Virgin Mary

[Poseidon]

Well I already wrote this in Yahoo questions, and I am to lazy to write it back again so here is the copy.

Well I was raise in Mexico, and In most of the latin american countries The Virgin mary is Woshiped A LOT.
mostly all the temples are erected for a main image, or partoonese of the neighbornood, such as The Virgin of Fatima, The Virgin Of guadalupe, The virgin of The Solitude, The sacred conseption. Its said that In Mexico there are more Guadalupian than Christians, (Guadalupian is not a religion or a sect, its just a saying for Us Mexicans who beepeley love Mary) I mean in the small city I used to live there wehre atleast 12 churches, and all of them are asociated to One of the Virgins (Virgin Mary) and thinking it twice I do not think that there is a single temple that is asociated to Christ, as the main figure. Ok I mean, The churches are called, for example, The Parroquia, or The church of Solitude (as to the virgin of solitude) and their main statue which is in the front and the center is that of the mane of the building, but There are figures of saints, and ofcouse ............
of christ, not in the wall though but a big one of him crucified statndin in the bottom. and a golden one of him in the altar. also in the "Padre Nuestro" (our father, the payer that Chrits teatchet us, but i dont remember its name in inglish) Most of the time when you say it you are used to it to paying to Mary too. a prayer about the same lenhgt, As you can Tell I am Catholic, and I Just wanted to know what PPl in the U.S. Think about this, I mean this is not another religion or sect but Catholicicsm, I am not saying that we only pray to Mary, I am just saing that many ppl do more stuff related to Mary than to Christ or God.
I mean as far as I know The image of mary is not so worshiped in the U.S. as in any of the Lathin american countries, or Spain and Italy.
Melissa Svetlana Xtian Eye Candy: Ok Tha's why separetes us Cjristians from us Catholics, that us catholics worship many images, such as the saints...... now that I thino about it there was a church not acridated to Mary, but to Saint Paul (the husband of Mary) I mean In each temple Chist is there always, and its a major role during mas. Well first I have to say that there is nothing wrong In worshiping Mary, I think many people do because she simbolized maternity and love, we all know the our Momy loves us, and its easeley to imagening a woman such as mary doing so, unlike a man, like Jesus, We all know that Jesus loves us but Mary is a mother! I THINk that may be one of the reasons many ppl worship her, and as far fot the part of "you shall not be given my worship to ther figures than me" I belive that there is a problem there too, If we say that we are not to worship other than god, then there wouldn't be christianity in the first place, since we all worshop Christ, and.....
Jessus becomes God the son, But not God the father and I belive that when God said this Chyst had't even been born, So there is a contradiction too wrigth there.
So do you oppose Us Mexicans worshiping our Patroneese? Virgin of Guadalupe?
Randy G: Mary its not just some dead person, She gave Life to Jesus our saivior and She acended to the heaves as Christ did, and she had not been reencarnated.
I also belive that the worship of mary sometimes outstands that of God, or people Feeling more closer to Mary than to God, its not only becuse she is the mother, but because Its easier to worship something that you know how it looks like and its physic characteristics, We all know that the current picture of jesus and mary are not so accurate, but you dont know how god looks like, unlike Mary and Jesus, I also belive that Tha's why usually pplfeel closer to jesus or mary


sorry for the inconvinience
here is the link if you wish to see what ppl sayid:
Yahoo! Answers - Marian Beliefs?

Well Should the Virgin Mary be Worshiped?

[Gods_Mercenary]

The catholic church says that mary is an extremely important person, but I think people go far beyond that. I'm not sure why catholics feel a connection with mary, but I never contemplated it, although I probably should, it might be useful to understand the differences between catholics and protestants. I like to study religions to understand their believers' mindset.

[Poseidon]

I storngly suggest that You study Virgin mary (No I am not talking like a crazy fanatic, I am a Catholic and a "marian" but I am not a fanatic and I respect other ppls religions) Its really interesting that somethimes ppl feel closer to mary than to jesus or even God

[PatrickHenry]

The worship of Mary is unScriptural. Maryology is one of the great downfalls of the Catholic Church in my view. Mary was a virgin when Jesus was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit, not by her husband's seed. However, she had other natural children later and did not remain a virgin. Nothing wrong with that.

She must have been a very godly woman to have been trusted by God to conceive and bear, then rear, Jesus the Savior of mankind.

But she is not the Redeemer, Jesus is. Mary is not the Mediator between God and man, Jesus is. Mary is not the ruler of the Kingdom of Eternity. Jesus is.

Furthermore, Mary died a natural death and awaits the Resurrection, just like all the Godly people of history. She is not in Heaven looking down on the Earth, ready to intervene with supernatural powers.

By worshiping Mary, people are depriving the real object of worship his due. Jesus is the One. Worship Him Alone....

[Apotheosis]

Quote by: PatrickHenry The worship of Mary is unScriptural. Maryology is one of the great downfalls of the Catholic Church in my view.

It is not a great downfall, because literal 'worship' of Mary, as one would worship Jesus, does not actually exist. She is considered above all Saints, and plays a crucial role in the Christian faith, but she is not worshipped, nor is the role of Jesus forgotten during mass. Certain locations in Mexico may indeed go so far as to 'worship' the Virgin Mary as Poseidon stated, but I highly doubt that represents the doctrine of the entire Catholic Church.
The perception of Mother Mary in Latin-Ameica is interesting though. I plan on looking into the what connection she may have with countries like Mexico in Central and South America.....perhaps it has something to do with native beliefs and cultural icons.

[PatrickHenry]

It's syncretism.

Earlier pagan beliefs incorporated into the Church. Unholy goddess worship.

For every one "Our Father" ten "Hail Marys" are said.

The enemy has penetrated the Church...

[gallo]

Perhaps this gives us a clue to the thousands of christian sects that we see today. Poseidon claims to be a Catholic of Mexican heritage, and yet Poseidon professes heresy as far as the Catholic Church is concerned. According to the Catholic Church, only God is worshiped, that being the triune God (whatever that means). Mary and the saints are revered, not worshiped.

Perhaps we have here a clue to the origin of the thousands of Christian sects. Which one is the true religion?

[Zhavric]

"Hello. We're Catholics. We worship a three-aspected god, have a goddess who's a mortal mother of god who ascended into heaven and a pantheon of local folk heroes who we worship the same way older religions worshipped demi-gods...

... but we're monotheists. Polytheism is bad."



Yeah... never grasped the Mary schtick or why it's so important to be considered monotheists... and don't get me started on Catholic ceremony.

"Mary we love you so much, we're going to ritualistically eat and drink the blood of your son."

[phoenix_fire]

Quote by: Apotheosis It is not a great downfall, because literal 'worship' of Mary, as one would worship Jesus, does not actually exist. She is considered above all Saints, and plays a crucial role in the Christian faith, but she is not worshipped, nor is the role of Jesus forgotten during mass. Certain locations in Mexico may indeed go so far as to 'worship' the Virgin Mary as Poseidon stated, but I highly doubt that represents the doctrine of the entire Catholic Church. The perception of Mother Mary in Latin-Ameica is interesting though. I plan on looking into the what connection she may have with countries like Mexico in Central and South America.....perhaps it has something to do with native beliefs and cultural icons.

Before the Europeans reached Latin America, the society of many of the native groups was matriarchal. This is why when Catholic missionaries started "converting" the "barbarians", the Marian aspect was most emphasized and adopted. That, at least, explains Latin America. I can't so much speak for the rest of the Catholic world.

[Boetie]

God didn't have the balls to tell Mary he knocked her up. God had to send an angel to tell her.

Does the fact that Mary wasn't married to God make Jesus a bastard child?

Is God a pedofile?

If God is omnipresent does that explain wet dreams?

Virgin Mary what do you say to the above question.

[phoenix_fire]

At any rate, returning to a real debate *cough, cough*, I have to agree with PH on this. One can easily see that this Marian focus was not the intent of Christianity by looking at the epistles. There is no biblical support whatsoever for considering Mary in any context beyond that of any normal human being. Then again, Catholics revere some normal human beings as well, so I guess that it would go beyond just the matter of Mary. I think that the religion that has evolved around the saints is the invasion of animism into Christianity.

[Apotheosis]

Quote by: Boetie God didn't have the balls to tell Mary he knocked her up. God had to send an angel to tell her.

Yeah, he had already stated that the Isrealites were the 'chosen people', so he was stuck with the Hebrew culture. He couldn't choose any of those asian girls that everyone loves.

[phoenix_fire]

*cough, cough*

[Fonceai]

I thought the revering of Mary as an intercessor was to ensure that matriarchal religions or female worshipers would be happy with Catholicism.

[phoenix_fire]

Quote by: Fonceai I thought the revering of Mary as an intercessor was to ensure that matriarchal religions or female worshipers would be happy with Catholicism.

Not really. That was a result when matriarchal groups were confronted with Catholicism, as I mentioned above, but not a cause. The Mary cult developed in the eleventh century, starting in France. Clairvaux somehow thought, I guess, that Mary might be a little more personable than Jesus. Personally, I find it all disturbing.

[Fonceai]

Find what disturbing?

Making Mary an intercessor?

[phoenix_fire]

Quote by: Fonceai Find what disturbing? Making Mary an intercessor?

The whole set of beliefs that has grown up around her, really. Like that she was "full of grace" from birth and "free of the taint of original sin". Not that I believe in original sin, exactly. But the dangerous thing here is that it implies another sinless person in history besides Jesus. It implies that she did not need salvation in order to obtain Heaven. The Bible itself says that this is not possible.

I further think it is idiotic how they insist that Mary remained a virgin for the entirety of her life. She was a married woman, for crying out loud. Even if you buy the claims that Jesus' brothers were really "cousins" as the Catholics say, you can't expect that a married woman never consummated her vows. But this reflects another Catholic idea that I think is silly: the idea that sex is inherently sinful. Many even think that sex WAS the original sin. This too is silly. Read Genesis and try substituting the references to "eating the fruit" with "having sex". Doesn't really work.

I am bothered that adherents would put her between man and Christ. The whole point of incarnation was that God became man to be among us. I don't like how the Virgin cult seems to confer greater status and power to Mary than even to Christ and perhaps even to God. Worship of Mary (and of the other saints) is idolatry, and a woeful marriage of Christianity to animism. It is all very bothersome and it detracts from the true worship of God.

[Fonceai]

Understood, phoenix, and your perspective on it is much appreciated and well-articulated, considering how strongly you apparently feel about it.

One of the alternative interpretations that my wife and I respect is that if the only man a woman sleeps with before marriage ends up being her husband, she's done nothing wrong, because she is still pure for that one man.

[The_Genius]

Mary should be respected for who she was, not worshipped. I don't think worshipping humans is monotheistic..

[Fonceai]

Someone once told me that those who worship Mary are in the wrong.

But praying to Mary to intercede isn't as bad.

Her denomination of Christianity/Catholicism believed that praying directly to God and/or Jesus was wrong.

You prayed to a saint to intercede on your behalf.