Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

rez · Jun 26, 2007, 11:32 am

Quote:

Quote by: poser7

rez- I'm not trying to disprove science because that is impossible

How is that impossible? You have an explanation for how the universe began. Show us how it is a better explanation then the millions of other explanations. Show us how your explanation leads to new discoveries.

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I'm only showing the flaws in theories that are not tangable by science and it's method.

Anything that is within nature, is nature. Science explains nature using nature. You live your life by this method. It is not a coincidence that you disagree with the one explanation that contradicts your superstitions. You are fine with all the other explanations, because you can easily make excuses for them.

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Theory is nothing like science, because every scientific formula, no matter how complicated it may look, only says something like "I did these things and this was the result"

Stop lying to yourself. You just stated what a theory was. A theory is composed of individual facts.

All theories have holes in them and yet you accept most of them and discredit some. You even use this as your reasoning for the rejection of Theory of Evolution, but yet on the other hand you are content with General Relativity, Electromagneticism etc..

It just simply does not make sense!

Zhavric · Jun 27, 2007, 10:49 am

Quote:

Quote by: poser7

If you're theory is impossible then it should be tossed and you should start from scratch.

Then you should discard creationism.

Huck1919 · Jun 27, 2007, 05:19 pm

ALL HAIL THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER!!!

It was he who placed us here and it was he who placed evidence that supports evolution in front of scientists to make us think the world is older than it really is.

Global warming is due to the decreasing number of Pirates (His Chosen People) over the years!

Take a look at the rising temperature vs. the average number of pirates throughout the past few centuries! I think you will be surprised!

I recommend all creationists read The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

Pandora's Box · Jul 15, 2007, 01:52 am

Sorry, guys, I had a major move and was out of commission for a while. I'll be posting shortly. Although I only made one serious post I really enjoyed hearing other peoples' opinions. Looking forward to it. :)

BTW, wow, it seems that things have gotten very hostile here for no big reason.

debater_nofreak · Jul 15, 2007, 08:01 am

God is 'a creator' they say?

But, how can we prove that god created the universe when we have more plausible theories like the Big Bang.

God is merely a belief. Just a 'force' that people like to look up to when all hope is lost. When they have no one, they just say 'God help us' because it gives us hope. An Encouragement. However, the actual meaning has been absolutely tampered by all religions. Each religion asks different things. The so called 'Servants of God' seem to know what their God wants their people to do. This idea which seems absolutely ridiculous, is actually believed by millions of people out there.

I believe, that in some way, we all are a believer of "God". Maybe Allah, Shiva, Him or , as in most cases of today, their own conscience. After doing something wrong, something tells us that we have not done something not quite correct.

That's what I think 'God' is. Not that god who asks its followers to worship them and do what they say. The real God is within all of us. Our conscience. Inner Voice. Soul. Instincts.

And it doesn't matter if you believe in 'God' or not, for in the end, it's just that you believe in yourself...for deep inside....its all that matters.
For if you lose hope on that 'God' inside of you, you have just lost everything.

And no scientific theory or evidence can ever prove that wrong.

Zhavric · Jul 16, 2007, 01:26 pm

Quote:

Quote by: debater_nofreak

That's what I think 'God' is. Not that god who asks its followers to worship them and do what they say. The real God is within all of us. Our conscience. Inner Voice. Soul. Instincts.

Why should we call that "god"?

Fangrim · Jul 16, 2007, 04:38 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Zhavric

Why should we call that "god"?

He doesn't suggest that we should; just that some do. He certainly doesn't think it should be the only name for it. Notice all the synonym and rhetorical action here? Plus the quotations around God.

Fangrim · Jul 16, 2007, 10:37 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Fangrim

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Quote by: Zhavric

As I've stated elsewhere in the thread, a thing can be unproven and false.

And I've disagreed with you. Repeatedly. In every thread that you say it.

And in every thread that I say it, you ignore my reason as to why.

Either stop saying it or start debating.

I quite honestly have no idea what I was thinking when I wrote this...

Was rereading through the thread, and I really don't get what I thought I was saying...weird.
Obviously a claim can be false when it's unproven, just like it could be true when it's unproven.

Maybe I thought Zhavric was saying that a claim that is unproven MUST be false, in which case my response would have been justified.

Eh.

debater_nofreak · Jul 17, 2007, 03:16 am

Quote:

Quote by: Zhavric

Why should we call that "god"?

It is indeed a good question. But if you had read my reply properly, you can see that firstly, it is what I believe 'God' is. I am in no way trying to tell other people to believe the same. Secondly, as Fangrim pointed out, I always used the term God in quotes, and gave a lot of other synonyms too.

The question you asked has the most obvious answer but sometimes the the obvious is so simple too be true that it is often ignored.

LtMisha · Jul 17, 2007, 04:57 am

In my opinion, we should not reason if God exists or if not. It isn't humankind's place to argue if it's superiours exist or not. Isn't there a law in science saying that chaos should win over order? For instance, an ice cream cone may melt. There is a chance that it may re-freeze by itself, but due to chaos being stronger than order, it shouldn't. I cant remember the term, I think it started with an 'E'.

ZNFYRH · Jul 17, 2007, 08:21 am

Actually, melting ice cream is the components of the ice cream returning to equilibrium. In a sense, the frozen state of ice cream is chaotic and the melted mush is the natural and ordered state.

But I understand the point you are making.

Zhavric · Jul 17, 2007, 10:30 am

Quote:

Quote by: Fangrim

He doesn't suggest that we should; just that some do.

Why should anyone call that god?

Zhavric · Jul 17, 2007, 10:32 am

Quote:

Quote by: Fangrim

I quite honestly have no idea what I was thinking when I wrote this...

Eh.

Kudos to you for seeing the light. Here: you get a rare Zhav smiley

It's a collector's item. Put it in your sig for safe keeping with the rest of your trophies.

Zhavric · Jul 17, 2007, 10:33 am

Quote:

Quote by: debater_nofreak

It is indeed a good question. But if you had read my reply properly, you can see that firstly, it is what I believe 'God' is.

I read all of your reply. I'm still baffled as to why you're eager to award the term "god" to the concepts you described. Why do you need to call them god?

Zhavric · Jul 17, 2007, 10:34 am

Quote:

Quote by: LtMisha

In my opinion, we should not reason if God exists or if not. It isn't humankind's place to argue if it's superiours exist or not.

What a strange suggestion?

Either god exists or doesn't exist. That makes it a scientific question which we can learn the answer to using logic, reason and evidence.

Frasier · Jul 17, 2007, 10:38 am

We don't "know" there isn't a God - there is no way to truly "know" that a higher being does not exist.

And, if you read my thread on the watchmaker analogy I'd also mount the argument that if a higher being did exist we could not comprehend him - again meaning that, by definition, we cannot "know" he does not exist, merely some of us, including myself think he doesn't exist.

Jul 15, 2007, 01:52 am	#104 (permalink) (top)
Pandora's Box Paradise Lost Location: Chicago Posts: 17	Sorry, guys, I had a major move and was out of commission for a while. I'll be posting shortly. Although I only made one serious post I really enjoyed hearing other peoples' opinions. Looking forward to it. :) BTW, wow, it seems that things have gotten very hostile here for no big reason. "Non-reciprocal principle: If you add a cup of wine to a barrel of sewage, you get a barrel of sewage. If you add a cup of sewage to a barrel of wine, you get a barrel of sewage." :rolleyes:

Jul 17, 2007, 04:57 am	#110 (permalink) (top)
LtMisha Instant Leninist Location: Leningrad Posts: 340	In my opinion, we should not reason if God exists or if not. It isn't humankind's place to argue if it's superiours exist or not. Isn't there a law in science saying that chaos should win over order? For instance, an ice cream cone may melt. There is a chance that it may re-freeze by itself, but due to chaos being stronger than order, it shouldn't. I cant remember the term, I think it started with an 'E'. You must obey the law, always, not only when they grab you by your special place. Vladimir Putin

Jul 17, 2007, 08:21 am	#111 (permalink) (top)
ZNFYRH Volcanic Erupter Posts: 4,375	Actually, melting ice cream is the components of the ice cream returning to equilibrium. In a sense, the frozen state of ice cream is chaotic and the melted mush is the natural and ordered state. But I understand the point you are making. IT'S A BOY!!

Jun 27, 2007, 05:19 pm	#103 (permalink) (top)
Huck1919 Sedimentary Rock Posts: 3	ALL HAIL THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER!!! It was he who placed us here and it was he who placed evidence that supports evolution in front of scientists to make us think the world is older than it really is. Global warming is due to the decreasing number of Pirates (His Chosen People) over the years! Take a look at the rising temperature vs. the average number of pirates throughout the past few centuries! I think you will be surprised! I recommend all creationists read The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

Jul 15, 2007, 08:01 am	#105 (permalink) (top)
debater_nofreak Sedimentary Rock Posts: 12	God is 'a creator' they say? But, how can we prove that god created the universe when we have more plausible theories like the Big Bang. God is merely a belief. Just a 'force' that people like to look up to when all hope is lost. When they have no one, they just say 'God help us' because it gives us hope. An Encouragement. However, the actual meaning has been absolutely tampered by all religions. Each religion asks different things. The so called 'Servants of God' seem to know what their God wants their people to do. This idea which seems absolutely ridiculous, is actually believed by millions of people out there. I believe, that in some way, we all are a believer of "God". Maybe Allah, Shiva, Him or , as in most cases of today, their own conscience. After doing something wrong, something tells us that we have not done something not quite correct. That's what I think 'God' is. Not that god who asks its followers to worship them and do what they say. The real God is within all of us. Our conscience. Inner Voice. Soul. Instincts. And it doesn't matter if you believe in 'God' or not, for in the end, it's just that you believe in yourself...for deep inside....its all that matters. For if you lose hope on that 'God' inside of you, you have just lost everything. And no scientific theory or evidence can ever prove that wrong.

Jul 17, 2007, 10:38 am	#116 (permalink) (top)
Frasier Molten Ash Posts: 99	We don't "know" there isn't a God - there is no way to truly "know" that a higher being does not exist. And, if you read my thread on the watchmaker analogy I'd also mount the argument that if a higher being did exist we could not comprehend him - again meaning that, by definition, we cannot "know" he does not exist, merely some of us, including myself think he doesn't exist.