What if Atheism was the dominant concept?

[Jack]

I sure agree tha most non believers(aethists included) are law abiding and certainly realize that there is a need for codified brakes on human behavior!

Exactly. Anarchy and chaos on a social level wouldn't be to anyone's advantage. Social behaviors that lead to a more constructive and healthy society should be encouraged by anyone regardless of their philosophical leanings.

[another day]

It's disturbing that you theists contend the only reason you have morals is because of the threat of eternal punishment. Most atheists have morals because they are caring and compassionate people. So who are the actually good people here?

Of course there is no true correlation between the two, I'm just playing your own games here. An atheist can be evil just like a theist can be evil and vice versa.

There have been countless instances of genocide purpotrated by theists just like there have been by non-theists. The difference is that the genocide my theists is inspired by their faith, not the same for non-theists. And yes, Hitler was an avid christian who believed he was doing god's work.

[The_Genius]

Quote by: Zhavric Evolution is evidenced. Why do you keep calling it a myth?

Well, it is a myth. It lacks scientific foundation and fossil records does not support this myth either.

Complete lack of education in South Africa is what should be coming to mind. We are descended from human beings who learned to instinctively work together. We see similar behavior in all social mammals including whales, elephants, some felines, and canines. As I've already detailed, religion seeks to take credit for out instinctive morality.

Back to instincts... Let's say, someone has insulted you in poublic. And your "instincts" tell you, I should kill that person. Since you don't have fear of punishment, you would kill that person... A man without any moral education but only driven by instincts, is dangerous. Your argument was a joke. If we all start following our instincts blindly, we would kill ourselves even before 2010 world cup.

[The_Genius]

Quote by: Lullaby Chainer It's also quite disturbing to see you claim that atheists live in anarchy. No, it's not just disturbing, it's incredibly rude and highly delusional.

I never said atheists live in anarchy...

I said, if we all start following Zhav's backward "instincts" theory, we would be living in complete anarchy. We cannot do whatever our crazy instincts instruct us to do. May be in some situations but not all the time.

[another day]

Have you ever heard of a concept called empathy? This is what keeps most people from killing/hurting other people, not the threat of punishment. Empathy is an instinct. Morals were derived from our compassionate instincts, and THEN inserted into various religions, not the other way around.

[Jack]

Since you don't have fear of punishment, you would kill that person.

Legal punishments are not based on religious teachings. It's nonsensical to suppose a society based on rationality would not have legal punishments.

Well, it is a myth. It lacks scientific foundation and fossil records does not support this myth either.

I can't respect a position based on willful ignorance. If you choose to ignore science, that's fine. But you really shouldn't attempt to debate a subject you display no knowledge of.

Let's say, someone has insulted you in poublic. And your "instincts" tell you, I should kill that person.

I would say you are criminally over-reacting. I don't need religion to point out the fallacy of that hypothetical.

Quote by: The_Genius Well, [evolution by natural selection] is a myth. It lacks scientific foundation and fossil records does not support this myth either.

Why do you keep saying things that are patently false? Why do you keep saying things that the simplest of literature searches can debunk? Even the Roman Catholic church accepts the scientific validity of biological evolution by natural selection.

Regards
S.

[Kamehameha34]

I think life on Earth would be seriously affected. The evolution myth will be taught in every schools to brainwash masses with theories that lack scientific foundations and we may experience more genocides since atheist leaders like Hitler would promote social darwinism. I'm glad atheism is ot the dominant concept.

1) Hitler was not an atheist. You can't say he wasn't just because he did bad things. He was a Christian who sinned.

2) Evolution has more evidence behind it than the Creationists who try to keep it out of schools.

[Jack]

This thread has accomplished one thing. It got Volconvo noticed by the Google Alert system. In my most recent results from a Google Alert for atheism, this thread shows up as a result.

[arielmessenger]

Quote by: Lullaby Chainer In that case, God has a lot of explaining to do. Not only did he rape my sister, he's killing Jews, burning witches, torturing the innocent (oh wait, he already does that.. we know that :) ), driving drunk, doing pot, shooting people, robbing banks... So, since I'm just part of this play that you yourself say God has written from the beginning of time, why am I so damn unlucky as to get the role of the moral modest kid that gets good grades and loves his family and friends but ends up in Hell to suffer forever and ever and ever? :]

The problem atheists see when theists talk of God is who then is responsible for evil in the world? In my Christian belief system God has created Creation to evolve the Spirit through the material world's evolution. It is an ongoing process but at all times, Creation runs on the "rules" of life and death and perpetual conflict. In an "on and off" again energy transference time-bound universe this translates to somebody's alive while someone else is dead or dying. The biological rules are brutal until higher consciousness kicks in with human beings learning morality through, yes, their spiritual beliefs, because it is only through spiritual consciousness at some point in a person's life, or a culture, that the values we hold dear now were first introduced.

Atheism never did this because atheistic belief has no answer for animal behavior which we all would still be stuck in except for spiritual conscious leadership leading us out of animal behavior and into morality. Many of the so-called "evil" acts human beings are capable of can be seen as exaggeration of animal behavior, e.g. serial killers mimicking hunting instincts, e.g. gangsters and military juntas offing the competition for territorial control, e.g. rape being part of ancient war patterns that actually introduced outside genes into the community gene pools.

I didn't invent the Play and I'm certainly not the only one who's seen it for what it is. In the Hindu religion the concept of recognition of the world as a Play is called "maya", seeing the world as an illusion. The Abrahamics talk a lot about "free will" but it too is an illusion. Someone in the Abrahamic tradition has seen the truth for the concept is found here in Psalm 139:16--

"Your eyes saw my substance, being yet unformed.
And in Your book they all were written,
The days fashioned for me,
When as yet there were none of them."

[arielmessenger]

Quote by: another day Crap. I'm atheist and highly right brain dominant...artistic, musical, linguistic. not mathematical at all. This is simply a falsehood.

Perhaps it is that part of right brains that registers spiritual phenomena that isn't developed in atheistic minds. Both hemispheres should be functioning in coordination to be fully conscious of the world seen and unseen. My understanding is that every mental state has a corresponding physical pattern in the human brain so I assume inactivity in some region of the brain of atheists that is active in theists.

[Suburbanite]

Quote by: The_Genius What if - instead of religions - atheism was the dominant concept in this planet? Although atheists label religions as "myths", Holy Books do offer moral guidance for the masses. If atheism was dominant, what type of morals, good values would exist within human beings?

Great point. Personally I consider myself an amoral person. Not immoral. I just don't appeal to any sense of morals for my choices, in terms of being right or wrong. I think in terms of things being helpful or useless. I consider myself a liberal, the definition of which i define as one who thinks cruelty is the worst thing humans can do to each other. But I do know that my liberalism is contingent, and that it isn't out of another worldly force but my own drive that this ideals i pursued. It makes it easier to justify your failure when their isn't the threat of damnation, but I'm still a relatively nice person.
Also, on the issue, just want to remind people that in your search for autonomy you may involuntarily harm others, and it is your responsibility to be hyperaware enough to avoid such things. For more on this, check out Proust and Nabokov.

[arielmessenger]

That our brains have receptors for God consciousness. Now how could that ever evolve in an animal mind? It's a puzzle right up there with how humans ever came to believe in spiritual reality in the first place. Not exactly the expected result of natural selection for those most capable of keeping the species alive if they're off chasing invisible angels and gods.

[Jack]

The problem atheists see when theists talk of God is who then is responsible for evil in the world?

"Evil" is a religious concept. Atheists may be concerned about crime, war, etc., but we wouldn't categorize anything as evil. That term, in its literal and formal usage, isn't part of the atheist's vocabulary.

it is only through spiritual consciousness at some point in a person's life, or a culture, that the values we hold dear now were first introduced.

So someone who was a life-long atheist wouldn't share those values? Which values, exactly?

Atheism never did this because atheistic belief has no answer for animal behavior which we all would still be stuck in except for spiritual conscious leadership leading us out of animal behavior and into morality.

Atheists accept our animal origins. All human behavior is animal behavior, since humans are just another specie of animal. Atheists have this concept called personal responsibility that encourages everyone to develop and live by a code of conduct that will enable them to peacefully co-exist with others in society.

[Suburbanite]

Quote by: arielmessenger Perhaps it is that part of right brains that registers spiritual phenomena that isn't developed in atheistic minds. Both hemispheres should be functioning in coordination to be fully conscious of the world seen and unseen. My understanding is that every mental state has a corresponding physical pattern in the human brain so I assume inactivity in some region of the brain of atheists that is active in theists.

If every thought has a specific location in the brain, does that mean every thought is attainable? Can I think in Russian without learning it?

[Suburbanite]

Quote by: Isherwood Atheists accept our animal origins. All human behavior is animal behavior, since humans are just another specie of animal. Atheists have this concept called personal responsibility that encourages everyone to develop and live by a code of conduct that will enable them to peacefully co-exist with others in society.

I love everything else you've said, until this point. I don't think it is true that all atheists accept our animal origins-- I myself am not completely convinced (and hardly concerned) with this way of thinking.

[Jack]

Perhaps it is that part of right brains that registers spiritual phenomena that isn't developed in atheistic minds.

This too is "proof" of some Higher purpose That our brains have receptors for God consciousness.

if that's "proof", then you should be able to support it. I know of brain research that has shown our brains are active in various regions when we think about philosophy, sex, food, etc. But I've heard nothing about "god receptors".

[Jagged]

I think that if the only reason people choose to be good people is so they dont get punished in the afterlife, they should go to hell. I enjoy being a good person because i have self respect, and i would feel bad about myself if i didnt. This probably comes from a combination of my own ideas and my parents teachings. My morals are also close to religion, but they probably change once in awhile.

Quote by: Isherwood But I've heard nothing about "god receptors".

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I mean, for all you know this "God Receptor"could just be a summer breeze, or you could call it your dead grandfather trying to reach you, or telepathically talking to your dog.

[Jack]

I don't think it is true that all atheists accept our animal origins

You're absolutely correct. I apologize for mis-wording that. I should have said that atheism permits us to consider humans as another specie of animal, as atheism itself doesn't address that issue. In the same way that many theistic biologists don't have any issue with considering humans animals. Freethinking is just that, the ability to think freely, for yourself.
Thanks, Suburbanite.

[Suburbanite]

Quote by: arielmessenger That our brains have receptors for God consciousness.

You just made all those words up. What the hell are you talking about?