Is Islam Really a Religion of Terror?

[Athena]

Quote by: Hostile55 I think this thread has failed somewhat. The idea was that everyone was to say "Islam=terrorism" so that abdulla could refute their claims, but most people have said the opposite. I cannot find it in myself to put this right as I myself dissagree with the argument that Islam is fundimentally violent. I think the problem here is agendas. Why does the media, on the whole, promote the idea that islam is violent? Why do some groups actively seek out and indoctrinate muslims to become suicide bombers? What is really going on? There is a struggle for control happening in the world today and all the victims of 9/11; of the Iraq war; of all the suicide bombings around the world are just insignificant pawns caught up in the middle. Humanity is corrupt. To its very core. There is no salvation. No absolution. NO GOD CAN SAVE US NOW!!!!

A voice of reason, what a nice change.

Both Christians and Muslims believe they are fighting "evil". Not all Christians are doing this with weapons, but enough of them agreed to fighting "evil" with weapons to destroy Iraq and the lives of those who no longer have the order and facilities they had before they were bombed.

As long as people think in religious terms of good and evil, and us and them, there will be senseless divisions and war. This thinking is so different from thinking with reason. Like what have the Jews done that results in Isreal being a target? When that question is correctly answered, and the cause of the attacks is removed, the attacks will stops. It is that simple. Drop the religious garbage and get down to cause and effect.

[Agur]

Quote by: Abdullah Basically what I'm saying is bring forth all of your false accusations so I can refute them all, proving that Islam does NOT promote terror or violence. So lets see your distorted Qur'an and Hadeeth qoutes and your lies against the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم .

Can a Muslim safely convert from Islam without risking repercussions (like threats or exclusion from the family)?

.

[luke virtual kh]

What happened to Abdullah?

A Taliban leader was on tv last night promising retaliation against Western civillians, the voting public. That's defined as terrorism. He's a Muslim, and represents and influences a large number of people. I don't know much about his scholarly reasoning or training, except that he views voters as culpable like combatants, and that his 'brother' Mullah Omar was a top student at the Pakistani "University of JIhad" - the areas equivalent to the Ivy league or Oxbridge. He, on channel 5, also promised 100 Western deaths for every Taliban death. Thats, by definition, Islamic terror.

Sky News: World News, Global News and International breaking News.

ps Abdullah, you may well have a different view, but I've heard that one can approach different Muslim schollars to back up ones beliefs, opinions, practices and prejudices.Generally the schollars don't deny the validity of the other's verdicts, but show mutual respect. I though can see how you might want to defend your faith and alter public perception of it, which is in itself a practical "stratagem of war" is it not?
[Koran 8:15-16, O ye who believe! when ye meet the Unbelievers in hostile array, never turn your backs to them. If any do turn his back to them on such a day - unless it be in a stratagem of war, or to retreat to a troop (of his own)- he draws on himself the wrath of Allah, and his abode is Hell,- an evil refuge (indeed)!]

[xyzer]

Abdullah..surely you jest!

This Hadeeth is about the last hour and it falls under the category of war, now it is clear from Al-Qur'aan that war is only defensive:

How does this reconcile with the fact that the Islamic Arab neighbors of Israel have repeatedly attacked (made war on)Israel since it became a nation under the partition in 1948? These attacks have been by nations, individually and collectively, plus individual groups such as Hezbollah which has attacked Israel without provocation? Are not such attacks acts of war?
That fact strains the reality of your saying that Islamic Wars are only defensive? You cant admit Islamic countries attack and start a war and then claim it isn't in their faith to do so...Sounds like a hypoctical claim to me?
I'm not letting Israel off the hook either. However, the preponderance of trouble(including wars) have been started by believers in the Q'uran who then claim they were only fighting defensive battles? Hog wash!

[Suburbanite]

Quote by: Abdullah OK, since I neither have the time nor energy to chase down all of the anti-Islamic propoganda and polemics on this forum and respond to each and every allegation, I wanna see the proof that Islam promotes terror. Basically what I'm saying is bring forth all of your false accusations so I can refute them all, proving that Islam does NOT promote terror or violence. So lets see your distorted Qur'an and Hadeeth qoutes and your lies against the Prophet

Maybe it is the case that terrorists promote islam, not that islam promotes terrorism. Though the Qur'an is violent at first glace it likens itself to something like a violent movie or video game. But Grand Theft Auto does not come with strict moral guidlines. I fear that the Qur'an does. And while I don't believe people learn violence from videogames, I can see how the Qur'an could be used that way. And it is. Islam is not a person, it is a collection of people, some of which happen to be terrorists. Buddhists don't have any.

[Abdullah]

Quote by: Nathan Struth The problem of us doesn't seem to lie in religion, moreso in the interpretation of it, the manipualtion of it. And so much hippocracy associated with it. (Jesus lovers not turning the other cheek and killing people) (Islam extremists who're paranoid that someone's out to get them), (Apathetic daoists; saying to let things go their course), (Judaism which I used to be of telling to not be caring of ourselves, yet whenever we mention the holocaust it's "6 million Jews" and not the others.). The problem clearly lies in human nature, and I don't know if it's a possible thing to get rid of. My personal nature as an aethist is still following by buddhist morals without all the "spirits" and life force (I'm scientific). But yes abdullah, as with the quote before by the person who brought up the argument. How is genocide of a group JUSTIFIABLE??? I completely disagree to your previous point. genocide is not good even in self-defense.

Who said the hadeeth in Q has to do anything with genocide? It's a prophecy people, a prophecy about the Muslims fighting the Jews.

BTW I knew this turn into politics *sighs*

[luke virtual kh]

Quote by: Abdullah Who said the hadeeth in Q has to do anything with genocide? It's a prophecy people, a prophecy about the Muslims fighting the Jews. BTW I knew this turn into politics *sighs*

Can you reply to my earlier post.

[luke virtual kh]

And this one...


Abdullah you talked on another thread of USrael. Bin Laden too criticises those countries, the "Zionist Crucader Alliance" as he calles it. Am I right in thinking you have a similar view to him, but only differ in tactics?

Would you, with him, like to see the establishment of an Islamic khalifate and a return to shar'ia law in the Gulf of Arabia?

Are Werterners plundering Islamic lands?

Are votinig civillians a legitimate target in warfare if their elected leaders apparently exploit and occupy muslim lands and holy places?

[luke virtual kh]

Quote by: Abdullah BTW I knew this turn into politics *sighs*

Can politics and faith be seperated in Islam?

btw I agree that the hadith doesn't prove Islam to be a religion of terror. Firstly it's the trees and not the leaders speaking, and secondly who says that the muslims who obeyed the trees are properly Islamic? After all , Islam is about submitting to G*^!d and not herbiage and fauna.

However I must note that if you think that trees have the power not only to speak but also capacity for religious affiliation then you're partially bonkers. I guesss you can understand my opinion here.

Should we laugh or cry? Or...

[Gabe2007]

How can you say Islam is not a religion of Terror?
They are the ONLY ones blowing themselves up to progress their agenda!!!

At a first glance, yes it does appear that they are peaceful but in many places of their book, it says to kill "infidels" and attck them and to do other horrible attacks......can someone tell me how THAT it peaceful?????

Why is it that Muslims can offend anyone one they please, but when it comes to someone verbalizing their beliefs about Islam, the Muslims get all MAD about it!!!!

Consider the pas few acts of what they have done?

They get mad over cartoons- that is understandable....but do they have to destroy innocent people's lives who had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with drawings?
It is OK to get angry but what is not OK is to kill people because you are angry!!

what the Pope said is correct......that religion has only brought war to the Middle Eastern, Asian, and African continents!!
(another piece of evidence: If the are so peaceful, why did they start riots over some comments....??? Other religions have offensive comments thrown at them , but they don't begin murdering people because of what someone else said!!!)
Tell me, what religion demands that their young men devote their lives to advance their religion thru extreme and militant methods??? None I can think of except Islam!!!
Not only that but Muslims are the only ones wanting to control the world (but in particular, the Europe) by harsh ways!!

I don't see how you can possibly think that Islam is a religion of peace....obviously there are some Muslims who do not belive in violence but do Islamic extremists care when they blow up Americans, Britons, or Israelis who do not believe in violence.....CASE IN POINT!!!

[Abdullah]

Is it even worth replying to propoganda like that without even a single reference to Qur'aan or Hadeeth? Nah didn't think so

[worldthoughts]

Bigotry IS horrible, and many people do believe in Muslim stereotypes. Not sure where this is from: Not all Muslims are terrorists, but most terrorists are Muslim. Sorry, but its true.

[Rainbow]

Quote by: Abdullah Is Islam Really a Religion of Terror?____________________________________________ [سورة الأنعام 108 | Surah Al-An'am Verse 108 (6:108)] وَلاَ تَسُبُّواْ الَّذِينَ يَدْعُونَ مِن دُونِ اللّهِ فَيَسُبُّواْ اللّهَ عَدْوًا بِغَيْرِ

#1
We - People - are so talented to abuse anything for any form of profits.
Islam is not the exception.

#2
What is the meaning of that Arabic phrase ?
Can you detail every single sign and/or word, letter, please ?

[Jack]

Tell me, what religion demands that their young men devote their lives to advance their religion thru extreme and militant methods???

Unfortunately Jim Jones and David Koresh aren't alive any longer to answer your question.

They get mad over cartoons- that is understandable.

It is? Not to me.

[1slam]

See, the thing is many people think Islam is a religion of terror when the fact of the matter is Islam itself means submitting or surrendering to Gods will, it is derived from the word salam(i-slm) meaning peace! The thing is, people make blind accusations without truly looking into the history of the verses which they CLAIM promotes terror! I bet i can bring up 50 verses of prophets in the bible ordering mass killings of women and children, but could I possibly say Christianity promotes terror? The thing is, we are a target of these stereotypes because of the many wars occurring and the tragic events which unfold! First of all, you need to know why many Muslims fight, and usually it shouldn't be considered terrorism! There was a case where a young 14 year old girl was raped and her entire family was killed by American troops the only survivor was her older brother! Now, put yourself in the shoes of that young man. Your family murdered and raped, IMAGINE what you would do. Honestly, the typical human reaction would be anger, hate and revenge! So in retrospect you cannot really call ti terrorism because, terrorism is the needless killing of innocence but can we really say all American soldiers are innocent? After all there in a war zone so they would obviously expect resistance. Im sure the American people knew that by studying history we see that NO forceful occupation would be accomplished without some form of resistance! Usually the truth lies with the resistance movements! As a young 16 year old Muslim, I dont believe we shuld be fighting at all. Honestly, we are all brothers and sisters uniting under the same human race, Allah sbwt told us that he created us in communities so we may work together!

"Do not let your hatred of a people incite you to aggression." (5:2).

"And do not let ill-will towards any folk incite you so that you swerve from dealing justly. Be just; that is nearest to heedfulness" (5:8).


Prophet Muhammad (peace be on him) sent a message to the monks of Saint Catherine in Mount Sinai:

"This is a message written by Muhammad ibn Abdullah, as a covenant to those who adopt Christianity, far and near, we are behind them. Verily, I defend them by myself, the servants, the helpers, and my followers, because Christians are my citizens; and by Allah! I hold out against anything that displeases them. No compulsion is to be on them. Neither are their judges to be changed from their jobs, nor their monks from their monasteries. No one is to destroy a house of their religion, to damage it, or to carry anything from it to the Muslims' houses. Should anyone take any of these, he would spoil God's covenant and disobey His Prophet. Verily, they (Christians) are my allies and have my secure charter against all that they hate. No one is to force them to travel or to oblige them to fight. The Muslims are to fight for them. If a female Christian is married to a Muslim, this is not to take place without her own wish. She is not to be prevented from going to her church to pray. Their churches are to be respected. They are neither to be prevented from repairing them nor the sacredness of their covenants. No one of the nation is to disobey this covenant till the Day of Judgment and the end of the world." (Reference: Muslims and Non-Muslims Face to Face by Dr Ahmad H Sakr, isbn: 0911119-31-9)

[Gabe2007]

Quote by: Isherwood Unfortunately Jim Jones and David Koresh aren't alive any longer to answer your question.

Why? were Jim and David your mentors and so you sympathize with them as you do with extremists.

It is? Not to me.

Well maybe to you it isn't understandable maybe because you are a left-wing radical and no magazine publishes carttons about left-wing radicals (because they control most of the media)...which is maybe you don't mad about any cartoon? Am i right? or not?

[ItsDarts]

1slam can you reconcile a few of these verse? I realize that I don't have the exact context infront of me and the same could be done with bible verses, but if you could bring these into context, it would be helpful.

Qur’an:8:12 “I shall terrorize the infidels. So wound their bodies and incapacitate them because they oppose Allah and His Apostle.”

Qur’an:8:57 “If you gain mastery over them in battle, inflict such a defeat as would terrorize them, so that they would learn a lesson and be warned.”

Ishaq:326 “If you come upon them, deal so forcibly as to terrify those who would follow, that they may be warned. Make a severe example of them by terrorizing Allah’s enemies.”

Qur’an:8:67 “It is not fitting for any prophet to have prisoners until he has made a great slaughtered in the land.”

Ishaq:588 “When the Apostle descends on your land none of your people will be left when he leaves.”

Tabari IX:42 “We have been dealt a situation from which there is no escape. You have seen what Muhammad has done. Arabs have submitted to him and we do not have the strength to fight. You know that no herd is safe from him. And no one even dares go outside for fear of being terrorized.”

Ishaq:326 “Allah said, ‘No Prophet before Muhammad took booty from his enemy nor prisoners for ransom.’ Muhammad said, ‘I was made victorious with terror. The earth was made a place for me to clean. I was given the most powerful words. Booty was made lawful for me. I was given the power to intercede. These five privileges were awarded to no prophet before me.’”

Ishaq:327 “Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”

Source


Is there a site for the Quran & Hadith(sp?) similar to The Biblegateway.com that I can use for reference?

[1slam]

First of all, let me post the proper verses and a brief explanation upon each.

"8.12": When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

"8.57": Therefore if you overtake them in fighting, then scatter by (making an example of) them those who are in their rear, that they may be mindful.

"8.67": It is not fit for a prophet that he should take captives unless he has fought and triumphed in the land; you desire the frail goods of this world, while Allah desires (for you) the hereafter; and Allah is Mighty, Wise.


First of all, the Hadith Ishaq:588 “When the Apostle descends on your land none of your people will be left when he leaves.” Is an absolute mistranslation of the original manuscript, you must know! Hadith references are not 100% divine unless they are classified divine and agree with the Quran 100%, many people try and twist the hadith and forge some false verses. Therefore, this hadith does not agree with the Quran so its not divine. The fact of the matter us, the quranic verses u stated are either horrible mistranslated OR you did not read the entire chapter or the divine hadith reference towards it.

"8.12": When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.


In any religion there is punishment for disobeying God, so please tell me does God command us to kill those who don’t believe? It is only the punishment of God just like the punishment in biblical references!


"8.57": Therefore if you overtake them in fighting, then scatter by (making an example of) them those who are in their rear, that they may be mindful

Explain to me how this verse tells Muslims to go about and perform duties of terrorist activities? In the Islamic religion we are to defend ourselves from direct enemies, but never EVER, EVER harm an innocent soul! This verse is talking about the battle of Bader when the Meccans tried coming into Medina to slaughter the Muslims whom were overpopulating so the God revealed a new chapter explaining what they should do. Because remember, we take examples from things that the prophet Mohammed and his disciples performed. So therefore the verse is explaining for Muslims to defend ourselves from enemies!

Ill add more right now I need to head to Class so please wait till I return J a good refrence is The Truth About Life | An invitation to the nation of islam! a nice quran u can use for refrence and always read background info on each verse

[kingmea]

There are probably the same amount of Muslim terrorists as there are Christian ones. We hear only about the Muslim ones, since we are the ones victimized by it. And just because a few stupid people kill themselves + others and happen to be Muslim, doesn't mean worship of Islam means practicing terrorism. Most people who get heart attacks eat more bread than people who don't have heart attacks, but does that mean eating bread gives you heart attacks?

Attacks on Israel isn't directly cause by the Quran, it is because countries surrounding Israel are using the Quran to press on their political views for war. It is similar to the Crusades pushed foward by Europeans who practiced Christianity.

Religion itself isn't dangerous, it's the people who misinterpret it to serve their own purposes.

[ItsDarts]

I appriceate some of the explainations and as I said, I know these verses were probably taken out of context. I didn't realize that the translations were bad as well. I'm an atheist and do not believe either of your books (christians and muslims) to be the truth, but I wanted to see how some people (christians in the case of the verses I posted) do the same thing as some atheists do when critizing the bible and its verses. People like to take a verse or two that they disagree with or find offensive and use that to refute the book(s) without regard to context. I've been guilty of it myself in the past with the bible and I don't want to start doing it with the Quran.

Quote by: 1slam First of all, let me post the proper verses and a brief explanation upon each. "8.12": When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them. "8.57": Therefore if you overtake them in fighting, then scatter by (making an example of) them those who are in their rear, that they may be mindful. "8.67": It is not fit for a prophet that he should take captives unless he has fought and triumphed in the land; you desire the frail goods of this world, while Allah desires (for you) the hereafter; and Allah is Mighty, Wise. First of all, the Hadith Ishaq:588 “When the Apostle descends on your land none of your people will be left when he leaves.” Is an absolute mistranslation of the original manuscript, you must know! Hadith references are not 100% divine unless they are classified divine and agree with the Quran 100%, many people try and twist the hadith and forge some false verses. Therefore, this hadith does not agree with the Quran so its not divine. The fact of the matter us, the quranic verses u stated are either horrible mistranslated OR you did not read the entire chapter or the divine hadith reference towards it. "8.12": When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them. In any religion there is punishment for disobeying God, so please tell me does God command us to kill those who don’t believe? It is only the punishment of God just like the punishment in biblical references! "8.57": Therefore if you overtake them in fighting, then scatter by (making an example of) them those who are in their rear, that they may be mindful Explain to me how this verse tells Muslims to go about and perform duties of terrorist activities? In the Islamic religion we are to defend ourselves from direct enemies, but never EVER, EVER harm an innocent soul! This verse is talking about the battle of Bader when the Meccans tried coming into Medina to slaughter the Muslims whom were overpopulating so the God revealed a new chapter explaining what they should do. Because remember, we take examples from things that the prophet Mohammed and his disciples performed. So therefore the verse is explaining for Muslims to defend ourselves from enemies! Ill add more right now I need to head to Class so please wait till I return J a good refrence is The Truth About Life | An invitation to the nation of islam! a nice quran u can use for refrence and always read background info on each verse