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Jun 15, 2007, 08:22 am

In a recent thread on homosexuality, views were expressed by some, self-described born again Christians that could only be characterized as hate speech.

Given the teachings of Jesus and the notion of an all-loving God, I cannot understand how a person who claimed to serve Jesus could express hatred toward anyone. Hate and the love of Jesus seem to me to be psychologically (for a sane person), let alone philosophically, incompatible.

How is it possible to be a Christian, yet consumed by hatred for others?

Of course, there are many Christian sects that do preach and try to emulate Christ's love for others--for example, the Episcopal Church in the United States and the Mennonites.

All views--even those of they who hate--are solicited.

Regards
S.

ZNFYRH · Jun 15, 2007, 08:26 am

Christianity is, first and foremost, a belief system coupled with a set of morals and ethics.

Human nature doesn't like conforming to someone else's systems.

If a Christian admitted that they believed the value of the morals and ethics but that they are only human, I would find no fault with them if they hated some one or thing.

But when a Christian preaches all those virtues and insists on living like Christ, un-Christ-like behavior is nothing more than their basic human nature conflicting with a moral or ethic that, deep down, they don't believe in.

improvident · Jun 15, 2007, 08:55 am

The problem with Christianity.. is that any sin you ever commit.. can be wiped clean by asking for god's forgiveness.. this doubled with the fact that the Christian faith also says that no man or woman can go a day without sin.. even thinking about something sinful is a sin.. so many get this complex.. basically allowing them to do whatever they want.. because technically.. all they have to do.. to be allowed into god's kingdom is repent.. and ask for forgiveness..a wee hypocritical eh?

It also says in the Bible that Jesus basically chilled with the lowest of lows of people in society.. whores.. lepers..debtors..murderers.. and im sure Homosexuals.. he didnt hate on much of anyone.. his view was.. your all god's children.. no matter what you have done right or wrong.. by believing or not believing in God you can be saved and live with him and his father in heaven..or not and go to hell.. so basically your fate isnt bound by your worldly decisions.. but rather by your willingness to believe and faith in God.. Seems a bit more like a religion id go for..

But as is the case for all religions EVER made.. People with less pure of intentions take lead.. and begin creating bogus rules and exceptions.. completely contradicting the views and teachings of the original prophet.. its hard to tell when homosexuality was throw into the DO NOT DO category.. but it has apparently turned into one of the almost unforgivable sins.. sick.. and sad.. if you asked me

CoffeeSaint · Jun 15, 2007, 08:57 am

I agree with Z. Many Christians, like people of any religion, do not actually see their faith as a philosophy, as a coherent paradigm that gives insight into any and all behaviors and attitudes (often because what they are taught is not a coherent paradigm -- i.e., OT God vs. NT God). They simply see it as a way to feel better about themselves, the SAVED, and a way to feel superior to all others, the DAMNED. This is why those hacks LaHaye and Jenkins are so popular.

(BTW, you have to go see the scrolling menu at the top of this page: Join the Prophecy Club! Now available: The Rapture!)

improvident · Jun 15, 2007, 09:10 am

Oh jeez.. the "Left Behind" series.. my mom and grandmother both read the entire thing im pretty sure.. i skimmed through one of them.. and talked to my mom about it.. to me.. seems like a big scare tactic to get people to convert to Christianity and repent their sins and be born again..Propaganda Hogwash if you asked me

banko · Jun 15, 2007, 09:45 am

Christianity begins with the ideology of judgment. The fact that god shall judge you when you die creates an environment that encourages it's followers to judge others. Then there is the bible that is wide open for interpretation, and it depends which version you believe. The whole thing is quite vague really.

Zhavric · Jun 15, 2007, 11:19 am

Quote:

Quote by: sdbest

Given the teachings of Jesus and the notion of an all-loving God, I cannot understand how a person who claimed to serve Jesus could express hatred toward anyone.

The bible was written by homophobes who painted sodomy as a sin. There probably were some really sick depraved people back in the day who'd rape other men for fun (happens all the time in prison).

In our more enlightened time, we've realized homosexuals aren't deviants. They're not rapists or child molesters.

However, the Christian right, eager since the late 70's to be in bed with the republicans, has used the issues of gays to various times to galvinize their voting base. We saw this happen dramatically in the last few elections.

The christian right plays on innate homophobia, stokes it with idiotic allegations of what gays are "responsible for", and justifies it with a holier-than-thou retardation of "love the sinner / hate the sin"... the idea being it's okay to hate homosexuals so long as you're willing to love them the moment they stop being homosexuals.

I can sorta get behind that logic: right wing Christians of this nature are @$$holz until they stop being Christians.

Jamesmckinnley · Jun 15, 2007, 12:04 pm

Quote:

Quote by: sdbest

In a recent thread on homosexuality, views were expressed by some, self-described born again Christians that could only be characterized as hate speech.

S.

What would you do if you could only have missionary style sex with one woman, and could not look at that cute guy sitting across the way?

Technosoul · Jun 15, 2007, 02:39 pm

Two reasons. Finding fault with others distracts us from looking at our own faults.

You get the morning newpaper and like god you judge all the wrongs of the world, by contrast your little wrong-doings seem unimportant and so by comparison (law of relativity) you are almost a saint.

Next is that religions know people will unite to fight a common enemy, so they find a cause or person that they can tag as "the evil". Then they get people to join the "good cause" to overcome that evil target. And in joining the people feel they are the good guys. And the church get more members and more donations for making people feel good about their purpose in life.

In the passion to fight evil the emotions of anger and hatred can manifest.
Resulting in them becoming someone else's evil. And that effects a chain reaction with potentially unending momentums of hatred and fighting. And all become the evils of hatred and they do not even see what that got caught up in as being evil.

Jun 15, 2007, 07:45 pm

Some Christian hate, the same way some Muslims blow them selves up. They aren't truly who they say they are, just as haters aren't Christians. The only thing Christians are obligated to do is repent for their sins and bring others to the faith. I don't hate anyone. Hate is a awful strong word.

texasdave · Jun 15, 2007, 08:45 pm

Christians do not hate homosexuals. Homosexuality is fornication and as such is a sin unto death if it is not repented of. Christians don't want unrepentant sinners to go to hell. So we warn and plead. That is love.

DEEJ85 · Jun 16, 2007, 12:59 am

Quote:

Quote by: Gambr1nus

Some Christian hate, the same way some Muslims blow them selves up. They aren't truly who they say they are, just as haters aren't Christians. The only thing Christians are obligated to do is repent for their sins and bring others to the faith. I don't hate anyone. Hate is a awful strong word.

Christians are obligated to "love your neighbor as yourself" It is clearly written in the bible.

Unfortunately Many Christians (or those who call themselves as such) fail to realize this or to act upon it.

All humans should be treated with respect (even if you disagree with their actions)

SoylentGreen · Jun 16, 2007, 04:26 am

I dont believe its many that act like this but the ones who do are the most vocal.
There rants tend to attract the most attention usually because there so dogmatic and factually incorrect.
I think its the part about bringing others to the faith because they dont want unrepented sinners to go to hell that they take to far.
For some reason they cant understand how annoying it is to be told you are going to hell.

But then some of the athiests can act like that to
Try telling some of the free market capatilists that communism is a good idea.and see where they tell you to go.

Lullaby Chainer · Jun 16, 2007, 04:31 am

Quote:

Quote by: texasdave

Christians do not hate homosexuals. Homosexuality is fornication and as such is a sin unto death if it is not repented of. Christians don't want unrepentant sinners to go to hell. So we warn and plead. That is love.

Firstly, don't generalize. The thread starter said (some).. you can do the same. Unless you're implying that the population of Christians world wide is actually much.. much smaller.

And if you read the thread title, you might see "Why do (some) Christians hate?"

So, either you're disowning millions of devout Christians from their title or you're ignoring the purpose of this thread.. to answer WHY some Christians hate.

**Matt W** · Jun 16, 2007, 04:46 am

Quote:

Quote by: texasdave

So we warn and plead.

I see very little pleading when Christians confront what they describe as sin. I see threats & intimidation, 'warnings' of what awaits them. I see assumption of superiority, and arrogance. But pleading? I think not.

tinybear · Jun 16, 2007, 06:47 am

Yeah, religion is based on the use of intimidation and fear in order to achieve adherence/obedience to a set of values. Why do you think people who obey and adhere are described as 'God-fearing' people?

Jun 16, 2007, 08:15 am

Quote:

Quote by: texasdave

Christians do not hate homosexuals. Homosexuality is fornication and as such is a sin unto death if it is not repented of. Christians don't want unrepentant sinners to go to hell. So we warn and plead. That is love.

You've used the pronoun "it" to refer to a homosexual-categorizing him or her as a "thing."

The fact is some Christian groups such as the American Episcopalians (Anglicans) not only do not share your views, they condemn them, and condone gay marriage and ordination of gay clergy. This, in my view, is far more consistent with the deeds and moral teachings of Jesus Christ.

BTW, according to the Catholic Church, there is no "hell." You're protecting those you arbitrarily deem "unrepentant sinners" from a delusion.

Regards
S.

texasdave · Jun 16, 2007, 01:42 pm

sdbest,
Read my post more carefully. The "it" I refer to is homosexuality, a behavior. I am referring to the behavior as a thing because behavior is separate from the person doing it.
Lullaby,
I am disowning some who title themselves as Christians. Jesus did that with the Pharisees. Those who say they are Christian and hate sinners are not Christians. Let me illustrate this with scripture. 1 John 2:9 , " He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now." Hating homosexuals is not Christian. Hating the sin of homosexuality is because it leads to the death of the unrepentent homosexual. If you see someone driving toward a knocked out bridge do you warn him? Of course. He may have every right to drive over it but you warn him anyway. And those that stand by and watch him do it or actively encourage him to do so, do not love him.

Jun 16, 2007, 01:47 pm

Quote:

Quote by: DEEJ85

Christians are obligated to "love your neighbor as yourself" It is clearly written in the bible.

Unfortunately Many Christians (or those who call themselves as such) fail to realize this or to act upon it.

All humans should be treated with respect (even if you disagree with their actions)

But if you don't love your neighbor as yourself, you can repent for that sin.

texasdave · Jun 16, 2007, 01:49 pm

sdbest,
And the so-called "Christians" who support gay marriage neither love homosexuals nor Christ. I refer to Matthew 15:7-9
" Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you saying,
"These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me,
And IN VAIN they worship ME,
Teaching as doctrines the
commandments of men"
Christians, REAL Christians, don't do things or teach things their way, they do it God's way.

Jun 15, 2007, 08:22 am	#1 (permalink) (top)
sdbest Guest Posts: n/a	Why do (some) Christians hate? In a recent thread on homosexuality, views were expressed by some, self-described born again Christians that could only be characterized as hate speech. Given the teachings of Jesus and the notion of an all-loving God, I cannot understand how a person who claimed to serve Jesus could express hatred toward anyone. Hate and the love of Jesus seem to me to be psychologically (for a sane person), let alone philosophically, incompatible. How is it possible to be a Christian, yet consumed by hatred for others? Of course, there are many Christian sects that do preach and try to emulate Christ's love for others--for example, the Episcopal Church in the United States and the Mennonites. All views--even those of they who hate--are solicited. Regards S.

Jun 15, 2007, 08:55 am	#3 (permalink) (top)
improvident Igneous Magma Location: Tennessee Posts: 213	The problem with Christianity.. is that any sin you ever commit.. can be wiped clean by asking for god's forgiveness.. this doubled with the fact that the Christian faith also says that no man or woman can go a day without sin.. even thinking about something sinful is a sin.. so many get this complex.. basically allowing them to do whatever they want.. because technically.. all they have to do.. to be allowed into god's kingdom is repent.. and ask for forgiveness..a wee hypocritical eh? It also says in the Bible that Jesus basically chilled with the lowest of lows of people in society.. whores.. lepers..debtors..murderers.. and im sure Homosexuals.. he didnt hate on much of anyone.. his view was.. your all god's children.. no matter what you have done right or wrong.. by believing or not believing in God you can be saved and live with him and his father in heaven..or not and go to hell.. so basically your fate isnt bound by your worldly decisions.. but rather by your willingness to believe and faith in God.. Seems a bit more like a religion id go for.. But as is the case for all religions EVER made.. People with less pure of intentions take lead.. and begin creating bogus rules and exceptions.. completely contradicting the views and teachings of the original prophet.. its hard to tell when homosexuality was throw into the DO NOT DO category.. but it has apparently turned into one of the almost unforgivable sins.. sick.. and sad.. if you asked me You Can't Understand A User's Mind But Try, With Your Books And Degrees If You Let Yourself Go And Open Your Mind I'll Bet You'd Be Doing Like Me And It Ain't So Bad -Alice in Chains : Junkhead

Jun 15, 2007, 08:57 am	#4 (permalink) (top)
CoffeeSaint Moral Turnip Location: Oregon, US Posts: 2,283	I agree with Z. Many Christians, like people of any religion, do not actually see their faith as a philosophy, as a coherent paradigm that gives insight into any and all behaviors and attitudes (often because what they are taught is not a coherent paradigm -- i.e., OT God vs. NT God). They simply see it as a way to feel better about themselves, the SAVED, and a way to feel superior to all others, the DAMNED. This is why those hacks LaHaye and Jenkins are so popular. (BTW, you have to go see the scrolling menu at the top of this page: Join the Prophecy Club! Now available: The Rapture!) "Would you like some pie, Dr. Stark?" "Science is my pie. Curiosity, my sweet tooth. Knowledge is my candy."

Jun 15, 2007, 09:10 am	#5 (permalink) (top)
improvident Igneous Magma Location: Tennessee Posts: 213	Oh jeez.. the "Left Behind" series.. my mom and grandmother both read the entire thing im pretty sure.. i skimmed through one of them.. and talked to my mom about it.. to me.. seems like a big scare tactic to get people to convert to Christianity and repent their sins and be born again..Propaganda Hogwash if you asked me You Can't Understand A User's Mind But Try, With Your Books And Degrees If You Let Yourself Go And Open Your Mind I'll Bet You'd Be Doing Like Me And It Ain't So Bad -Alice in Chains : Junkhead

Jun 15, 2007, 08:26 am	#2 (permalink) (top)
ZNFYRH Volcanic Erupter Posts: 4,375	Christianity is, first and foremost, a belief system coupled with a set of morals and ethics. Human nature doesn't like conforming to someone else's systems. If a Christian admitted that they believed the value of the morals and ethics but that they are only human, I would find no fault with them if they hated some one or thing. But when a Christian preaches all those virtues and insists on living like Christ, un-Christ-like behavior is nothing more than their basic human nature conflicting with a moral or ethic that, deep down, they don't believe in.

Jun 15, 2007, 09:45 am	#6 (permalink) (top)
banko Igneous Magma Posts: 226	Christianity begins with the ideology of judgment. The fact that god shall judge you when you die creates an environment that encourages it's followers to judge others. Then there is the bible that is wide open for interpretation, and it depends which version you believe. The whole thing is quite vague really.

Jun 15, 2007, 02:39 pm	#9 (permalink) (top)
Technosoul Volcanic Erupter Posts: 8,663	Two reasons. Finding fault with others distracts us from looking at our own faults. You get the morning newpaper and like god you judge all the wrongs of the world, by contrast your little wrong-doings seem unimportant and so by comparison (law of relativity) you are almost a saint. Next is that religions know people will unite to fight a common enemy, so they find a cause or person that they can tag as "the evil". Then they get people to join the "good cause" to overcome that evil target. And in joining the people feel they are the good guys. And the church get more members and more donations for making people feel good about their purpose in life. In the passion to fight evil the emotions of anger and hatred can manifest. Resulting in them becoming someone else's evil. And that effects a chain reaction with potentially unending momentums of hatred and fighting. And all become the evils of hatred and they do not even see what that got caught up in as being evil.

Jun 15, 2007, 07:45 pm	#10 (permalink) (top)
Gambr1nus Guest Posts: n/a	Some Christian hate, the same way some Muslims blow them selves up. They aren't truly who they say they are, just as haters aren't Christians. The only thing Christians are obligated to do is repent for their sins and bring others to the faith. I don't hate anyone. Hate is a awful strong word.

Jun 15, 2007, 08:45 pm	#11 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	Christians do not hate homosexuals. Homosexuality is fornication and as such is a sin unto death if it is not repented of. Christians don't want unrepentant sinners to go to hell. So we warn and plead. That is love.

Jun 16, 2007, 04:26 am	#13 (permalink) (top)
SoylentGreen Volcanic Erupter Posts: 2,630	I dont believe its many that act like this but the ones who do are the most vocal. There rants tend to attract the most attention usually because there so dogmatic and factually incorrect. I think its the part about bringing others to the faith because they dont want unrepented sinners to go to hell that they take to far. For some reason they cant understand how annoying it is to be told you are going to hell. But then some of the athiests can act like that to Try telling some of the free market capatilists that communism is a good idea.and see where they tell you to go.

Jun 16, 2007, 06:47 am	#16 (permalink) (top)
tinybear Volcanic Erupter Location: Hong Kong (for now) Posts: 7,017	Yeah, religion is based on the use of intimidation and fear in order to achieve adherence/obedience to a set of values. Why do you think people who obey and adhere are described as 'God-fearing' people?

Jun 16, 2007, 01:42 pm	#18 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	sdbest, Read my post more carefully. The "it" I refer to is homosexuality, a behavior. I am referring to the behavior as a thing because behavior is separate from the person doing it. Lullaby, I am disowning some who title themselves as Christians. Jesus did that with the Pharisees. Those who say they are Christian and hate sinners are not Christians. Let me illustrate this with scripture. 1 John 2:9 , " He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now." Hating homosexuals is not Christian. Hating the sin of homosexuality is because it leads to the death of the unrepentent homosexual. If you see someone driving toward a knocked out bridge do you warn him? Of course. He may have every right to drive over it but you warn him anyway. And those that stand by and watch him do it or actively encourage him to do so, do not love him.

Jun 16, 2007, 01:49 pm	#20 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	sdbest, And the so-called "Christians" who support gay marriage neither love homosexuals nor Christ. I refer to Matthew 15:7-9 " Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you saying, "These people draw near to Me with their mouth, And honor Me with their lips, But their heart is far from Me, And IN VAIN they worship ME, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men" Christians, REAL Christians, don't do things or teach things their way, they do it God's way.