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Technosoul · Nov 6, 2006, 10:11 pm

As our nation moves towards rating movies and other sources of entertainment I think parents should ban the Bible from their homes for the sake of the children and the next generation, as well as any from of religious teaching that might promote or justify violence and war, in any degree.

Also, parents might concider banning the Bible in their homes because it can missguide youngsters about sex and other behavior trates that are normal and healthy, creating guilts, internal conflicts, and sometimes insanity.

Of course the Bible and simular writings contain some suggestions that are of value, but overall we might question if it is doing more harm then good.
My opinion is that history would suggest "more harm then good".

What do you think?

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 10:11 pm

Get real.

Nathan Struth · Nov 6, 2006, 10:20 pm

wtf does that mean pheonix? get real about what? I think the bible's an awesome book of fiction. Jesus Christ tried to teach people to love each otehr but human nature got in the way. People just hate difference and want to be part of something. Hey I'm a 15 year old aethist everyone calls me an idiot...what am I to do? The bible shouldn't be banned we aren't ready yet, no one is. You'll be called physchotic like I was. Don't spread it techno unless you want to end up in a mental asylum because not many listen...

Zinkovich · Nov 6, 2006, 10:23 pm

Quote:

What do you think?

In my opinion, any large move to ban the Bible, whether as a cultural attitude of parenting or a enforcement by law would make the religious right movement grow in membership by bringing in the rather large moderate Christian contingent under the banner of persecution.

Popularizing such an attitude will only lead to more "In 20 years, only .000009 percent of the world will be Christian and thus the world will be swamped by atheistic, immoral rapists and murderers" type statistics and a resurgence in the whole "we are radical underdogs who will SPREAD THE FAITH. FAITH WARRIORS YEAH" scene's members.

Now on a personal level? I would ban biblical sermons and twisted forms of reasoning from my household, but not deprive any of my future children of their choice to read and consider any religious text in their purer forms. I think(and hope) by the time any of my future hypothetical children are old enough to be on a high enough reading level to read the Bible they will know enough about science, philosophy and history to read it with some healthy rational skepticism on their part, making any sort of guidance or input from me unnecessary.

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 10:52 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Nathan Struth

wtf does that mean pheonix? get real about what? I think the bible's an awesome book of fiction. Jesus Christ tried to teach people to love each otehr but human nature got in the way. People just hate difference and want to be part of something. Hey I'm a 15 year old aethist everyone calls me an idiot...what am I to do? The bible shouldn't be banned we aren't ready yet, no one is. You'll be called physchotic like I was. Don't spread it techno unless you want to end up in a mental asylum because not many listen...

I thought that was obvious. Banning the Bible is a stupid thing to do. I think that calls to ban it are meant more for exaggeration and generating outrage than for a genuine concern for anyone. That's what I mean by "get real".

Should I ever have children, I would never do them the disservice of depriving them of the Bible.

Zinkovich · Nov 6, 2006, 11:01 pm

Here's a question for you pheonix, just for some discussion here: would you allow your children to read the Bible in it's basic form before introducing them to church, sermons, and the like?

**Jack** · Nov 6, 2006, 11:07 pm

I'm not a believer in banning. No one should ever be denied the opportunity to gain knowledge through books. Some people can't read a book without falling under its influence. That's their personal problem. Just reading the bible or any other religious text won't destroy your intellect or objectivity, nor does it demand your unquestioning acceptance as true.

Inquisitive children should be allowed (not necessarily encouraged) to read the bible. It's hard even for me as an adult not to get incredibly bored about half way through Genesis.

PatrickHenry · Nov 6, 2006, 11:18 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

I'm not a believer in banning.

Banning books is a slippery slope, leading to Fahreinheit 451.

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

It's hard even for me as an adult not to get incredibly bored about half way through Genesis.

LOL! And Genesis is boiling with excitement compared to halfway through Exodus...

Zinkovich · Nov 6, 2006, 11:22 pm

Quote:

Banning books is a slippery slope, leading to Fahreinheit 451.

In other words, if books were ever banned the universe would be written by Ray Bradbury? I wouldn't mind having him as God.

Quote:

LOL! And Genesis is boiling with excitement compared to halfway through Exodus...

And Exodus is a colorful book exploding with in-your-face action compared to the horrific legality of Leviticus. I still feel boredom wash over me whenever anyone even speaks of Leviticus.

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 11:26 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Zinkovich

Here's a question for you pheonix, just for some discussion here: would you allow your children to read the Bible in it's basic form before introducing them to church, sermons, and the like?

I think it's a moot point. My kids would have been in church for some time before they had acquired the ability (and discipline) to read the Bible. Should I ever have children, I plan to raise them in a Christian community. What is your point?

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 11:27 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Zinkovich

And Exodus is a colorful book exploding with in-your-face action compared to the horrific legality of Leviticus. I still feel boredom wash over me whenever anyone even speaks of Leviticus.

begat, begat, begat, begat, begaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat!

**Jack** · Nov 6, 2006, 11:31 pm

If you want lots of grandkids, start your children in the Song of Solomon.
If you want to turn them into atheists, start them on Leviticus.

Zinkovich · Nov 6, 2006, 11:33 pm

Quote:

Quote by: phoenix_fire

I think it's a moot point. My kids would have been in church for some time before they had acquired the ability (and discipline) to read the Bible. Should I ever have children, I plan to raise them in a Christian community. What is your point?

My point is that I have yet to hear of anyone saying they were saved by the Bible, period. Those who are in a "State of grace" always point to a church service, a emotional experience, or something related to community as the source of their salvation. It's as if the attachment always comes first, and than the reading later.

Just an observation I was trying to look further into by inference through your response. No disproving or conflict intended, honestly!

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 11:34 pm

Geez. I think I would start with John. Much of the epistilic writing wouldn't make much since to them initially because a lot of it has to do with discipleship and community. At any rate, this has started me thinking about education. I really hadn't thought about presentation before.

**Jack** · Nov 6, 2006, 11:36 pm

Quote:

in a Christian community

Doesn't sound like we're gonna be neighbors any time soon...

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 11:45 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Zinkovich

My point is that I have yet to hear of anyone saying they were saved by the Bible, period. Those who are in a "State of grace" always point to a church service, a emotional experience, or something related to community as the source of their salvation. It's as if the attachment always comes first, and than the reading later.

Just an observation I was trying to look further into by inference through your response. No disproving or conflict intended, honestly!

That's probably pretty accurate. A pessimistic viewpoint would write that off as indoctrination and peer pressure. A Christian explanation, however, would say something along these lines: disciples are filled with the Holy Spirit, who becomes a part of their personality. Being around that Spirit means seeing glimpses of God. You can read the Bible cover to cover and not be any better off. Biblical Christianity considers the writing of the Bible to be through divine inspiration, or more simply, the influence of the Holy Spirit. Therefore, the better one understands Him, the more meaningful the scriptures become.

phoenix_fire · Nov 6, 2006, 11:48 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

Doesn't sound like we're gonna be neighbors any time soon...

I'm neighbors with a lot of people that I disagree with. I'm not talking a commune here. I am involved in a Christian community whose members live all around the city and in its suburbs. I see these people all the time, even if we may not live near each other.

Technosoul · Nov 7, 2006, 12:01 am

So they rate a movie P.G. so that parents can sit with the kid and explain what is happening in the movie, do you think anyone is doing that?

My daughter was once assigned by a school teacher to watch this TV movie (" Shandlers List?") that was about the concentration camps in Germany during the war. After she saw the movie I asked her what she learned from seeing it. She was impressed by a few parts (being only 11 years old). She informed me that a bunch of people were killed for being naked. Clearly she was not old enough and did not have enough background data to comprehend that TV movie.

They are now promoting the idea to monitor what kids can log onto with a computer. Speical software for that purpose is produced. It seems that they could have a webpage with the Bible texts only all the parts advocating violence and war, slavery and dominance over females, and other things (for which I could make a big list if I had the time) would be blocked out of the text provided, so that only the more positive "love and forgive" stuff is left for kids to read about. The Whale story, the one about David fighting the gaint, and so forth could be left if presented in a Disney manner. Perhaps?

I do not think that the Bible prevents rape or other morality problems in the least. Not when biblical role models are having babies with their wife's slave girl. etc.

Note I am not for banning the Bible from bookstores and whatnot, nor the banning of any book that is covered by the "freedom of speech" law.

But one problem is that many parents believe the whole Bible is the "word of God" and that it is somehow all important for kids to know. And the Koran also has some parts that seem to advocate "violence in the name of God" - and that such is okay. And the concepts that we should war upon evil forces in the world (such as doctors who advocate stem cell research) and so forth, all products of Biblical influence (and other types of religious dogma).

In my opinon I do not think that a lot of people truely see how insane the world has become due to such influences.

"Give us a break". ...... "time out" for a while. Perhaps the world can still recover from harm's way?

If parent groups ban aspects of the Bible then perhaps kids can get real about reality and leave the mythology too Star Wars.

If we are going to warn kids about the possible bad side effects of tobacco, pot, drugs, booze, and unsafe sex, then why not at least have TV ads warning people about the possible bad side effects of religion and Biblical addiction?

**Jack** · Nov 7, 2006, 12:06 am

I know what you're saying, and I'm tempted to agree...except that I firmly don't believe in restricting access if there's genuine interest.
It's an awkward situation. I love to see the bible eventually become just another mythology book, of no particular import. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening any time soon.

PatrickHenry · Nov 7, 2006, 12:16 am

Quote:

Quote by: Technosoul

My daughter was once assigned by a school teacher to watch this TV movie (" Shandlers List?") that was about the concentration camps in Germany during the war.

Snicker...Schindler's List is no TV movie. It's an Academy Award winner, Techno. Sheesh! Get a clue...

Nov 6, 2006, 10:11 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
Technosoul Volcanic Erupter Posts: 8,664	Ban The Bible As our nation moves towards rating movies and other sources of entertainment I think parents should ban the Bible from their homes for the sake of the children and the next generation, as well as any from of religious teaching that might promote or justify violence and war, in any degree. Also, parents might concider banning the Bible in their homes because it can missguide youngsters about sex and other behavior trates that are normal and healthy, creating guilts, internal conflicts, and sometimes insanity. Of course the Bible and simular writings contain some suggestions that are of value, but overall we might question if it is doing more harm then good. My opinion is that history would suggest "more harm then good". What do you think?

Nov 6, 2006, 10:11 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
phoenix_fire Paladin Location: Narnia Posts: 4,277	Get real. Place me like a seal over your heart, like a seal on your arm; for love is as strong as death, its jealousy unyielding as the grave. It burns like blazing fire, like a mighty flame. -- Song 8:6

Nov 6, 2006, 10:20 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
Nathan Struth don't care Location: NY Posts: 267	wtf does that mean pheonix? get real about what? I think the bible's an awesome book of fiction. Jesus Christ tried to teach people to love each otehr but human nature got in the way. People just hate difference and want to be part of something. Hey I'm a 15 year old aethist everyone calls me an idiot...what am I to do? The bible shouldn't be banned we aren't ready yet, no one is. You'll be called physchotic like I was. Don't spread it techno unless you want to end up in a mental asylum because not many listen... I'm just a fool caught in the rat race of life (Nathan Struth) please help me solve world hunger, It's hard to do it alone.

Nov 6, 2006, 11:07 pm	#7 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 12,869	I'm not a believer in banning. No one should ever be denied the opportunity to gain knowledge through books. Some people can't read a book without falling under its influence. That's their personal problem. Just reading the bible or any other religious text won't destroy your intellect or objectivity, nor does it demand your unquestioning acceptance as true. Inquisitive children should be allowed (not necessarily encouraged) to read the bible. It's hard even for me as an adult not to get incredibly bored about half way through Genesis. The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

Nov 6, 2006, 11:31 pm	#12 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 12,869	If you want lots of grandkids, start your children in the Song of Solomon. If you want to turn them into atheists, start them on Leviticus. The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

Nov 6, 2006, 11:01 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
Zinkovich Absolutely Superb Posts: 774	Here's a question for you pheonix, just for some discussion here: would you allow your children to read the Bible in it's basic form before introducing them to church, sermons, and the like?

Nov 6, 2006, 11:34 pm	#14 (permalink) (top)
phoenix_fire Paladin Location: Narnia Posts: 4,277	Geez. I think I would start with John. Much of the epistilic writing wouldn't make much since to them initially because a lot of it has to do with discipleship and community. At any rate, this has started me thinking about education. I really hadn't thought about presentation before. Place me like a seal over your heart, like a seal on your arm; for love is as strong as death, its jealousy unyielding as the grave. It burns like blazing fire, like a mighty flame. -- Song 8:6

Nov 7, 2006, 12:01 am	#18 (permalink) (top)
Technosoul Volcanic Erupter Posts: 8,664	So they rate a movie P.G. so that parents can sit with the kid and explain what is happening in the movie, do you think anyone is doing that? My daughter was once assigned by a school teacher to watch this TV movie (" Shandlers List?") that was about the concentration camps in Germany during the war. After she saw the movie I asked her what she learned from seeing it. She was impressed by a few parts (being only 11 years old). She informed me that a bunch of people were killed for being naked. Clearly she was not old enough and did not have enough background data to comprehend that TV movie. They are now promoting the idea to monitor what kids can log onto with a computer. Speical software for that purpose is produced. It seems that they could have a webpage with the Bible texts only all the parts advocating violence and war, slavery and dominance over females, and other things (for which I could make a big list if I had the time) would be blocked out of the text provided, so that only the more positive "love and forgive" stuff is left for kids to read about. The Whale story, the one about David fighting the gaint, and so forth could be left if presented in a Disney manner. Perhaps? I do not think that the Bible prevents rape or other morality problems in the least. Not when biblical role models are having babies with their wife's slave girl. etc. Note I am not for banning the Bible from bookstores and whatnot, nor the banning of any book that is covered by the "freedom of speech" law. But one problem is that many parents believe the whole Bible is the "word of God" and that it is somehow all important for kids to know. And the Koran also has some parts that seem to advocate "violence in the name of God" - and that such is okay. And the concepts that we should war upon evil forces in the world (such as doctors who advocate stem cell research) and so forth, all products of Biblical influence (and other types of religious dogma). In my opinon I do not think that a lot of people truely see how insane the world has become due to such influences. "Give us a break". ...... "time out" for a while. Perhaps the world can still recover from harm's way? If parent groups ban aspects of the Bible then perhaps kids can get real about reality and leave the mythology too Star Wars. If we are going to warn kids about the possible bad side effects of tobacco, pot, drugs, booze, and unsafe sex, then why not at least have TV ads warning people about the possible bad side effects of religion and Biblical addiction?

Nov 7, 2006, 12:06 am	#19 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 12,869	I know what you're saying, and I'm tempted to agree...except that I firmly don't believe in restricting access if there's genuine interest. It's an awkward situation. I love to see the bible eventually become just another mythology book, of no particular import. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening any time soon. The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)