Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

Captain Chaos · Apr 4, 2007, 11:54 am

Quote:

Quote by: Z

You already identified that you have a problem with what you're doing, and now here is your "problem". You are jumping to conclusions / making assumptions / generalizing / pigeon-holing. As others have said, you need to give people a chance and not be so critical, especially when their justification for faith might be a situation nearly identical to what happened to you.

Yes.

PatrickHenry · Apr 4, 2007, 11:14 pm

You guys...

This is more of an "about me" thread than a "debate religion" thread.

And please don't insult other members beliefs in this thread. How will anybody enjoy this place if another member immediately calls their beliefs stupid?

You can ask questions and debate stuff on the religion forum just by making new topics. What's so hard about that?

Please respect one another on this thread...it's for newbies.

kaine · Apr 5, 2007, 12:31 am

spiritual atheist.

Dragon077 · Apr 15, 2007, 11:51 pm

I am a 14 year old athiest. My family, while officially Lutheran, has never been very religious. We never went to church or prayed at dinner etc. I suppose I was always skeptical of a supreme diety from the beggining. As I became more educated I finally decided to ditch my old "religion" and become an athiest. I feel good about my choice. Because I didn't have any religion being pounded into my head from the day I was born I feel my choice was unbiased. That's about it for my religion. This is my first post and I look forward to enjoying this forum further.

BERNICE · Apr 16, 2007, 12:08 am

Quote:

Quote by: [ÄK]LËGÖLÄS

I'm a non-denominational christian
I've been a christian since i was 13
I'm at a stage in my life right now..where i'm questioning alot of my beliefs
I still beleive in the bible (sorta shaky) so therefore i beleive you have to be a christian to be saved....but i also beleive God is just and fair...and takes each person as an individual case. We will all be judged individually not by what church or religion you belong to

Hey Bud! Faith! Have Faith.Trust and obey. You can only get to God through Christ. If someone has not given theyr'e life to Christ they can't make it to God. We are made perfect through Christ. We can't make it on are own, remember that, Christ died for our sins, he is perfect. When saved by Jesus Christ you are a Christian. Being a Christian is having a relationship with Christ. I urge you to read the Bible and ask God for guidance during your shaky time. I don't know you but your in my prayers tonight. God Bless!

pikatore · Apr 16, 2007, 08:06 am

Quote:

Quote by: BERNICE

Hey Bud! Faith! Have Faith.Trust and obey. You can only get to God through Christ. If someone has not given theyr'e life to Christ they can't make it to God. We are made perfect through Christ. We can't make it on are own, remember that, Christ died for our sins, he is perfect. When saved by Jesus Christ you are a Christian. Being a Christian is having a relationship with Christ. I urge you to read the Bible and ask God for guidance during your shaky time. I don't know you but your in my prayers tonight. God Bless!

Absolutely hilarious.

Legolas, don't let other people do your thinking for you. Come to your own conclusion.

BERNICE · Apr 16, 2007, 01:40 pm

Quote:

Quote by: pikatore

Absolutely hilarious.

Legolas, don't let other people do your thinking for you. Come to your own conclusion.

Anyways, hopefully this person does seek God for his/her understnding. For you, you wouldn't understand where I'm coming from if your not apart of the body of Christ. God Bless You.:)

pikatore · Apr 16, 2007, 02:05 pm

Quote:

Quote by: BERNICE

For you, you wouldn't understand where I'm coming from if your not apart of the body of Christ.

That makes complete sense, and in no way, shape, or form, am I questioning your sanity.

**Matt W** · Apr 17, 2007, 04:44 pm

*sighs* Button it. Let people talk about their beliefs without the commentary, please. :rolleyes:

DO NOT RESPOND IN THIS THREAD TO THE PRECEDING MESSAGE.
Please contact a member of the staff privately if you have any questions.

Anah Sahlberg · Apr 18, 2007, 02:45 am

Well...
When I was young my parents jumped around between the Catholic and Christian church. At the age of 9 we became members of a Christian church. I never liked it there. We eventually left becuase it was the most harmful, hypocritcal, place I've ever been to (and no, I'm not saying that all Christian churches are this way). As of age 15 we stopped attending churches and decided to come to our own conclusions about religion and such. I think this was the best decision my parents ever made.

Now I do not associate myself with any religion, but do have certain beliefs. In other words, I like to consider myself 'spiritual' not 'religious'.

Wraith · Apr 20, 2007, 12:08 am

I do not believe in any religion and have no problem with any popular religion.

Manzooka · Apr 24, 2007, 01:39 am

I'm agnostic myself. I'll explain why if anyone cares to read it.

If you look at the whole of human history, rarely has mankind left difficult questions unanswered for long. That's not to say that we manage to satisfactorily answer those questions. On the contrary, we often make up our own answers when the real answers are still beyond our reach. Religious examples of this phenomenon include everything from our primitive explanations of the Sun, to the cause of disease, the origin of lightning and thunder, the tides, the elements, earthquakes, etc. How many events, both large and small, have been mistakenly attributed to the direct influence of supernatural beings in human history? More than you or I could ever count I’m sure, regardless of where we stand on the religious spectrum.

Answering our own questions is only part of the problem. We also have a tendency to ask the wrong questions. For example, for centuries we asked ourselves what happens to water at the end of the Earth rather than questioning whether or not the Earth was actually flat to begin with. There's nothing wrong with asking the wrong questions. After all, they often lead to the right ones. The problem comes with the assumption that we're asking the right questions to begin with. For example, think of a man who can’t grasp the concept of eternity or infinity. He might keep asking "How did it all begin?" Perhaps there was no beginning as we understand it and the better question is "What is that nature of all that is?"

A third problem (among many others I’m sure) is that each of these questions and answers is framed by our individual perspectives and world views. Hey, we can’t help it! We’re only human after all, but dang, what a major limitation.

And so from my own limited perspective I see these three issues rising to the surface over and over again. Despite a few millennia of examples we continue to answer our own questions, assume we’re asking the right questions, and more often than not we don’t even bother to look beyond our own field of vision for answers.

Are we learning from thousands of years of mistakes? Many of us still attribute the unknown to a god, or gods, or something supernatural or spiritual. Others are convinced science holds an explanation for everything and happily piggy back onto the latest theories of which they have little to no understanding.

From my perspective it takes faith to be either a theist or a non-agnostic atheist. Believing that there is or is not a god in the lack of any suitable evidence is okay, but it's still a leap of faith. Being agnostic just means I'm willing to admit that "I don't know, and I probably never will.” I don't grasp for conclusions (scientific or otherwise) and I don't assume I'm asking the right questions.

I must admit though, I have faith too. Not in god or science but in my fellow man. We're not there yet but I think we're fast approaching the day where we'll be able to pursue the big questions without answering them first, and I think we'll all be better for it.

ZNFYRH · Apr 24, 2007, 01:41 am

Manzooka,

I understand your post and what you are saying about any form of theism or a-theism requiring faith. Others here will fight you on it, but I agree.

Manzooka · Apr 24, 2007, 02:25 am

Quote:

Quote by: ZNFYRH

Manzooka,

I understand your post and what you are saying about any form of theism or a-theism requiring faith. Others here will fight you on it, but I agree.

Thanks, and I look forward to the oposing discussions

Chandler Frank · Apr 25, 2007, 09:39 pm

Well I'm a Christian. A Pentecostal Christian at that. I have researched other ways, thoughts, beliefs, but it all comes back to Christianity.
And the opinion that many people have that Christians in their beliefs are either just the 'stupid masses' or brainwashed doesn't apply here either.
The thing is though, I am a scientific mind, I'm always looking for an answer and will often research and even argue for the 'other side' just to understand their viewpoint a little better. To have a solid argument you need to know in deatil both sides of the story, not just your own. And that's the way I see it.

Century 25 · Apr 26, 2007, 01:14 am

Children are not given time to complete their education before being exposed to ideas that have no credible proof.. and they are easy prey for whatever knowledge (or fairy tale) that is told them.. especially since they trust their parents for truth.. so.. how can the endless cycle of so-called "faith based" beliefs.. ever end..? It would seem.. never.

So.. the world is saddled with never-ending wars.. and religion is merely a tool for easy compliance of the.. manipulator(s).. America burned.. "witches" - not all that long ago.. and now we have.. a "president" that tells the flock.. "god is with us"..

Sisyphus had it much easier.. methinks..

**Jack** · Apr 26, 2007, 01:20 am

Quote:

Children are not given time to complete their education before being exposed to ideas that have no credible proof.. and they are easy prey for whatever knowledge (or fairy tale) that is told them.. especially since they trust their parents for truth.. so.. how can the endless cycle of so-called "faith based" beliefs.. ever end..? It would seem.. never.

This is the case for more than just religious training. I can't cite a statistic, but I'd be willing to bet it's a large percentage of people who form the vast majority of their phobias, prejudices, turn-ons, turn-offs and superstitions while still children, based on the perceived attitudes of their parents.

againstthewind · May 2, 2007, 01:11 pm

Biblical Christian

Simply, if it's not in the Bible, I don't believe it as far as doctrine goes. I am against:

Evolution
Abortion
Homosexual marriage
Public schools teaching this
False religion
Islamic violence

pikatore · May 2, 2007, 01:39 pm

Quote:

Quote by: againstthewind

Biblical Christian

Simply, if it's not in the Bible, I don't believe it as far as doctrine goes. I am against:

Evolution
Abortion
Homosexual marriage
Public schools teaching this
False religion
Islamic violence

heh. excellent. ill argue with you on any of those issues. just pick one.

againstthewind · May 2, 2007, 02:15 pm

You'll debate me on which one?

Apr 4, 2007, 11:14 pm	#1422 (permalink) (top)
PatrickHenry 9/11: Inside Job Location: Hawai'i, Big Island Posts: 10,455	You guys... This is more of an "about me" thread than a "debate religion" thread. And please don't insult other members beliefs in this thread. How will anybody enjoy this place if another member immediately calls their beliefs stupid? You can ask questions and debate stuff on the religion forum just by making new topics. What's so hard about that? Please respect one another on this thread...it's for newbies. "Arms in the hands of the citizens may be used at individual discretion for the defense of the country, the overthrow of tyranny or private self-defense." -- John Adams

Apr 18, 2007, 02:45 am	#1430 (permalink) (top)
Anah Sahlberg Diabolical Angel Location: US of A Posts: 10	Well... When I was young my parents jumped around between the Catholic and Christian church. At the age of 9 we became members of a Christian church. I never liked it there. We eventually left becuase it was the most harmful, hypocritcal, place I've ever been to (and no, I'm not saying that all Christian churches are this way). As of age 15 we stopped attending churches and decided to come to our own conclusions about religion and such. I think this was the best decision my parents ever made. Now I do not associate myself with any religion, but do have certain beliefs. In other words, I like to consider myself 'spiritual' not 'religious'. "Do what you feel in your heart to be right - for you'll be criticized anyway. You'll be damned if you do, and damned if you don't." -Eleanor Roosevelt

May 2, 2007, 02:15 pm	#1440 (permalink) (top)
againstthewind Molten Ash Posts: 132	Debate You'll debate me on which one?

Apr 5, 2007, 12:31 am	#1423 (permalink) (top)
kaine Sedimentary Rock Posts: 4	spiritual atheist.

Apr 15, 2007, 11:51 pm	#1424 (permalink) (top)
Dragon077 Sedimentary Rock Posts: 4	I am a 14 year old athiest. My family, while officially Lutheran, has never been very religious. We never went to church or prayed at dinner etc. I suppose I was always skeptical of a supreme diety from the beggining. As I became more educated I finally decided to ditch my old "religion" and become an athiest. I feel good about my choice. Because I didn't have any religion being pounded into my head from the day I was born I feel my choice was unbiased. That's about it for my religion. This is my first post and I look forward to enjoying this forum further.

Apr 20, 2007, 12:08 am	#1431 (permalink) (top)
Wraith Sedimentary Rock Posts: 15	I do not believe in any religion and have no problem with any popular religion.

Apr 24, 2007, 01:39 am	#1432 (permalink) (top)
Manzooka Sedimentary Rock Posts: 11	I'm agnostic myself. I'll explain why if anyone cares to read it. If you look at the whole of human history, rarely has mankind left difficult questions unanswered for long. That's not to say that we manage to satisfactorily answer those questions. On the contrary, we often make up our own answers when the real answers are still beyond our reach. Religious examples of this phenomenon include everything from our primitive explanations of the Sun, to the cause of disease, the origin of lightning and thunder, the tides, the elements, earthquakes, etc. How many events, both large and small, have been mistakenly attributed to the direct influence of supernatural beings in human history? More than you or I could ever count I’m sure, regardless of where we stand on the religious spectrum. Answering our own questions is only part of the problem. We also have a tendency to ask the wrong questions. For example, for centuries we asked ourselves what happens to water at the end of the Earth rather than questioning whether or not the Earth was actually flat to begin with. There's nothing wrong with asking the wrong questions. After all, they often lead to the right ones. The problem comes with the assumption that we're asking the right questions to begin with. For example, think of a man who can’t grasp the concept of eternity or infinity. He might keep asking "How did it all begin?" Perhaps there was no beginning as we understand it and the better question is "What is that nature of all that is?" A third problem (among many others I’m sure) is that each of these questions and answers is framed by our individual perspectives and world views. Hey, we can’t help it! We’re only human after all, but dang, what a major limitation. And so from my own limited perspective I see these three issues rising to the surface over and over again. Despite a few millennia of examples we continue to answer our own questions, assume we’re asking the right questions, and more often than not we don’t even bother to look beyond our own field of vision for answers. Are we learning from thousands of years of mistakes? Many of us still attribute the unknown to a god, or gods, or something supernatural or spiritual. Others are convinced science holds an explanation for everything and happily piggy back onto the latest theories of which they have little to no understanding. From my perspective it takes faith to be either a theist or a non-agnostic atheist. Believing that there is or is not a god in the lack of any suitable evidence is okay, but it's still a leap of faith. Being agnostic just means I'm willing to admit that "I don't know, and I probably never will.” I don't grasp for conclusions (scientific or otherwise) and I don't assume I'm asking the right questions. I must admit though, I have faith too. Not in god or science but in my fellow man. We're not there yet but I think we're fast approaching the day where we'll be able to pursue the big questions without answering them first, and I think we'll all be better for it.

Apr 24, 2007, 01:41 am	#1433 (permalink) (top)
ZNFYRH Volcanic Erupter Posts: 4,375	Manzooka, I understand your post and what you are saying about any form of theism or a-theism requiring faith. Others here will fight you on it, but I agree.

Apr 25, 2007, 09:39 pm	#1435 (permalink) (top)
Chandler Frank Change Agent Posts: 60	Well I'm a Christian. A Pentecostal Christian at that. I have researched other ways, thoughts, beliefs, but it all comes back to Christianity. And the opinion that many people have that Christians in their beliefs are either just the 'stupid masses' or brainwashed doesn't apply here either. The thing is though, I am a scientific mind, I'm always looking for an answer and will often research and even argue for the 'other side' just to understand their viewpoint a little better. To have a solid argument you need to know in deatil both sides of the story, not just your own. And that's the way I see it.

Apr 26, 2007, 01:14 am	#1436 (permalink) (top)
Century 25 Igneous Magma Location: Southwest desert - Valley of the Sun Posts: 651	Children are not given time to complete their education before being exposed to ideas that have no credible proof.. and they are easy prey for whatever knowledge (or fairy tale) that is told them.. especially since they trust their parents for truth.. so.. how can the endless cycle of so-called "faith based" beliefs.. ever end..? It would seem.. never. So.. the world is saddled with never-ending wars.. and religion is merely a tool for easy compliance of the.. manipulator(s).. America burned.. "witches" - not all that long ago.. and now we have.. a "president" that tells the flock.. "god is with us".. Sisyphus had it much easier.. methinks..

May 2, 2007, 01:11 pm	#1438 (permalink) (top)
againstthewind Molten Ash Posts: 132	Biblical Christian Simply, if it's not in the Bible, I don't believe it as far as doctrine goes. I am against: Evolution Abortion Homosexual marriage Public schools teaching this False religion Islamic violence