, then it makes sense for the Earth to have been created 7000 years ago-ish. If God can create the universe, he can falsify the evidence.

Zhavri, just because something seems unlikely, it does not become impossible.

[rez]

Quote by: christianmathew Well, being a christian I obviously have my own views on this topic. But I was wondering what other people thought about christianity vs. aethism. Post, write what you want, whatever. I just want to hear your opinions.

Christian Matthew it would be great if you could be a good little Christian and read the rules. Then read all the posts that discuss atheism and Christianity. Perhaps you can then formulate a non-redundant post for all of us to participate in.

[christianmathew]

Rez, that's just too bad for you. I don't spend all my life scanning every topic, and a fresh start is always nice. If you don't want to participate, go hide in a corner somewhere else.

[Zhavric]

Quote by: tommy5x constantly saying 'no' is no better.

Saying no to 1+1=3 is fine. Saying no to anything and everything that implies 1+1=(something that's not 2) is fine. We're not saying no to say no. We're saying no because it's the intellectually honest thing to do.

If there is a God, in the Christian sense at least, then it makes sense for the Earth to have been created 7000 years ago-ish. If God can create the universe, he can falsify the evidence.

Yes, but that's crap. It's not supported in scripture and has absolutely no evidence to support it. You and I could spend days inventing silly "what if" scenarios that can't be proven by are possible so long as we greatly scew our understanding of the word possible. But that would be retarded. What's far more important is what's proven. What is. The truth. That's what science is looking for and finding. That's what logic lets us know.

That's what we go by.

So, let me ask you this: what's the difference between something that's 100% undetectable in every conceivable way and something that doesn't exist?

Zhavri, just because something seems unlikely, it does not become impossible.

I agree. Where god is concerned, all the things we know to be true that god contradicts (without providing back-up evidence)... that makes god impossible.

[butterbut]

I beleive in God becuase of what he has done in my life. If that is not eveidence, then I don't know what is.

[Walrus]

Christianity vs. Atheism, that sounds so polarised and antagonistic, can’t the two coexist? As an atheist I am quite happy to get along with anyone who has religious beliefs, and I do; that is providing they don’t want to inflict those beliefs on me.

[Zhavric]

Quote by: butterbut I beleive in God becuase of what he has done in my life. If that is not eveidence, then I don't know what is.

Then you clearly don't know what evidence is.

I'm sorry, but that's the simple truth.

Assigning mythological motives to the positive things in your life and calling to "evidence" of an almighty is about the dumbest thing I can think of. Seriously, if religion weren't institutionalized, we'd question your sanity. I mean, what would you say to someone who said, "I believe in the devil because of what he has done in my lower intestine. If that is not evidence, then I don't know what is." Why should we have to tolerate that level of idiocy?

[butterbut]

Quote by: Zhavric Then you clearly don't know what evidence is. I'm sorry, but that's the simple truth. Assigning mythological motives to the positive things in your life and calling to "evidence" of an almighty is about the dumbest thing I can think of. Seriously, if religion weren't institutionalized, we'd question your sanity. I mean, what would you say to someone who said, "I believe in the devil because of what he has done in my lower intestine. If that is not evidence, then I don't know what is." Why should we have to tolerate that level of idiocy?

Your completely wrong. Just becuase I can't prove it to you doesn't mean its not evidence. You say I'm asinging "mythological motives" to positive things but it goes a lot deeper then that. He's given meaning to my life that you could never imagine.

If you only knew the Jesus I know.

[gallo]

Quote by: butterbut I beleive in God becuase of what he has done in my life. If that is not eveidence, then I don't know what is.

Well, we do know that you don't know what evidence is. Eveidence is another question.

[JaneDoe321]

Why are we only including Christianity? I think the more accurate thing would be "theism vs atheism" because, really, atheists aren't *JUST* rejecting the premise of Christianity, even though many of them they may have come from a "religion of birth" that is Christian of some flavor.

[christianmathew]

Well, I can personnally say that I agree a lot more with what butterbut is saying, though some facts might be nice.

Walrus, christianity and aethism can coexist, its just that they don't. As religions, it is possible for both two exist on earth. But the idea of Christianity directly opposes Aethism, and vice versa.

JaneDoe, I am christian, so I chose that, but in reality it is a debate on religion, what you called theism, vs. aethism. Christianity just seems to be a hotter topic than islam or buddhism on this debate forum.

Remember to keep it clean, or one of the moderators will but you.

[Voluntary]

Quote by: christianmathew Walrus, christianity and aethism can coexist, its just that they don't. As religions, it is possible for both two exist on earth. But the idea of Christianity directly opposes Aethism, and vice versa. .

I know this comment was not directed at me, but how can they co-exist on Earth. Do you feel comfortable in the idea that an atheist who lives a good life will suffer eternal damnation? Certainly it must bother you that God sends good people to hell.

[Tycoon]

I beleive in God becuase of what he has done in my life. If that is not eveidence, then I don't know what is.

That is in fact evidence against theism. Everything that has happened in your life can be explained by natural causes, and so there is no reason to expect God has had any influence in your life.

Your completely wrong. Just becuase I can't prove it to you doesn't mean its not evidence. You say I'm asinging "mythological motives" to positive things but it goes a lot deeper then that. He's given meaning to my life that you could never imagine.

You think that he has given meaning to your life. He hasn't given you anything, you've given it to yourself. If anything you're denying that you or other people could be the source of good things in your life and simply attributing it to God.

[Tycoon]

I know this comment was not directed at me, but how can they co-exist on Earth. Do you feel comfortable in the idea that an atheist who lives a good life will suffer eternal damnation? Certainly it must bother you that God sends good people to hell.

Christianity can't give you an answer to that question without defying God's supposed perfect morals. It's a question that can't be answered because it will always contradict one of the basics of religion, the belief that you must accept God.

[christianmathew]

Your right, that comment wasn't directed at anyone in particular.

They can coexist, as you see around you. There isn't a World War going on over christianity or aethism. So perhaps they can't coexist in one sense, but at least we aren't doing crusades or other religious wars.

Do you feel comfortable in the idea that an atheist who lives a good life will suffer eternal damnation? Certainly it must bother you that God sends good people to hell.

Yes, I am very comfortable with that idea. Every human being was given a chance to turn to God, so if they didn't do so, they are choosing to go to hell. I don't have proof that everyone was given a chance, so you can choose to believe me or not. Eternal damnation is the worst thing that it comes to, but if an aethist like walrus doesn't believe in god, that's his fault.

It does bother me that people will choose to go to hell, when it would be so easy just to be come christian. But there is no such thing as a good person, everyone has sinned and fallen short of the glory of god. So God doesn't send good people to hell, they don't exist.

But I am trying to get people's opinions, instead of debate, to the most I can, so I will stop there.

[christianmathew]

that last comment was directed at voluntary.

[Tycoon]

They can coexist, as you see around you. There isn't a World War going on over christianity or aethism. So perhaps they can't coexist in one sense, but at least we aren't doing crusades or other religious wars.

There is a fight raging between Christianity and Atheism however. Christianity is beginning to decline. 65% of Europeans are already Atheists.

Yes, I am very comfortable with that idea. Every human being was given a chance to turn to God, so if they didn't do so, they are choosing to go to hell. I don't have proof that everyone was given a chance, so you can choose to believe me or not. Eternal damnation is the worst thing that it comes to, but if an aethist like walrus doesn't believe in god, that's his fault

Doesn't God seem like a selfish, spoiled little child for demanding complete and blind loyalty? Especially considering all the evidence he put out to contradict his own existence?

It does bother me that people will choose to go to hell, when it would be so easy just to be come christian. But there is no such thing as a good person, everyone has sinned and fallen short of the glory of god. So God doesn't send good people to hell, they don't exist.

How do you not see that as just another example of Christian manipulation? Hell is just a tool to put fear into the people and make them run to Christianity's supposed salvation. God put so much evidence lying around against his own existence that I see no reason to buy into the fear factor of Christianity.

[Voluntary]

Quote by: christianmathew But I am trying to get people's opinions, instead of debate, to the most I can, so I will stop there.

You asked for an opinion and you got mine. I don't think atheism and christianity can coexist harmoniously on earth, when christians think they have this "truth" that other non-christians and non-believers do not have.