The Christian God Doesn't Hate Gays

[Tycoon]

It doesn't matter what you continually state, I will still Believe in what I KNOW to be correct and True and believe in the One and Only True God - which Is and Will Be Forever and Ever.

Well then believe it somewhere else, because you are ruining this debate with your nonsense.

Through Supernatural Acts, Faith, Belief, Truth, etc.

Faith and belief in what? The bible? That's circular logic. There is no reason to believe in the bible.

[Winter wind]

Quote by: Will_00 The Bible Always is True.

First off, if you work on a Sunday, according to Exodus 35:2, you should be put to death. Exodus 21:1-7 are the rules of owning a slave. Leviticus 11:7 says not only can you eat pork, you can't play football (made from pigs skin). Can't plant crops side by side, and you can't wear cloths made from two different threads. I'm going to guess you've broken one of the above laws a couple of times so even you probably don't follow all the rules of the Bible or know all of them.

Second, there are a many contradictions in the Bible ranging from Family tree:
MT 1:16 Jacob was Joseph's father.
LK 3:23 Heli was Joseph's father.

to underlying meaning:
MT 5:39, MT 5:44 Do not resist evil. Love your enemies.
LK 19:27 God is likened to one who destroys his enemies.

to memos:
MT 7:1-2 Do not judge.
MT 7:15-20 Instructions for judging a false prophet.

to vivid narrations:
MT 27:5 Judas hanged himself.
AC 1:18 He fell headlong, burst open, and his bowels gushed out.

Third, certain statements defy science. Not evolution, but rather that the sun revolves around the earth which standing upon pillars. And that monsters guard the edge of the sea.

Finally your logic on the Bible creates a loop.

If the Bible must be taken literally
Matthew 5
18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Then how can we literally take this statement:

"In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away."
Hebrew 8:13

Your logic means everything must be true, except if everything is true then the old covenant is obsolete, which can't be true because everything about the Bible is true, except if everything is true, the old covalent is obsolete...

A logical circle. However if you take my meaning saying that not everything in the Bible is literal and some has a deeper meaning, then the Bible makes logical sense.

Quote by: Hurt Will - you have to stop arguing assuming that Christianity is true, regardless of what you think (or know, as you've been saying) because no one else accepts it. Therefore, arguing using it would be completely pointless.

For the purposes of the thread, we have to assume it's true...

I'm siding with Will on this.

[Jack]

You are simply tweaking what the Bible says here. The Bible specifically states that homosexuality is a sin. 1 Corinthians 6:9: "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders."

I don't have to "tweak" it. Translations vary in how they word that passage.
1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (English Standard Version)
Or do you not know that the unrighteous[a] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (Wycliffe New Testament)
9 Whether ye know not, that wicked men shall not wield the kingdom of God? Do not ye err; neither lechers, neither men that serve maumets [neither men serving to idols], neither adulterers, neither lechers against kind, neither they that do lechery with men,
10 neither thieves, neither avaricious men [neither covetous men, or niggards], neither men full of drunkenness, neither cursers, neither raveners, shall wield the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (American Standard Version)
9 Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Obviously the term is open to interpretation for the reason I presented, people of that era had no concept of homosexuality as an orientation. They were referring strictly to behaviors that involved men acting toward each other as they would a woman. Behaviors which can be acted out by anyone.

They also thought illness was caused by demons. They were not sophisticated, nor should we expect them to be. They were people living in a Middle Eastern society 2000 years ago. Look at the Middle East today. In many places not much has changed.

[Piscean]

i knew you were a christian, why are you denying it on other threads? im like god, you cant hide from me

Just because I know what's written in the bible doesn't make me a "christian" I've spent countless hours studying aspects of science as well but that doesn't make me a scientist or a follower of science either. It helps to know where the people you're debating are coming from. My own beliefs are very individual and they don't fit me into any group. However I've noticed on this debate forum that this concept isn't understood and everyone thinks i must be shoved into a catagory where i belong. I however am an individual with no affiliation to any of the groups or catagories society provides for people to fit into. I hope you understand what I'm saying.

[Piscean]

Isherwood is quoting the bible in the thread above mine so do we need to throw him in the "christian" catagory now?

[Jack]

I was, but I was born again into atheism.

[Winter wind]

Sigh, the smart move...some days of the week I wish I were that lucky...

[Hurt]

Quote by: Winter wind First off, if you work on a Sunday, according to Exodus 35:2, you should be put to death. Exodus 21:1-7 are the rules of owning a slave. Leviticus 11:7 says not only can you eat pork, you can't play football (made from pigs skin). Can't plant crops side by side, and you can't wear cloths made from two different threads. I'm going to guess you've broken one of the above laws a couple of times so even you probably don't follow all the rules of the Bible or know all of them. Second, there are a many contradictions in the Bible ranging from Family tree: MT 1:16 Jacob was Joseph's father. LK 3:23 Heli was Joseph's father. to underlying meaning: MT 5:39, MT 5:44 Do not resist evil. Love your enemies. LK 19:27 God is likened to one who destroys his enemies. to memos: MT 7:1-2 Do not judge. MT 7:15-20 Instructions for judging a false prophet. to vivid narrations: MT 27:5 Judas hanged himself. AC 1:18 He fell headlong, burst open, and his bowels gushed out. Third, certain statements defy science. Not evolution, but rather that the sun revolves around the earth which standing upon pillars. And that monsters guard the edge of the sea. Finally your logic on the Bible creates a loop. If the Bible must be taken literally Matthew 5 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. Then how can we literally take this statement: "In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away." Hebrew 8:13 Your logic means everything must be true, except if everything is true then the old covenant is obsolete, which can't be true because everything about the Bible is true, except if everything is true, the old covalent is obsolete... A logical circle. However if you take my meaning saying that not everything in the Bible is literal and some has a deeper meaning, then the Bible makes logical sense. For the purposes of the thread, we have to assume it's true... I'm siding with Will on this.

Sorry, was thinking of another thread when I wrote that

[Will_00]

Well then believe it somewhere else, because you are ruining this debate with your nonsense.

How is in nonsense if It is True?

Faith and belief in what? The bible? That's circular logic. There is no reason to believe in the bible.

Faith and Belief in the One True God, as well as the Bible. As well, the beliefs you currently hold are circular. "Proof" is circular.

First off, if you work on a Sunday, according to Exodus 35:2, you should be put to death. Exodus 21:1-7 are the rules of owning a slave. Leviticus 11:7 says not only can you eat pork, you can't play football (made from pigs skin). Can't plant crops side by side, and you can't wear cloths made from two different threads. I'm going to guess you've broken one of the above laws a couple of times so even you probably don't follow all the rules of the Bible or know all of them.

These are books from the Old Testament, in which specific instructions were created to maintain what God created, yet it was renewed when Jesus came and saved All people from their sins. Of course, no one has ever followed all of the Bible, except Jesus Christ - because no one is perfect, except Him.

to underlying meaning: MT 5:39, MT 5:44 Do not resist evil. Love your enemies. LK 19:27 God is likened to one who destroys his enemies.

First of all, it states: "39But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also."
Here, it is simply stating to not take revenge. "If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also." When stated in Matthew 5:44, to Love your enemies, it is not directly related in the sense you proposed previously. As it states in Luke 19:27, All of Luke 19, is a parable.

to memos: MT 7:1-2 Do not judge. MT 7:15-20 Instructions for judging a false prophet.

Matthew 7:15-20 are not instructions for judging a false prophet. They are how to find false prophets and doctrines.

Third, certain statements defy science. Not evolution, but rather that the sun revolves around the earth which standing upon pillars. And that monsters guard the edge of the sea.

Numerous statements in the "Natural" world defy science, and do reference.

Your logic means everything must be true, except if everything is true then the old covenant is obsolete, which can't be true because everything about the Bible is true, except if everything is true, the old covalent is obsolete... A logical circle. However if you take my meaning saying that not everything in the Bible is literal and some has a deeper meaning, then the Bible makes logical sense.

All of the Bible is True. A large amount of It, though, intends for it to include numerous meanings.

Obviously the term is open to interpretation for the reason I presented, people of that era had no concept of homosexuality as an orientation. They were referring strictly to behaviors that involved men acting toward each other as they would a woman. Behaviors which can be acted out by anyone.

Yet, the Bible has no room for "interpretation," it is always True.

[SoylentGreen]

Will_00 All of the Bible is True. A large amount of It, though, intends for it to include numerous meanings.

and then you say:

Yet, the Bible has no room for "interpretation," it is always True.

Can you explain how the bible is "intended for it to include numerous meanings", while at the same time apparently, the Bible has no room for "interpretation,".

[Will_00]

Can you explain how the bible is "intended for it to include numerous meanings", while at the same time apparently, the Bible has no room for "interpretation,".

The Bible includes numerous meanings on a basis that an intention for all of It is existent.

[gela]

Sin is a choice.

Of course, no one has ever followed all of the Bible, except Jesus Christ - because no one is perfect, except Him.

So that means you have chosen to sin. When you chose to where that shirt that was made of cotton, with a nylon logo; or when you chose to eat bacon for breakfast, or when you chose to do the house work on a sunday:- you were as bad as the guy who chose to be gay.
The bible doesn't specify which sins are worth descrimination, and which sins are easily written of as the norm.

[gela]

Books do dictate all the aspects of a civilized culture, for that which is written becomes the law of the land, and that which is not written can change in the shifting sands of time, and cannot become like a stone to give us a solid and unchanging standard as our foundation for judgement.

A book might be the foundation for your judgement.
But I use my own logic in passing judgement thanks.

[Will_00]

So that means you have chosen to sin. When you chose to where that shirt that was made of cotton, with a nylon logo; or when you chose to eat bacon for breakfast, or when you chose to do the house work on a sunday:- you were as bad as the guy who chose to be gay. The bible doesn't specify which sins are worth descrimination, and which sins are easily written of as the norm.

You do not sin by simply putting on a shirt, or eat bacon for breakfast, etc. unless it is against some rule that was created by someone who has the ability to do so.

[gela]

You do not sin by simply putting on a shirt, or eat bacon for breakfast, etc. unless it is against some rule that was created by someone who has the ability to do so.

So the rules in the bible arn't very important.. ?

[Will_00]

So the rules in the bible arn't very important.. ?

Of course They Are! Where in the Bible does it state that it is a sin to put on a shirt voluntarily?

[gela]

Quote by: Winter Winds Leviticus 11:7 says not only can you eat pork, you can't play football (made from pigs skin). Can't plant crops side by side, and you can't wear cloths made from two different threads.

I feel like Im going in circles...

[Jack]

You are. Christians pick and choose from the Old Testament what they will accept and what they reject, with no Biblical support for their distinctions. If they are uncomfortable with gays, they choose to accept the O.T.'s condemnation of homosexual-like behavior. But if they want to wear clothes of mixed fabric, work on Sundays or eat pork, they conveniently ignore those prohibitions.

They have no rational explanation for their selectiveness, so they usually resort to circular excuse making or simple obfuscation.

[SoylentGreen]

Quote by: Will_00 The Bible includes numerous meanings on a basis that an intention for all of It is existent.

The Bible includes numerous meanings on a basis that an intention for all of I, is existent

[Jack]

Well, all the words are English, but the construction is certainly hard to fathom.