Does ISLAM Make Saudia Arabia a Bad Country to Live In?

[RickSp]

Quote by: rcne Isn't Saudi the home of Wadism? Now thats one Islamic Brotherhood of fundamentalism. Which I think is now causing even the supporters within Saudi some problems. So indeed this Wadism version of Islam does make Saudi Arabia a bad country to live in if you are not a Wadi Saudi.

A small point. Wadi is Arabic for a dry riverbed. The Saudis are often referred to as Wahbis, named after Muhammad ibn Abd al Wahhab. The Saudis themselves prefer to be called Salafis. Calling them a dry riverbed might confuse them thoroughly.

Not a big deal.

And I agree. Wahabi/Salafiism has to make Saudi a less than fun place to be.

[Praxius]

Quote by: The_Genius I don't live in Saudi Arabia or USA... I was just refuting STW..

Yeah, I notice the S.Africa...... I was speaking in general terms, not anybody in particular..... I just see it eventually going as my comment states above.....

[The_Genius]

Just wondering what happened to STW's "debating spirits"?

[ByaKya]

Quote by: rcne Isn't Saudi the home of Wadism? Now thats one Islamic Brotherhood of fundamentalism. Which I think is now causing even the supporters within Saudi some problems. So indeed this Wadism version of Islam does make Saudi Arabia a bad country to live in if you are not a Wadi Saudi.

Its Wahabism

And Saudi arabia would be a questionable place to live in no matter the religion = )

[ByaKya]

Quote by: The_Genius On the other thread, I was talking about the ‘safety from criminals’ that Saudi Arabians enjoy because of Islamic Judicial System. Not once, I have mentioned Saudi Arabia is the perfect example of a democratic country. You didn’t even know that Salafism/Wahhabism does not form the majority of Sunni Islam. That’s what happens when you avoid real knowledge and visit anti-Islamic propaganda sites most of the times. What are you on about? Why don’t you quote what I really said and stop exaggerating? I find your definition of happiness quite unrealistic. Why? 1. Check how many women get raped in Saudi Arabia compare to how many women are raped in USA everyday. ‘Equality’ is not equivalent of a ‘woman’s safety from rapists’. 2. Umm… Saudi Arabia did not pass the Patriot Act, USA did. 3. What about Black Nationalists being killed while they were fighting for civil rights? 4. yeah right… These days, almost every religious Muslim is a potential terrorist in USA. 5. Keith Elison? He is the first one and probably the last. 6. Wishful thinking! Like Bush really cares about what you think… 7. Can’t see much of a difference between 5 and 7. 8. No wonder why Blacks and Latinos get the worst education. By the way, Klu Kluz Klan did not originate from Saudi Arabia… 9. Come on! Nor you or I live in Utopia. 10. Coming from the citizen of an imperialist nation… Economic equality in capitalism??? That’s something new. 11. How come war criminals like Bush don’t get judged? 12. Have you heard the name Abu Gharib prison? Or Guantanamo Bay is sufficient to remind you? Even knives that are used to cut fruits scare me like hell and I hate action movies or PC games that have anything to with “guns”. You don’t even know me and already making assumptions? Typical example of how the US media turns a peaceful Muslim into a terrorist…

Game Set Match.

Its really annoying when people throw rocks back at your glass house !

I wonder how many conservative christians would love a saudi arabia type state within the union where the bible is law?

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: The_Genius I don't live in Saudi Arabia or USA... I was just refuting STW..

Who's STW?

[Jack]

STW=StrongHeartsWin

[Gods_Mercenary]

Saudi Arabia isn't a horrible place to live by say, a Sub saharran African's standards (doesn't count South Africa Genius) It all depends on where your coming from, especially considering most of their country is desert. As to the rights thing, not all people believe everyone should have the rights we enjoy in the west.

[StrongHeartsWin]

Here is a look at what the Islamic country of Saudi Arabia teaches its school children in some of their national text books. Oh and keep in mind, these were the textbooks that were after the revision of them because international orgs were complaining about the hatred and intolerance they were teaching. Looks like they just don`t understand what hatred and intolerance is if they think they have purged it -- or perhaps that is what they wish to perpetuate. See below text book examples:

FIRST GRADE
" Every religion other than Islam is false."
"Fill in the blanks with the appropriate words (Islam, hellfire): Every religion other than ______________ is false. Whoever dies outside of Islam enters ____________."

FOURTH GRADE
"True belief means . . . that you hate the polytheists and infidels but do not treat them unjustly."

FIFTH GRADE
"It is forbidden for a Muslim to be a loyal friend to someone who does not believe in God and His Prophet, or someone who fights the religion of Islam."

SIXTH GRADE
"Just as Muslims were successful in the past when they came together in a sincere endeavor to evict the Christian crusaders from Palestine, so will the Arabs and Muslims emerge victorious, God willing, against the Jews and their allies if they stand together and fight a true jihad for God, for this is within God's power."

EIGHTH GRADE
"As cited in Ibn Abbas: The apes are Jews, the people of the Sabbath; while the swine are the Christians, the infidels of the communion of Jesus."

NINTH GRADE
"The clash between this [Muslim] community (umma) and the Jews and Christians has endured, and it will continue as long as God wills."

"Muslims will triumph because they are right. He who is right is always victorious, even if most people are against him."

TENTH GRADE
"Blood money for a free infidel. [Its quantity] is half of the blood money for a male Muslim, whether or not he is 'of the book' or not 'of the book' (such as a pagan, Zoroastrian, etc.).

ELEVENTH GRADE
"The greeting 'Peace be upon you' is specifically for believers. It cannot be said to others."

TWELFTH GRADE
"Jihad in the path of God -- which consists of battling against unbelief, oppression, injustice, and those who perpetrate it -- is the summit of Islam. This religion arose through jihad and through jihad was its banner raised high. It is one of the noblest acts, which brings one closer to God, and one of the most magnificent acts of obedience to God." Source

Now, who would want to live in a place like that where the children are spoon fed this gobbly gunk of intolerance from grade one to twelve? And where is the uproar in the Islamic world about this kind of thing? Perhaps the uproar isn`t there because their textbooks, too, have tints of the same color -- or where they don`t, they secretly believe in the truth of the wording in those text books. What would be the reaction in the Muslim world if our textbooks talked inflamatory rhetoric in them about Muslims or Allah?

If you look at the recent uproar over the Pope`s comments and the cartoon protestations, you could probably get a hint of what would come of it.

I am now left wondering if I had made the OP too restrictive focusing only on one Islamic country.

[Gods_Mercenary]

It is interesting that the pope citing a meidevil text can incite so much wrath when they have this in their texbooks. I found it mildly amusing that the Pope's talk had to do with how it is intolerable to use religion as a excuse for violence (a man of his office would know, considering its history), and then, to prove him wrong, muslims formed violent mobs and killed a nun. Interesting way to prove that you are peaceful.

[RickSp]

Quote by: Gods_Mercenary Saudi Arabia isn't a horrible place to live by say, a Sub saharran African's standards (doesn't count South Africa Genius) It all depends on where your coming from, especially considering most of their country is desert. As to the rights thing, not all people believe everyone should have the rights we enjoy in the west.

Many years ago I turned down a job offer in Jeddah. I am glad I made the choice I made for reasons having nothing to do with the job, but it could have beeen interesting all the same.

I have known Westerners who were very happy living in Saudi in the 70s and 80s. They lived in a Westerners only enclave for oil company workers and engineers. They made good money and had a life style not all that different from suburban America. One told me that one of the lesser Saudi princes was their bootlegger, supplying their beer and liquor. As ex-pat postings went, it sounded much better than being an American working in Eastern Europe or parts of Asia at the time.

[Gods_Mercenary]

Granted, the Westerners were being treated well because they were westerners helping with oil, but as far as standards of living goes, I'd prefer Saudi Arabia over many other countries.

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: Isherwood STW=StrongHeartsWin

But if you go with the caps the have SHW.

[bishop]

the fundamentalists help make saudi arabia a bad country to live in, amongst many other reasons... really, i can think of loads of countries i wouldn't want to live in for a variety of reasons. i'd say that not wanting to live in a country that holds public executions is a good rule of thumb.

but specifically regarding islamic countries - i wouldn't want to live in any of them. their economies suck, as do their politics/governments... people in those countries don't seem to be big proponents of free speech, but rather, groupthink.. i'm not a big fan of islamists, just as i loathe christian fundamentalists and fundie jews, etc... (although, i'd rank islamists as being the most savage of the bunch.)

[Gods_Mercenary]

Fundemental Christians tend to live in countries where their governments can keep them down, when the fundementalists are allowed influence they tend to get more fanatical, which happens in the Muslim countries.

[RickSp]

Quote by: bishop but specifically regarding islamic countries - i wouldn't want to live in any of them. their economies suck, as do their politics/governments... people in those countries don't seem to be big proponents of free speech, but rather, groupthink.. i'm not a big fan of islamists, just as i loathe christian fundamentalists and fundie jews, etc... (although, i'd rank islamists as being the most savage of the bunch.)

I might enjoy Dubai for a few years. Maybe only because my ski trip next weekend won't happen because of no snow. In Dubai they have an indoor ski mountain.

[Gods_Mercenary]

Dubai, that'd be awesome, I bet everything costs like, a hundred dollars though.

[bishop]

Quote by: RickSp I might enjoy Dubai for a few years. Maybe only because my ski trip next weekend won't happen because of no snow. In Dubai they have an indoor ski mountain.

heh.. no indoor ski mountains here, but i only have to drive 1.5 miles north to get to the ski mountains. i would, but i've never gone skiing

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: RickSp I might enjoy Dubai for a few years. Maybe only because my ski trip next weekend won't happen because of no snow. In Dubai they have an indoor ski mountain.

I'd like to see those huge artificial islands they are building. They are putting whole communities on these things. One is shaped like a palm tree.

Still, you and I might like to go there, but even for a few years we'd still be visitors (and still US citizens to boot). I figure living there permanently would be a different thing altogether.

[ByaKya]

Quote by: Scribbler1 I'd like to see those huge artificial islands they are building. They are putting whole communities on these things. One is shaped like a palm tree. Still, you and I might like to go there, but even for a few years we'd still be visitors (and still US citizens to boot). I figure living there permanently would be a different thing altogether.

Dude, they got micheal jackson as the director of entertainment or something like that. im serious.
wouldnt mind visiting some muslim countries like that. i read Qatar and the united arab emirates, lebanon and jordan are some of the better places.