Some questions for the godless

[Zhavric]

Quote by: Anmon I think its important that kids have make believe, it plays a big part in their character development. I think theres too much unnecessary seriousness pushed on them at an early age now, like sex ed, and complex home work.

That's interesting how you came so close to the issue.

The worst thing pushed on kids is the make-believe their adults push on them... namely religion.

In the god delusion, Richard Dawkins offers a story from a woman who was molested by a priest. To sum up, the main point of the story is the worst thing the priest did to this woman... what really scarred her emotionally for life... the priest told her that her best friend (a non-Christian) was going to go to hell. She explains it as what it is: a kind of emotional abuse that was thrust on her before she was old enough to know any better.

Complex home work and sex ed help prepare children to take a responsible role in society. Having religion thrust on them from the age where they're old enough to think is one of the worst things that can happen to a kid.

[Jack]

I think theres too much unnecessary seriousness pushed on them at an early age now, like sex ed, and complex home work.

I suggest it's just the opposite. Kids these days have hundreds of outlets and opportunities for play and imagination. A hundred years ago, before child labor laws, children were often expected to work in the family store or company after school. They had chores that included housekeeping, milking cows, gathering eggs. When our life expectancies were shorter, children were expected to grow up faster and assume adult responsibilities at an earlier age.

[Will_00]

These are some deep things I have wondered about before, and it disturbs me just trying to imagine a reasonable answer to them. Firstly, God apparently he never began, he just always existed, even as a believer that hurts me, because how can something just always exist? But not to believe it means God had a beginning, which means he must have been created by something else, and what created that etc and so on so which is even less sense that leaves me with either God has always existed, or not at all.

Of course He Always Existed! Of course you cannot understand God - He is the Creator of All Things.

[gela]

These are some deep things I have wondered about before, and it disturbs me just trying to imagine a reasonable answer to them. Firstly, God apparently he never began, he just always existed, even as a believer that hurts me, because how can something just always exist? But not to believe it means God had a beginning, which means he must have been created by something else, and what created that etc and so on so which is even less sense that leaves me with either God has always existed, or not at all. So if he doesn't exist, then what created everything? And what was around before the universe got created? Another universe? And before that one etc and so on. Now we know the universe is huge, so huge we cant really comprehend how big it actually is. But say it does have a limit, which logically it should have, then what is past that?

*havent read the whole thread, may be repeating what someone else said*

I believe that the universe doesn't have a begining or an end - it is continuous.
It seems logical for it to have a begining and an end for us humans, because in our lives everything has a begining and an end - nothing lasts forever.
We just like to put a life time onto everything, because thats all we know.

[Anmon]

Quote by: gela I believe that the universe doesn't have a begining or an end - it is continuous. It seems logical for it to have a begining and an end for us humans, because in our lives everything has a begining and an end - nothing lasts forever. We just like to put a life time onto everything, because thats all we know.

Agreed gela, like I said before to someone else, its something probably beyond our comprehension.

[Will_00]

Agreed gela, like I said before to someone else, its something probably beyond our comprehension.

It is not infinite. Not at all - According to the Bible.

Anmon did you see the post I specifically directed to you, here?

[GSM:Xtreme]

A static universe, one would think, should be as acceptable to christians as the idea of god. If they say, "god just always existed", then why can't they just say the universe always existed, as is gela's view.

I'm a little shaky on the subject, but wasn't Einstein the guy who proved there wasn't a static universe after all?

I can't wait and see what developments we'll bring in this century in terms of M theory and the like. Should be exciting!

[gela]

So if he doesn't exist, then what created everything?

No one created everything.

The universe always existed, and it always will exist - in some for or another.

Like I said before, Humans just want to put a begining an an end on things, because everything in our world has a begining an end.

[Jack]

The same thing that "created" the Grand Canyon, natural processes, in this case erosion.

[Will_00]

I'm a little shaky on the subject, but wasn't Einstein the guy who proved there wasn't a static universe after all?

Einstein was partly involved in the theory that the Universe is constantly expanding, yet it was never fully developed until approximately a year ago or so.

[Voluntary]

Quote by: GSM:Xtreme I'm a little shaky on the subject, but wasn't Einstein the guy who proved there wasn't a static universe after all?

Yes, but then he developed the Cosmological constant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Basically, it was a fudge factor in order to fit into the dominant paradigm of a static universe despite the fact that his original equations told him otherwise. It was perhaps the only time Einstein recognize authority and dogma.

It is also know as Einstein's Greatest Blunder

"Much later, when I was discussing cosmological problems with Einstein, he remarked that the introduction of the cosmological term was the biggest blunder of his life". -- George Gamow, My World Line, 1970

[Sonart]

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Quote by: Voluntary "Much later, when I was discussing cosmological problems with Einstein, he remarked that the introduction of the cosmological term was the biggest blunder of his life". -- George Gamow, My World Line, 1970

It gets even more interesting (some of you have heard me tell this story)...

It eventually became accepted that the Universe, as Einstein had predicted, was expanding. The assumption was that the expansion would slow to a stop, due to the gravity of all the matter in the universe, and then begin contracting, to eventually collapse into a reverse Big Bang.

For renowned cosmologist and physicist Steven Hawking, this became his proof for Intelligent Design. His reasoning... the statistical probability of the Universe expanding at exactly the rate to make life on Earth possible was so incredibly minute -- billions to one -- as to be basically impossible as a random event. Had the Big Bang been a micro-nano percent stronger, the Universe would long since have expanded beyond what's compatable with life. Had it been a micro-nono percent weaker, it would have long since collapsed back on itself.

Nah, the odds were so outrageous that it could only have happened by design. In fact, the only POSSIBLE way that the Big Bang could have expanded to a point of making life on Earth possible within an acceptable range of random probability would be if the Universe were not only expanding, but ACCELERATING in that expansion.

At the time Hawking wrote this in his "A Brief History of Time", in 1988, no one was suggesting such a thing.
Well, guess what...!

"Given that the vast amounts of rationally explained scientific knowledge we now possess were all once unexplainable phenomena which we attributed to the workings of gods, the best bet is that those things we still don't know also have rational, scientific explanations that do not include gods. We just don't know what they are yet." -- Daniel's Wager

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