Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

Lullaby Chainer · May 31, 2007, 12:08 pm

I've come to a conclusion.. the earth was created by the volcano of another planet. Period. No reason, no basis, no how, no why, no explanation.

If you think the above is a theory, then I'm afraid you're stuck in the 3rd grade "What if?" days.

What if there were a blagaraptor.. and it created the world?

Well, what's a blagaraptor?

Why does that matter?

Well, I can't really consider your proposal if I don't know what a blagaraptor is.

Silly, huh? Unfortunately, many people feel they don't have to define God. They propose.. "God created the universe." In that case, why not just say blagaraptor created the universe? Neither are defined, and neither provide an actual whole theory. It is WORSE than saying "the earth was created by the volcano of another planet" because at least a VOLCANO is defined. When you REFUSE to define God.. the "theory" looks more like this, "a bonolo created the earth." I really wish any one that thinks like this would try their bullshit in a scientific room and see what kind of responses they'd get.

So, are you TRYING to hide from persecution when you think up wild ideas and refuse to define them?

What's even worse, is that once they refuse to define what God is.. they demand you're acting on faith by not disproving it. Not disproving WHAT? What is God? This isn't the 3rd grade! Your claims need at least SOME basis else you have nothing more than a wild "what if?" idea. It is not a scientific theory, and all explanations of this world must be scientific.. not childish "what if?"s. If it's not scientific, AT LEAST define your damn words.. I can't argue against made up words.. and when you strip away definitions from "God".. all you have to offer is a damn made up word.

**Jack** · May 31, 2007, 12:11 pm

I concur. Even in a debate over gods in general, there has to be some degree of agreed-upon definition of the subject of the debate. Otherwise we're just poking sticks at a phantom.

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:11 pm

You want definitions? Ask and ye shall receive. Fire away.

Autolykos · May 31, 2007, 12:13 pm

What is your definition of "god", TexasDave?

- Rob

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:18 pm

God is " I AM" That is what He calls Himself. He is from everlasting to everlasting. He is the author of all laws and the creator of all matter and life. And He is Father.

tehrandan · May 31, 2007, 12:23 pm

You want definitions? Ask and ye shall receive. Fire away.

God is "Allah" That is what He calls Himself. He is from everlasting to everlasting. He is the author of all laws and the creator of all matter and life. And He is Father.

ZNFYRH · May 31, 2007, 12:24 pm

The problem with that definition, from an objective standpoint, is that you have to now define your definition.

It's like looking up a word in the dictionary and then having to look up the words in the definition.

What God calls himself is irrelevant.

"Everlasting" isn't a beginning and an end, it's the entire range, so how can he be "everlasting to everlasting?"

Author of all laws? So he's guiding the hand of the U.S. gov't now and the hand of Hitler in the 40's?

He created all matter and life? How?

He is Father? Or a Father? And do you mean biological? Spiritual? Can you define what a spirit is?

Objectively speaking, I'm with Lullaby and Isherwood.

If something can't be defined then it can't be argued conclusively by anyone, regardless of which side they are taking.

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:25 pm

Ah, but "I AM" backs up His claims wih fulfilled prophecy. Allah is the figment of the imagination of a pedophile.

tehrandan · May 31, 2007, 12:27 pm

You seem to be mistaken my good friend. Allah is the way, not I AM. The Quran fullfills the prophecy, not the Bible.

Who are you to treat Allah's prophet in such hateful words?

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:40 pm

Something can be defined as long as you accept a certain level of evidence and do not keep insisting on raising the bar. When you keep raising the bar higher to try and overcome the evidence then there comes a point when it is not about the evidence but about your will.

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:41 pm

Muhammed married a six year old girl and admitted to having sex with her at the age of nine. He was a pedophile. And the Koran fufills no prophecies.

Lullaby Chainer · May 31, 2007, 12:44 pm

Quote:

Quote by: texasdave

God is " I AM" That is what He calls Himself. He is from everlasting to everlasting. He is the author of all laws and the creator of all matter and life. And He is Father.

This is what I'm talking about..

What is blagaraptor?

He is the lord of lords, the savior of the human race, and the keeper of secrets! He is your mother, and your father.. your brother and your sister. He is infinity!

It just doesn't cut it.

And please.. stay on topic you two.

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:46 pm

There is Biblical prophecy to back up what God has said. You keep ignoring that. I can cite examples.

tehrandan · May 31, 2007, 12:52 pm

The Holy Quran was revealed to Mohammed (saw). Today, there are two Qurans which were written 1250 years ago and they have not changed since...I don't think texasdave can say the same about the Bible...
The Holy Quran does not contradict one thing that modern science has stated, therefore, the Holy Quran's discription of Allah is the correct one and the definition we should be using in this thread.

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 12:59 pm

The dead sea scrolls proved that the modern Bible is exactly the same as the ones written thousands of years ago. The Koran was written by one man who was deceived. The Bible is the testimony of many.

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 01:04 pm

Tehran,
Read your Koran better. "Allah" never once in the Koran refers to himself as "father". Of the 99 names that is not one of them. Neither is "love".

Zhavric · May 31, 2007, 01:05 pm

Quote:

Quote by: texasdave

Something can be defined as long as you accept a certain level of evidence and do not keep insisting on raising the bar. When you keep raising the bar higher to try and overcome the evidence then there comes a point when it is not about the evidence but about your will.

Translation: "My position on god is tenable until you start, you know... actually expecting me to support my assertions with evidence. Don't raise the bar and require me to provide evidence for my claims and everything will be okay. Also, notice how I bash Islam without the slightest thought that my own religion may be just as contrived?"

Quote:

Quote by: ZNF

If something can't be defined then it can't be argued conclusively by anyone, regardless of which side they are taking.

Do you believe god has to stay undefined?

rcne · May 31, 2007, 01:07 pm

Hmmm, a "blagaraptor" is looking better all the time. What is with this my God is better than your God bit that texasdave and tehrandan seem to be lost in?

texasdave · May 31, 2007, 01:09 pm

What evidence do you want Zhavric? I can provide it. But first answer a question. If I could prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Jesus Christ is who He said He is, would you serve Him?

tehrandan · May 31, 2007, 01:10 pm

Quote:

Quote by: rcne

Hmmm, a "blagaraptor" is looking better all the time. What is with this my God is better than your God bit that texasdave and tehrandan seem to be lost in?

Because the Muslim description of Allah will reveal His truth, and not the Christian description.

May 31, 2007, 12:08 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
Lullaby Chainer Posts: 3,018	Arguing the Undefined I've come to a conclusion.. the earth was created by the volcano of another planet. Period. No reason, no basis, no how, no why, no explanation. If you think the above is a theory, then I'm afraid you're stuck in the 3rd grade "What if?" days. What if there were a blagaraptor.. and it created the world? Well, what's a blagaraptor? Why does that matter? Well, I can't really consider your proposal if I don't know what a blagaraptor is. Silly, huh? Unfortunately, many people feel they don't have to define God. They propose.. "God created the universe." In that case, why not just say blagaraptor created the universe? Neither are defined, and neither provide an actual whole theory. It is WORSE than saying "the earth was created by the volcano of another planet" because at least a VOLCANO is defined. When you REFUSE to define God.. the "theory" looks more like this, "a bonolo created the earth." I really wish any one that thinks like this would try their bullshit in a scientific room and see what kind of responses they'd get. So, are you TRYING to hide from persecution when you think up wild ideas and refuse to define them? What's even worse, is that once they refuse to define what God is.. they demand you're acting on faith by not disproving it. Not disproving WHAT? What is God? This isn't the 3rd grade! Your claims need at least SOME basis else you have nothing more than a wild "what if?" idea. It is not a scientific theory, and all explanations of this world must be scientific.. not childish "what if?"s. If it's not scientific, AT LEAST define your damn words.. I can't argue against made up words.. and when you strip away definitions from "God".. all you have to offer is a damn made up word. *Powerful.. magical.. e-e-e-eevil..*

May 31, 2007, 12:11 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 13,746	I concur. Even in a debate over gods in general, there has to be some degree of agreed-upon definition of the subject of the debate. Otherwise we're just poking sticks at a phantom. The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

May 31, 2007, 12:13 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
Autolykos Logical Phallussy Location: In your internets. Posts: 2,991	What is your definition of "god", TexasDave? - Rob "I'd rather be free and alive!" -- Ron Paul Religion isn't the greatest threat to mankind -- authoritarianism is. The Anarcheion Zeitgeist

May 31, 2007, 01:07 pm	#18 (permalink) (top)
rcne Moderator/nobody Posts: 1,566	Hmmm, a "blagaraptor" is looking better all the time. What is with this my God is better than your God bit that texasdave and tehrandan seem to be lost in? Live Long and Prosper (Genetics and Capitalism)

May 31, 2007, 12:11 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	You want definitions? Ask and ye shall receive. Fire away.

May 31, 2007, 12:18 pm	#5 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	God is " I AM" That is what He calls Himself. He is from everlasting to everlasting. He is the author of all laws and the creator of all matter and life. And He is Father.

May 31, 2007, 12:23 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
tehrandan Sedimentary Rock Posts: 7	You want definitions? Ask and ye shall receive. Fire away. God is "Allah" That is what He calls Himself. He is from everlasting to everlasting. He is the author of all laws and the creator of all matter and life. And He is Father.

May 31, 2007, 12:24 pm	#7 (permalink) (top)
ZNFYRH Volcanic Erupter Posts: 4,375	The problem with that definition, from an objective standpoint, is that you have to now define your definition. It's like looking up a word in the dictionary and then having to look up the words in the definition. What God calls himself is irrelevant. "Everlasting" isn't a beginning and an end, it's the entire range, so how can he be "everlasting to everlasting?" Author of all laws? So he's guiding the hand of the U.S. gov't now and the hand of Hitler in the 40's? He created all matter and life? How? He is Father? Or a Father? And do you mean biological? Spiritual? Can you define what a spirit is? Objectively speaking, I'm with Lullaby and Isherwood. If something can't be defined then it can't be argued conclusively by anyone, regardless of which side they are taking.

May 31, 2007, 12:25 pm	#8 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	Ah, but "I AM" backs up His claims wih fulfilled prophecy. Allah is the figment of the imagination of a pedophile.

May 31, 2007, 12:27 pm	#9 (permalink) (top)
tehrandan Sedimentary Rock Posts: 7	You seem to be mistaken my good friend. Allah is the way, not I AM. The Quran fullfills the prophecy, not the Bible. Who are you to treat Allah's prophet in such hateful words?

May 31, 2007, 12:40 pm	#10 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	Something can be defined as long as you accept a certain level of evidence and do not keep insisting on raising the bar. When you keep raising the bar higher to try and overcome the evidence then there comes a point when it is not about the evidence but about your will.

May 31, 2007, 12:41 pm	#11 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	Muhammed married a six year old girl and admitted to having sex with her at the age of nine. He was a pedophile. And the Koran fufills no prophecies.

May 31, 2007, 12:46 pm	#13 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	There is Biblical prophecy to back up what God has said. You keep ignoring that. I can cite examples.

May 31, 2007, 12:52 pm	#14 (permalink) (top)
tehrandan Sedimentary Rock Posts: 7	The Holy Quran was revealed to Mohammed (saw). Today, there are two Qurans which were written 1250 years ago and they have not changed since...I don't think texasdave can say the same about the Bible... The Holy Quran does not contradict one thing that modern science has stated, therefore, the Holy Quran's discription of Allah is the correct one and the definition we should be using in this thread.

May 31, 2007, 12:59 pm	#15 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	The dead sea scrolls proved that the modern Bible is exactly the same as the ones written thousands of years ago. The Koran was written by one man who was deceived. The Bible is the testimony of many.

May 31, 2007, 01:04 pm	#16 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	Tehran, Read your Koran better. "Allah" never once in the Koran refers to himself as "father". Of the 99 names that is not one of them. Neither is "love".

May 31, 2007, 01:09 pm	#19 (permalink) (top)
texasdave BANNED Location: Texas Posts: 731	What evidence do you want Zhavric? I can provide it. But first answer a question. If I could prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Jesus Christ is who He said He is, would you serve Him?