Religion and Enlightenment

[Zinkovich]

I don't like the word "enlightenment" for the simple reason that it does not lead to, well, enlightening attitudes due to its implication that there is a heirarchy with "enlightened" people and "lesser" folk.

I think this is part of the source of the whole idea of their being prophets and saints- after an enlightened person dies, people feel they can only be as exceptional as him by clinging to his words- soon, the words become tradition, the tradition becomes widespread, and then become asserted as something unquestionable in the minds of the dead man's followers.

What do you think? Do you think the word "enlightened" establishes a authority far too broad and unrealistic when actually applied as a personal attribute? Do you think the idea that people can be "enlightened" has created more followers, or more innovators?

Perhaps more importantly, do you think that enlightenment is a word that can be used nonreligiously? Is it a "secular" word or a "religious" one?

[Jack]

Do you think the word "enlightened" establishes a authority far too broad and unrealistic when actually applied as a personal attribute?

If you're asking, "Do I think that the majority of Westerners feel that way about the term enlightenment?" I'd say yes. Do I agree with that sentiment? No. Enlightenment in the Eastern sense is a personal achievement. It's a different moment for everyone. It's a change in perspective, not an improvement in character.

Perhaps more importantly, do you think that enlightenment is a word that can be used nonreligiously?

Mathematicians, musicians and physicists can reached states of enlightenment. If anything, I think we're seeing a decrease in the number of people reaching moments of enlightenment. Geniuses are becoming less common (so I hear. I don't have stats.). Maybe we're just going through a waning phase.

[Technosoul]

Sometimes enlightenment is presented as a kind of scientific happening. They use the energy located in the sex drive - that energy is directed through guided mediations such that it seems to rise up the spinal cord to different (chaklas) or locations in the body. It rises to the belly button (where we learn to become aware of what we eat so we can be healthy), then it rises into the heart (where we learn about compassion and such virtures) and then into the neck where the energy is seperated and directed to different parts of the brain - for a healthy mind ( attitude, motive, proper harmones, etc.) and then the energy shoots out of the top of the head into a dimension just about the skull - enlightenment would be that extra-reality experience (seldom reached my the majority of students).

The Bible is set up with a historical outline of that procedure of enlightenment. The Bible starts off with who begat who and "sex". Then moves up the "serpent" (spine) to what we should or should not eat. Then up into the heart zone which is the "Jesus section", then on to the neck which is where Paul and others attempt to sort it all out and to send it as gospel into the world consciousness (brain). Then at last the "book of revelations" which would represent the "out of the top of the head" state of final enlightenment.

That is my version of the historical biblical con-da-loonie methodology of enlightenment. (miss spelling intended for humorus reasons).

Or "comparitive religion".

So far none of any of our know methods has resulted in world peace or enlighted idealsim within the context of bahaviorism in the majority.

I think the brains of most people have recycled the energy back to the sex drive instead of using it to blow your mind and to experience that external enlightenment that the "masters" rave about, unless done so with drugs.

However it is only the student that becomes a slave of the Master and only if he wishes just to advocate the words and not go so far as to experience the "wammy".

Enlightenment is worth while only if it "sets you free" from the Master, the religion, and all other established forms of conformity. As a liberating force.

Such that you can become independant of needing to ask other people or organizatons for direction, it is about finding the wisdom to think for your self and to trust your own sense of direction. The wisdom to be able to move within the system while remaining phychologically apart form it. Enlightenment is like experiencing the rapture while everyone else is suffering and stuggling with the petty problems of their doomsday life.

Slavery is founded on a belief system but enlghtenment is founded on liberty from that bondage.

And I agree that there is a waining phase as well as a more active phase concerning enlightenment ( Geniuses ). As it is not a religious manifestation even if often advocated in religious circles. These phases happen as novelity waves of influence that sweep over the planet at interval times. We can see historically how a whole culture can suddenly create a great kingdom with all kinds of new (relative technology), art, music, and so forth, and then the great culture has a waning phase and might become a poor 3rd world country. This we can notice has happened more then once on a historical scale. And can be measured as "eras" and so-dated.

But they are happening closer and closer together (more often) of late then they did long ago. Not sure what causes those novelty waves that generate cultural advancements but they can be "tracked" and observed. As these waves move through our dimension we are bombarded with new ideas and those few who are open minded (got ozone holes in their minds) become enlightened because they are internally "searching" and scanning the heavenly skies of their mind for ideas via acute processes of awareness.

Then they invent a better mouse trap.

[Blef]

Enlightenment is the realization that there is no such thing.

[Gods_Mercenary]

Interesting, i'll have to think about that