Homosexuality in the View of a Christian

[Anmon]

So you don't see the ACLU supporting them as being detrimental for society?

[Winter wind]

So you don't see the ACLU supporting them as being detrimental for society?

sound like a pundit.
The first amendment applies to everyone. it's not like the ACLU are on board with their ideals, rather that the ACLU thinks that this is a first amendment violation so they take up the case. They said right on that page that they did not support the ideals, only the lawsuit.

Politics makes strange bedfellows.

[Anmon]

Groups like NAMBLA shouldn't even be allowed to exist, let alone have freedom of speech.

[wyoguy]

Quote by: Winter wind I'm half chinese so believe me when I say, that was the sentiment about my parents. Chinese guy and a white girl, what a crime.

If you can concede equating homosexuality with racism, I will cease to equate homosexuality with alcoholism. Deal? Even though there are a lot of similar emotional and social issues common to all three, they are all each a different ballgame.

[Winter wind]

Quote by: wyoguy If you can concede equating homosexuality with racism, I will cease to equate homosexuality with alcoholism. Deal?

Sorry, no dice.

Homosexuality isn't harmful while alcoholism is.
You choose to drink alcohol, while the addiction can't be helped.

The movement against interracial marriage used the "sanctity of marriage" as an argument, same as homosexuality. And both of which were frowned upon by parents, I don't see major differences.

[Winter wind]

Quote by: anmon Groups like NAMBLA shouldn't even be allowed to exist, let alone have freedom of speech.

Because the first amendment applies only to those anmon approves?

Nuts and the fringe element are the unavoidable byproduct of a free-society, just like pornography is the unavoidable byproduct of free speech.

[Tycoon]

Groups like NAMBLA shouldn't even be allowed to exist, let alone have freedom of speech.

If you want to discuss pedophilia then make a thread about it. Pedophiles do not represent the homosexual population or make up a large number of the homosexual population. Pedophilia is wrong and harmful to children, homosexuality is not.

[Derach]

Now let's not be such strict literlists ...

First of all, those Bilblical passages about homosexuals are old testament, and we have been given a new covenant to live by that doesn't include sexual practices.

Secondly, that part of the Bible is metaphorical anyways ... like the 7 day creation story, or the 'world-wide' flood, or the life spans of early Jews exceeding 500 yrs ... or the resurrection of Jesus .... It's all symbolic in a literary work of beautiful poetry and ancient culture.

People can have sex with anyone they choose of legal age of consent. If your parents don't like it, too bad ... if your priest don't like it, you should find a new church.

Unbelievable to me how most Christians are anti-government involvment right wingers, but have no problem with the government telling them who to sleep with (or for that matter, who should reproduce). Double standard much??

[Tycoon]

Secondly, that part of the Bible is metaphorical anyways ... like the 7 day creation story, or the 'world-wide' flood, or the life spans of early Jews exceeding 500 yrs ... or the resurrection of Jesus .... It's all symbolic in a literary work of beautiful poetry and ancient culture.

Metaphorical how? Symbolic of what?

[christianmathew]

ok,
I have decided to step out of this one. It seems that there is a lot of metaphorically hot water around here, with people becoming a little too passionate, while repeating things and just getting mad.

I would say that of the recent posts, tycoon and winterwinds side seems to be controlling this debate. Sorry anmon. also, wyoguy seems to be a bit out of line with what he says, see "hang your nuts on a wall" on the previous posts.

If we were to end this now, against my better judgement and beliefs, it seems that tycoon and winterwind have won this debate, and homosexuality is alright, even in the views of a christian.

that is just my opinion.

[Tycoon]

homosexuality is alright, even in the views of a christian.

Perhaps, but only in the view of a well educated Christian. And that's the problem isn't it?

[christianmathew]

I agree with you, tycoon, and you attack my religion/relationship?

While you may be right on certain grounds, that is kind of offensive.

[Tycoon]

I agree with you, tycoon, and you attack my religion/relationship?

I'm not attacking your religion, I'm merely pointing out that most of Christianity tells their followers that homosexuality is wrong and evil.

[christianmathew]

If you were to line up ten random people in America, the odds are that no more than one or two are homosexual, and often less will even admit it. Christians, as with most people, attack what they do not trust, what they do not recognize, because they believe that new thing to be evil. If you look at one of my previous postings, I do show the verse that says that homosexuality is evil, so many christians take that at face value.

[Tycoon]

Christians, as with most people, attack what they do not trust, what they do not recognize, because they believe that new thing to be evil. If you look at one of my previous postings, I do show the verse that says that homosexuality is evil, so many christians take that at face value.

The untrustful behavior you described is homophobia. In the case of most Christians it's not that they are homophobic, but because they are taught homosexuality is wrong by the verse that you did post.

Of course, that verse basically contradicts everything else that Christianity teaches. It's just one of the many contradictions or loopholes that make us end up in pointless debates such as this.

[christianmathew]

I would agree with you, but being someone interested in psychology and medical pursuits (not to say that these are or are not my job), I have found that many people will develop slight cases, almost more like symptoms, which could be what most christians have.

These loopholes, you have to remember, were translated, written by different people, and at different times.
It is likely that if the bible, and there fore christianity, were a puzzle, we would take a long time building it, but in the end it would all fit together. It isn't all just a bunch of loopholes.

[HelioPrime]

Bump*

Interesting read here: Article on an admission by a former opponent of homosexuality.

The authors admission points to my theory that the hatred isn't based out of faith, but out of just personal lack of understanding. Being raised in a gay hating culture produces gay hating clergy and flock.

A Letter to Louise

[Tycoon]

The authors admission points to my theory that the hatred isn't based out of faith, but out of just personal lack of understanding. Being raised in a gay hating culture produces gay hating clergy and flock.

Supported by the bible... I understand the whole idea of how you can overcome homosexuality by not acting on those desires... but you could not give me a good reason why I shouldn't.

[Winter wind]

Quote by: christianmathew I have decided to step out of this one. It seems that there is a lot of metaphorically hot water around here, with people becoming a little too passionate, while repeating things and just getting mad. I would say that of the recent posts, tycoon and winterwinds side seems to be controlling this debate. Sorry anmon. also, wyoguy seems to be a bit out of line with what he says, see "hang your nuts on a wall" on the previous posts. If we were to end this now, against my better judgement and beliefs, it seems that tycoon and winterwind have won this debate, and homosexuality is alright, even in the views of a christian. that is just my opinion.

Wow, this is rare for a debate site.

I thank Christian Mathew.

But, I'm willing to continue the debate if there are any contenders left...

[Marilyn Monroe]

Quote by: Tycoon Supported by the bible... I understand the whole idea of how you can overcome homosexuality by not acting on those desires... but you could not give me a good reason why I shouldn't.

Depends on where you are at pertaining to "good". "Good" is subjective if you ask me. The bible is full of inconsistencies because it's all subjective type stuff wrapped up in the mystery of God.

Now the way the Catholics look at homosexuality is it's a sin I guess, but the homosexual should be treated with compassion. Thing is most everybody sins according to the bible or religion in general, so even if homosexuality is a sin, it's forgivable, so you could sin, sin, sin and then if you're a Protestant it wouldn't matter because believing in Jesus is all it takes, and if Catholic you just ask for forgiveness of your sins, you don't really have to name all the sins it can be rather vague, and then God would decide what He thinks is a sin that you've done, and automatically forgive them because you asked for it. I'm talking deathbed here, but even in everyday living you just have to ask forgiveness because honestly we only have a very incomplete notion of what a sin is in God's eyes. MHO is the bible was meant to be an interesting guidebook. You get some of the basics from it, and from there you proceed on. We have to treat homosexuals with kindness and love, or we are ourselves sinning towards them. That's the end of the story there.