Female power and peace in Iraq

[Athena]

I hope this thread gets some attention and you all contribute your wisdom, because this morning, I decided I am willing to go to Iraq as part of a citizen's peace mission. The foreign diplomats are arguing they should not have to go into a war zone. While grandmothers, and probably some mothers, are willing to put their lives on the line so their children and grandchildren do not have to. I have heard it said, and I believe it, if these conflicts were in the hands of women, they would be resolved peacefully.

Historically, the US probably never would have had a constitution if it had not been for the women who insisted human beings must behave civilly and began having dinners and encouraging social interaction. Before this, the men were so frustrated with their efforts to come to ageements, that they were ready to give up.

Some may hate this- but I think my best value is as woman. I don't suggest I have the diplomatic skills or governing know how of men. I just know good manners, and believe the best way to peace is through actions of good manners. I sure as blazes would not offend Muslims by acting like a man! Nor exposing more of my body than they believe is moral. My power is as a woman who lives by 3 rules.

1. We respect all people because we are respectful.

2. We act with dignity and protect the dignity of others.

3. We do all things with integrity and honor.

[butterbut]

I don't think the terrorists hate you becuase you don't respect them. They hate you becuase your an infidel. You can't negotiate with evil.

[SoylentGreen]

Athena I have heard it said, and I believe it, if these conflicts were in the hands of women, they would be resolved peacefully.

I really hate it when I see women put up on a pedestal. Women are not any better at resolving things than men are, they just do it differently.
Have you ever heard of Margaret Thatcher, she started a war for the purpose of boosting her ratings for the next election.
You do realise that you would be going into a patriarchal society where women are devalued and there opinion is worthless.
Are you really sure you want to go to Iraq, it will be a definite culture shock. If so I think your brave and possibly crazy, so just keep in mind that noble intent and good manners don't stop bullets.
You can do more good for this world by staying alive than turning into a martyr

[Praxius]

1. We respect all people because we are respectful. 2. We act with dignity and protect the dignity of others. 3. We do all things with integrity and honor.

So do I, but I don't have a vagina... how do you explain that?

If the overall authority figures in our history were reversed from Male to Females, things would still probably be in a similar state.

With your above logic, how do you explain Queen Elizabeth the 1st's invasion of Ireland and the expulsion and assasiantion of my ancestor, whom was a man, and was known in the area of Southern Ireland that he ruled as a great leader?

The History of the Sullivan/O'Sullivan Clan

......Donal O'Sullivan now realized that the Spanish reinforcements were not coming. It was obvious that all was lost in Munster. Famine conditions now existed and though he had considerable Spanish gold, there was little food available. He and approximately one thousand followers consisting of four hundred soldiers and the rest civilians began a journey to Leitrim to the castle of his friend O'Rouark. He believed that he could hold out longer amongst his northern allies, the O'Donnells and O'Neills. Carew declared them outlaws and decreed that anyone that aided them would be dealt with as outlaws as well. Throughout the 300 mile trek they were attacked by English forces and Irish that were loyal to Elizabeth. The country-side had been ravaged by war and famine; the people along the way were trying to stay alive themselves. They could ill afford to provide any aid or food. They began the march on December 31, 1602......

.....It became the responsibility of George Carew, the Lord President of Munster, to eliminate Dunboy castle, the O'Sullivan Beare principle fortress. It was the last rebel stronghold to hold out against the English. Donal was waiting at Ardea for reinforcements and weapons, and gold to pay his troops. He had been promised these by the Spanish envoy from Philip. While he was waiting, Carew's forces consisting of 4000 men and many cannon attacked the small garrison of 143 men left to defend Dunboy while waiting for the return of Donal and the Spanish reinforcements. A two day bombardment reduced the castle almost to the ground, but the defenders fought on. After two more days of fighting the remaining defenders, having retreated to the cellar of the castle, attempted to surrender. It was finally accepted. All were put to death by hanging the next day, except for Brother Collins, a Jesuit lay brother, who was hung in his home town of Youghal two days later. He had been acting as messenger between the O'Sullivans and King Philip and was not a combatant.....

Great Dignity, Honor and Respect shown in this example of a woman in power. Taking over Ireland in a Braveheat fasion and claiming it as her land.... forcing those to obey her or become enemies and face death, sent her armies after peaceful leaders of peaceful communities, betrayal, bribery, threatening pesants and other poor people of being branded outlaws and face punishment for trying to help out their fellow Irishman, cutting off food supplies, chasing these some 1000 civilians and soldiers through their long travels, taking land from the Irish to give to English Settlers... need I go on?

Some compassion women have, I must say, can be just as worse as any man's.

[Compugasm]

Quote by: Praxius If the overall authority figures in our history were reversed from Male to Females, things would still probably be in a similar state.

I'd agree, as the women who come to power aren't typical women. What if Martha Stewart were Queen? Then things would be different for sure.

Quote by: Athena I just know good manners, and believe the best way to peace is through actions of good manners.

This sounds a bit naive.

Quote by: butterbut I don't think the terrorists hate you becuase you don't respect them. They hate you becuase your an infidel. You can't negotiate with evil.

A sentiment such as "War is not the answer" embodies leftist feminine emotionality. The statement is, after all, utter nonsense, as many of the greatest evils – from Nazi totalitarianism and genocide to slavery – were quite effectively "answered" by war. - Dennis Prager

I guess it could be argued that had Hitler been taught some better manners, then he would not have even come to power. However, the basis of Butterbut and Pragers comments still stand.

[HelioPrime]

Quote by: SoylentGreen I really hate it when I see women put up on a pedestal. Women are not any better at resolving things than men are, they just do it differently. Have you ever heard of Margaret Thatcher, she started a war for the purpose of boosting her ratings for the next election. You do realise that you would be going into a patriarchal society where women are devalued and there opinion is worthless. Are you really sure you want to go to Iraq, it will be a definite culture shock. If so I think your brave and possibly crazy, so just keep in mind that noble intent and good manners don't stop bullets. You can do more good for this world by staying alive than turning into a martyr

Off topic but didn't Miss Thatcher bring Britian to war with Argentina after the former nation put a claim on british isles of its coast? After ignoring a UN resolution to withdraw Argentina pretty much got its butt kicked thus bringing a swift end to a undeclared war and the end of dictatorship in Argentina.

And on the OP women do on a normal basis approch problems differently than men. The way I understand it is women are more inclusive on trying to appease everyone much more so than men.

[Century 25]

I'm certain there are numerous women capable of running this country. But as for going to Iraq.. well.. Mr Bush & the people yanking his strings have opened Pandora's virtual box.. Not meant as a pun.. of course. But, Saddam's Mesopotamia didn't factor into our "terrorism".. that was done by a spoiled rich kid of an oil sheik.

Bush's opening of that Pandora's "box" - heh-heh.. well, Saddam had his enemies duped. They thought he was a cutthroat crazy man.. and they steered clear of Iraq. After bin Laden took his revenge against the Military-Industry complex.. our dumb-dumb invaded Iraq.. and opened it up to Saddam's fearful foe. Why not, with Saddam gone & fumble-f**k taking over (the oil) - it was a no brainer.. easy pickings..

Our trouble is.. man or woman, there are none that can make the necessary changes to reverse our steady decline into 2nd world status. It's not that those changes could be made.. but it is the consequences involved if anyone tried.. :eek:

[Athena]

Quote by: SoylentGreen I really hate it when I see women put up on a pedestal. Women are not any better at resolving things than men are, they just do it differently. Have you ever heard of Margaret Thatcher, she started a war for the purpose of boosting her ratings for the next election. You do realise that you would be going into a patriarchal society where women are devalued and there opinion is worthless. Are you really sure you want to go to Iraq, it will be a definite culture shock. If so I think your brave and possibly crazy, so just keep in mind that noble intent and good manners don't stop bullets. You can do more good for this world by staying alive than turning into a martyr

Hum do you also hate it when men are put on a pedestal?

Perhaps if women resolve problems differently, they can change the problem? I know of Margaret Thatcher. Women can follow the male model, and men can follow the female model.

I don't know all things, but for sure bringing booze into a Muslim country is not a good idea, and we take booze with us wherever we go, as we have the right to flaunt customs and laws . Forcing upon them western values, is not a good idea. Seeing them as evil and ourselves as the good, is not going to resolve the conflict.

I do think I was having a manic moment, but your response recalls me to the reasoning of the moment. I feel like a mother watching children fight, and feel a need to step in and stop the fighting. As I see the problem, it is not just correcting the evil of "those people". It is also correcting the evil of our own people.

[Athena]

Quote by: Praxius So do I, but I don't have a vagina... how do you explain that? If the overall authority figures in our history were reversed from Male to Females, things would still probably be in a similar state. With your above logic, how do you explain Queen Elizabeth the 1st's invasion of Ireland and the expulsion and assasiantion of my ancestor, whom was a man, and was known in the area of Southern Ireland that he ruled as a great leader? The History of the Sullivan/O'Sullivan Clan Great Dignity, Honor and Respect shown in this example of a woman in power. Taking over Ireland in a Braveheat fasion and claiming it as her land.... forcing those to obey her or become enemies and face death, sent her armies after peaceful leaders of peaceful communities, betrayal, bribery, threatening pesants and other poor people of being branded outlaws and face punishment for trying to help out their fellow Irishman, cutting off food supplies, chasing these some 1000 civilians and soldiers through their long travels, taking land from the Irish to give to English Settlers... need I go on? Some compassion women have, I must say, can be just as worse as any man's.

Hum, I think you just discribed western values well, and I don't think our invasion of Iraq looks much better. I think we have gone through a period where it was taboo to be feminine and women took pride in being as men. Of course women in leadership positions have used the male model throughout history, because this is a requirement of the position. I imagine it could be pleasurable to have that power. I am thinking Elizabeth was Christian and that didn't stop her. Interesting isn't it?

What is evil and how is it managed?

[Athena]

Quote by: Century 25 I'm certain there are numerous women capable of running this country. But as for going to Iraq.. well.. Mr Bush & the people yanking his strings have opened Pandora's virtual box.. Not meant as a pun.. of course. But, Saddam's Mesopotamia didn't factor into our "terrorism".. that was done by a spoiled rich kid of an oil sheik. Bush's opening of that Pandora's "box" - heh-heh.. well, Saddam had his enemies duped. They thought he was a cutthroat crazy man.. and they steered clear of Iraq. After bin Laden took his revenge against the Military-Industry complex.. our dumb-dumb invaded Iraq.. and opened it up to Saddam's fearful foe. Why not, with Saddam gone & fumble-f**k taking over (the oil) - it was a no brainer.. easy pickings.. Our trouble is.. man or woman, there are none that can make the necessary changes to reverse our steady decline into 2nd world status. It's not that those changes could be made.. but it is the consequences involved if anyone tried.. :eek:

I think you have said something very meaningful. The decline of the US is not the subject of this thread, and if you start a thread for that subject, I will comment further on it. It is a reality check. Iraq is not our only problem, and perhaps my energy is better spent on problems outside of Iraq, but folks, from the day war started I have had a terrible problem dealing with the reality of war.

HelioPrime, said women tend to be inclusive and appeasing. Is this a good or bad thing? Some of our presidential candidates are presenting themselves as inclusive and appeasing, and plenty see this as a dangerous weakness. I would like a better understanding of such things, before voting for a president.

[HelioPrime]

The downside of being more inclusive is you are more open to being a victem of popular masses ideals?

Perhaps thats Hillary's problem. She tries to apppease and so she voted for war because she listened to the voice of a vengent nation rather than advisors.

[Athena]

Quote by: HelioPrime The downside of being more inclusive is you are more open to being a victem of popular masses ideals? Perhaps thats Hillary's problem. She tries to apppease and so she voted for war because she listened to the voice of a vengent nation rather than advisors.

Ah, Hillary wasn't listening to anyone, but her husband when she voted to attack Iran. She is a liar when she tries to cover up her decision by saying she didn't know more than everyone else. Her husband had ordered the CIA to start a revolution to over throw Saddam, and he was really angry when the CIA failed to accomplish this, and Hillary knew darn well what was happening and why.