Messages from Ariel

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: nilan3000 Well I didnt say they werent decent. Its just that lunatics in general are a bit....lunatic....

I know

That makes them so much more fun!

[nilan3000]

Yes they are so much more fun. Till they start trying to act sane. And then claiming that they can talk to angels and dance with demons.

[arielmessenger]

Look. I responded to requests for posting my Biomystical Christianity religious belief system. I did this knowing flak would instantly come my way as it always does whenever, wherever I post BC opinions on any religious discussion forums.

If there is enough real intellectually honest curiosity about BC I am always glad to go into it in depth. But dealing with crummy put-downs, one-liners, i.e., stupid comments only meant to defame my character, I can do without.

My book will be out in print whenever I finish the last Story of Paxcalibur chapter. I gave you all an opportunity to see how the founding of a new religion happens in modern times but this doesn't seem of any serious interest to anyone of you, including Capt. Chaos who is still trying to make God, angels, prophets into carnival fortune-tellers as if prophets were known for telling fortunes like magicians pulling rabbits out of hats or reading names or numbers off of slips of paper supposedly unseen by them. This isn't parlor tricks but spiritual movement and it doesn't perform on demand for any human being.

I will wait a while to see if the discussion here improves but if not, I'm sorry but I'm not wasting my time talking to those who have no intention of debating spiritual matters with an open mind. The Pax site be closed down again unless I see a change in attitude here.

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: AM but this doesn't seem of any serious interest to anyone of you, including Capt. Chaos who is still trying to make God, angels, prophets into carnival fortune-tellers as if prophets were known for telling fortunes like magicians pulling rabbits out of hats or reading names or numbers off of slips of paper supposedly unseen by them.

I am sorry that upsets you so much. But, without a convincing demonstration of some sort, I find it hard to believe that your religion comes from anything other than your imagination.

Try seeing it from my perspective. I do not believe in the Bible, Islam, Judaism, B'hai, or any other revealed religion. Whenever someone says they are speaking for God, or Gabriel, or even Ariel, I am left wondering why these entities could not be bothered to communicate with us in a more convincing fashion.

That applies to this situation. I am sorry that Ariel or God cannot be bothered to convince us through a few simple tests, or some other form of convincing communication. To me, this means that if they exist, they are not interested in having our belief at this time.

What is wrong with my reasoning, AM?

I will wait a while to see if the discussion here improves but if not, I'm sorry but I'm not wasting my time talking to those who have no intention of debating spiritual matters with an open mind. The Pax site be closed down again unless I see a change in attitude here.

AM, wanting convincing evidence is not being closed minded. If you wish to succeed in your mission, you are going to need to do more than preach.

[nilan3000]

AM, right now you have no more credibility than any other member in this forum as a messenger of one of God's angels. How can you accuse us of being close minded when you have been completely unable to give us even a single shred of proof? You expect people to accept something based on the sole fact that you tell them to?

If I claimed that I am in fact God himself, would you beleive me just because I told you I was? How can you expect us to beleive in something as monumental as this when all we have are just claims without even the slightest hint of authenticity?

If you can come up with anything at all to back your claims up, you have my full support in trying to get your message across to the masses. Till then, please dont get mad if we call you a raving lunatic, because that is precisely what you sound like.

Besides if God wanted us to know of his 'messenger', Im sure he isnt so dumb that he wouldnt provide him with any sort of credibility at all.

[Gods_Mercenary]

There's no way you're God man, I am, you're just my most powerful angel :)

Either way, prove us wrong, AM

[nilan3000]

Quote by: Gods_Mercenary There's no way you're God man, I am, you're just my most powerful angel :)

*sssshhhhhhh*

(whispers) Im here in cognito...these mortal fools are not to be aware of my true form yet...

[pikatore]

Quote by: arielmessenger This isn't parlor tricks but spiritual movement and it doesn't perform on demand for any human being.

If your angel can give you crazy mysticial signs that predict various things about the future, which more or less grants you a clairvoyant ability, why can't your angel do something so much simpler than that, but in doing so, convince millions of people? Hmmm?

You know that only true way to believe that something exists is to have TANGIBLE, CONCLUSIVE, UNDENIABLE EVIDENCE of it. So far, you've failed to do the thing that other religious leaders and 'prophets' have failed to do, and that is what I just typed in caps. Come back with some evidence, and we'll talk. Until then, your posts will be interpreted as the ramblings of a lunatic.

Fair enough?

[arielmessenger]

How many times have you been told by others? You cannot demand anything from God or the spiritual world. It isn't on call for just anyone. Prophets are "chosen", they don't make themselves.

So your demands for parlor tricks are out. I can't make God do carnival tricks and you are foolish to ask for such. What you are not asking but need to ask is what proof do I have that any of my religious visions are anything more than my own fantasies. What proof is there that others have felt spiritual contact through my visions? Yet none of you are asking for such proof of spiritual energy happening outside my mind, you want to make this into a magician's magic show where you can explain to the audience how the fraud goes about guessing numbers or names supposedly hidden from view to him. Prophets don't do that.

[arielmessenger]

to accompany me when I am on my mission to the Holy Land and see what happens there, see if anyone takes Paxcalibur seriously or not, see if you see any signs of unexpected unusual spiritual energy that would mark divine intervention. Then wait, as I wait for the tides of history to change confirming or not confirming events predicted in religious communion--e.g. a growing acceptance of the name "Canaan" as the proper name for the Holy Land shared by all Abrahamic faithful.

My prophesy consists of pointing the direction in which social change will occur but it is not a fortune-telling operation that can pin-point specific events other than the one needed to be performed by the Muslim stewards of the Dome of the Rock. For that kind of prediction making you need to install my Futurescope software.

[Gods_Mercenary]

I can make vague predictions about the future based on my experience with international trends, but that doesn't make me a prophet.

[nilan3000]

My cousin is a stock broker and share trader for Goldman Sachs, he has to speculate and predict the rise of fall of shares every day. Maybe I can start a religion revolved around him.

[pikatore]

Your angel has quite a nasty bias of things, I must say.

Quite a few things that have been 'predicted' make assumptions that (a) demean other religions directly, especially Islam and Judaism, and claim that they are fraudulent, and in one case which I find a VERY questionable claim, declaring traditional Islam void of any form of democracy, and imply that atheists hold thier beliefs due to an oppression of religious freedom, something that really ticks me off. Your angel obviously has quite a skewed view of things.

[arielmessenger]

Quote by: pikatore Your angel has quite a nasty bias of things, I must say. Quite a few things that have been 'predicted' make assumptions that (a) demean other religions directly, especially Islam and Judaism, and claim that they are fraudulent, and in one case which I find a VERY questionable claim, declaring traditional Islam void of any form of democracy, and imply that atheists hold thier beliefs due to an oppression of religious freedom, something that really ticks me off. Your angel obviously has quite a skewed view of things.

Ariel is the heavenly Archetype for the Lion of God as well as Angel of Peace. No milk-toasts become prophets and one inspired by the Lion of God will at times show his claws.

Muhammad has made traditional Islam impossible to be compatible with democratic principles of equality before the law. First off, no Muslim is permitted to question Muhammad's teachings. They are told they are from Allah and that's the end of it which negates the democratic principle of equality before the law extended to all parties, even non-believers in Muhammad or his book. So, if you are not a Muslim in a country where Muslims are in the majority and rule politically, you are a second-class citizen without basic freedoms found in real democracies, e.g, the freedom to worship God or not worship in any way the individual has found fits his or her needs.

Proof of Muslim intolerance to democratic equality before the law is to be found throughout the Muslim world where no Christians can practice the major tenet of their faith which is proselytizing the Gospel, and gays and atheists and satirical cartoonists who declare their views publicly become targets for religious persecution and/or death.

And what's up with this "and imply that atheists hold thier beliefs due to an oppression of religious freedom"? What are you talking about?:eek:

[rcne]

Ariel is the heavenly Archetype for the Lion of God as well as Angel of Peace

Doen't this oxymoron seem a paradox for you?

[Eclipse]

Well, I took a read of the site a while ago and this thread and I am impressed to an extent although it holds no spiritual sway for me it held some social/cultural appeal.

I'm just curious as to why Native American spirituality was singled out from other similiar cultures besides the obvious influence upon you by the Native Americans you share a bond with. If you gained more knowledge of past/present foraging/horticulture societies, would your spectrum grow more general? Or have you already this knowledge and there is a distinct difference that cuts off those spiritualities?

Perhaps I have missed something critical but I would, for the most part, deem such cultures as generally similar.

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: arielmessenger How many times have you been told by others? You cannot demand anything from God or the spiritual world. It isn't on call for just anyone. Prophets are "chosen", they don't make themselves. So your demands for parlor tricks are out. I can't make God do carnival tricks and you are foolish to ask for such. What you are not asking but need to ask is what proof do I have that any of my religious visions are anything more than my own fantasies. What proof is there that others have felt spiritual contact through my visions? Yet none of you are asking for such proof of spiritual energy happening outside my mind, you want to make this into a magician's magic show where you can explain to the audience how the fraud goes about guessing numbers or names supposedly hidden from view to him. Prophets don't do that.

The phrase parlor tricks is misleading. I simply want evidence. If you are offering some other sort of evidence, please post it.

However, I just see no reason why god and Ariel and the like would not be willing to answer direct questions, if they were interested in teaching us directly.

I am sorry, AM. I do not mean this to be offensive, but it really just smacks of excuse making to me.

You keep saying god and Ariel do not respond to direct request - well, why the heck not? Directly answering questions would not lower God's status or anything.

[Keith Hamburger]

OK. Even being a strong agnostic/atheist, I'll take a bit of a different tack than many have so far.

AM, what you've written seems very interesting and somewhat compelling. This is looking like a reasonable response to my question of "Is there a god that I can worship" thread. Peace and harmony, no demands for worship but it would be nice if you did, no formal organized relgious hierarchy, etc.

I like what you say you've been doing with different societies and communities that have often been "left out". As a libertarian, I could definitely condone activism in working to better the situations of Native Americans through non-governmental efforts, whatever their spiritual base.

While I'm interested in hearing more, I'll have to take a peripheral position on all this, though. I tend to be one of those that expects more evidence than has been provided so far but, unlike some others, I'm not going to be militant in my demands. Without something more to encourage me to do so, I'm not going to read through book length diatribes (not meaning the word in any derogatory sense).

But, good luck in all your efforts. I'll try to keep a peripheral eye on how things are proceeding for you and most of what you have to say and what your goals are seem, to me, to be quite positive. You could be doing far worse.

Keith

[pikatore]

Quote by: arielmessenger Ariel is the heavenly Archetype for the Lion of God as well as Angel of Peace. No milk-toasts become prophets and one inspired by the Lion of God will at times show his claws.

....?!

Quote by: arielmessenger First off, no Muslim is permitted to question Muhammad's teachings.

Neither is any Christian. Try having a philosophical argument with the Pope and question Jesus' teachings, you'll be laughed right out of the Vatican.

Quote by: arielmessenger and gays and atheists and satirical cartoonists who declare their views publicly become targets for religious persecution and/or death.

Hardliner Christians have extreme views towards those groups as well. What's your point there? That Islam teaches intolerance? And if it does, Christianity doesn't?

Quote by: arielmessenger And what's up with this "and imply that atheists hold thier beliefs due to an oppression of religious freedom"? What are you talking about?:eek:

Read up on your own prophicies, and look for the one mentioning atheists. Also, I the term 'spiritual authority' makes jack all sense in a debate.

[phoenix_fire]

Quote by: arielmessenger Look. I responded to requests for posting my Biomystical Christianity religious belief system. I did this knowing flak would instantly come my way as it always does whenever, wherever I post BC opinions on any religious discussion forums. If there is enough real intellectually honest curiosity about BC I am always glad to go into it in depth. But dealing with crummy put-downs, one-liners, i.e., stupid comments only meant to defame my character, I can do without. My book will be out in print whenever I finish the last Story of Paxcalibur chapter. I gave you all an opportunity to see how the founding of a new religion happens in modern times but this doesn't seem of any serious interest to anyone of you, including Capt. Chaos who is still trying to make God, angels, prophets into carnival fortune-tellers as if prophets were known for telling fortunes like magicians pulling rabbits out of hats or reading names or numbers off of slips of paper supposedly unseen by them. This isn't parlor tricks but spiritual movement and it doesn't perform on demand for any human being. I will wait a while to see if the discussion here improves but if not, I'm sorry but I'm not wasting my time talking to those who have no intention of debating spiritual matters with an open mind. The Pax site be closed down again unless I see a change in attitude here.

Heh. Your scolding holds no sway over me or, I would chance to say, anyone else. You talk of closing your site as if we would care. We would not. You overestimate yourself.

I will not ask you to perform magic tricks. I know what kind of generation it is that asks for a sign. However. I have read your words and I find them to be in utter contradiction with the Holy Spirit of God. There is no way whatsoever that you speak for Him. If I were to take you seriously at all, I would have to assume either that your so-called angelic communications are really demonic possession or that you, yourself are the false prophet or some other sort of agent of the antichrist. The idea of your abomination standing in the holy place would seem to support the latter.

You are far better off if I do not take you seriously.