Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

Starboy · Dec 30, 2004, 12:49 pm

Quote:

Quote by: SlySpy

Well, Taipanus, I don't feel I "worship" anything at all, yet I'm completely clean and sober, I've never done drugs or got drunk in my life and I'm never depressed. Would you consider me an anomaly?

Hey me too! In fact whenever I have been involved with 'worshippers' that is when my life went to shit. I guess I am an anomaly as well.

Starboy

Dadoo · Dec 30, 2004, 12:51 pm

In any guise, with any name and at any time or place, the Absolute is just that. There is only one amalgamative totality available, and that is the sum of all that is known and as yet, unknown. Many sages and seekers have stated this succinctly throughout history.
Religion is a path, spirituality, the incentive and The Absolute is the goal. Regardless of how others in any social or religious group view their beliefs or act upon them, it is up to the individuals, namely yourselves, to find the truth within every religion and have reverence for the implied goal of unification found within the scripture and dogma of most secular religions.
When you seek selflessly and discover the core of your own religion, know that this is the very same core all religions harken toward, however muddled or convoluted the current outward manifestation may seem.
Have faith in totality and chalk up those glazed, harried religious wannabes to human error and a simple failure within a well-intentioned system to clearly teach the non-secular nature of dogmatic religion and their ultimate aspiration: singular, identical, logically equivalent.
Be good,
Dadoo

Starboy · Dec 30, 2004, 12:58 pm

Shouldn't it be many concepts many names? It would be one thing if the people holding all of these many concepts could agree on some single concept but other than they all claim to be "true" and all the rest are wrong there is not much that is common among them. Such arguments that claim they are all the same look to me to be lame attempts to create harmony where there is none or at minimum it is a lame attempt to paper over the issues in the hope that somehow it will just all go away.

Starboy

Actually now that I think on it, it is really many concepts, same name. They all say things like god, heaven and sin and such but when they use those terms they often mean very different things.

tman_ndsu08 · Dec 30, 2004, 02:35 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Starboy

Hey me too! In fact whenever I have been involved with 'worshippers' that is when my life went to shit. I guess I am an anomaly as well.

Starboy

Same here.

Perhaps we're just a rare type of personality that likes to take care of ourselves.

...Kate · Dec 30, 2004, 02:43 pm

Sting said, "people go crazy in congregations."

Is he a prophet?

I'm a protestant, searcher, reading lots of everything. I tend to shy away from stuff that doesn't have some sort of "mainline" following ... so I'm looking at Buddhism, and Buddhist aspects to Christianity. My family recently joined a protestant church, for our son, who wanted to join. And it's the church I grew up in ... . I love the liturgy and the routine and the poeple are just fine with me. too. We have been unchurched for 20 some years, but there's something solid about organized religion that I like, that's okay with me. Still, my desire to discuss the gnostic gospels and the idea that all religions are essentially a reflection of culture, is a bit squelched in Sunday school.

So, I'm mostly a searcher, and a bit of a conformist, for social engineering reasons that I anticipate will help my kid find his way through the world.

-Kate

legallyblonde16 · Jan 3, 2005, 11:55 am

If you didn't feel a need for God then why would you say stuff like "o my God!" during times of stress or joy. IF you didn't recognize God then you wouldn't feel the need to ever use his name no matter the problems. It is a basic nature within ourselves to seek out God. Just because you fight doesn't mean its not there.

kellbing · Jan 3, 2005, 01:11 pm

So many people ask this question. It is merely a figure of speech or a common expletive we are using if we use "god's" name. We all use them. If you say something like "he could eat peas until they come out of his ears", you don't actually believe peas would literally come out of his ears, do you? Atheists may say something like "Oh my god", but that doesn't mean we believe in him or that he must exist because we use the phrase.

...Kate · Jan 3, 2005, 01:56 pm

The word has passed into the vernacular, and it's been around for a few centuries.

Ooops, [edit] ... The word has been around for a few centuries, and, thus, has passed into the vernacular.

"G-d saw what she had made and said that it was good." :eek:

tman_ndsu08 · Jan 3, 2005, 02:18 pm

Quote:

Quote by: legallyblonde16

If you didn't feel a need for God then why would you say stuff like "o my God!" during times of stress or joy. IF you didn't recognize God then you wouldn't feel the need to ever use his name no matter the problems. It is a basic nature within ourselves to seek out God. Just because you fight doesn't mean its not there.

I say "fucking bullshit!".

...Kate · Jan 3, 2005, 02:24 pm

su08, that's the spirit. I'm getting this warm fuzzy feeling, getting a picture of your heart now. :)

I think legally blonde has a point, but I would urge that it's the fight itself that brings something into existence.

If a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to argue it hasn't fallen, has it really fallen (or not fallen) at all?

Things that make me go hmmmmm.

g-d bless me.

Starboy · Jan 3, 2005, 02:37 pm

There are lots of gods that we pay homage to in our every day language. The days of the week for instance.

Sunday - The Sun god's day,
Monday - The Moon god's day,
Tuesday - Twia's day - The God of War.
Wednesday - Woden's Day,
Thursday - Thor's Day,
Friday - (Freya's Day - AKA nookie day, or the god of love),
Saturday – The god Saturn's Day,

So every time you tell someone the day of the week you are paying homage to an ancient god and breaking the law of the Christian god. So all you good Christians just watch your language or you could all just play it safe and shut up. You never know where those "words" came from and what they "truly" mean.

Starboy

...Kate · Jan 3, 2005, 02:39 pm

hey Starboy, g-d love you :)

legallyblonde16 · Jan 3, 2005, 02:51 pm

Quote:

Quote by: ...Kate

g-d bless me.

so when you use that little g in god are you saying baal bless me or ra bless me? But if you weren't disrespecting a holy diety when you said "O my God" then why would parents get so mad for using the Lord's name in vain? Or when saying God bless you why would people get so mad for having it said in a school or government building because of seperation of church and state?
And faith in God is based upon faith yes but when we can look out and see a perfectly woking planet, so wonderfully put together how more faith does it take for you to believe that just chanced into existence and that there is not some greater being out there thatn to believe that it was put together by a omnipotent being which would be God?
Then you need to watch yours as well since most cities and words come from a christian context,starboy

...Kate · Jan 3, 2005, 02:55 pm

It's from Conversations with G-d, which is a very spiritual book. Have you read it?

Hi, and nice to meet you, legally blonde.

Starboy · Jan 3, 2005, 03:27 pm

Quote:

Quote by: legallyblonde16

And faith in God is based upon faith yes but when we can look out and see a perfectly woking planet, so wonderfully put together how more faith does it take for you to believe that just chanced into existence and that there is not some greater being out there thatn to believe that it was put together by a omnipotent being which would be God?

blonde, we've already been over this. This is the puddle argument and is only convincing to people with the IQ of a puddle.

Quote:

Then you need to watch yours as well since most cities and words come from a christian context,starboy

It doesn't bother me a bit. I don't respect superstition. Saying god dammit is no more significant to me than saying fuckit. I will tell you one thing. I would not be such a hard ass about it if those that thought that their particular superstitions were important to them would just keep it to them selves and not force it on the government, to suppress others and to apply their sensibilities on everyone else by way of censorship or interfering with our laws, education or public symbols. If they could just keep it to themselves and enjoy the liberty to live as they wished and respected that liberty for others to do the same then I would be fine with that. But the Christians of late have become such terrible assholes. It amazes me that anyone would want to be a Christian.

Starboy

legallyblonde16 · Jan 3, 2005, 03:58 pm

You call us names saying we are forcing our religion on you but yet you're the one being so negative and malecious. If you go by your own logic of not forcing beliefs on others then you wouldn't be stating your beliefs here.

Starboy · Jan 3, 2005, 04:16 pm

Blonde, are you oblivious to what is going on in politics in this country today? You support by way of your religion some of the most un-American activities I have seen in some time.

Also what beliefs am I forcing on you? All I am doing is pointing out how stupid your own beliefs are. That is not a belief. Now if you want to sail along on "faith" then have at it, but there is no argument for faith. You either do it, or you don't. It has no justification. Those that would argue to others that it does and to try to convince them to adopt their "faith" are morons. Your best argument is and will always be deeds. Try to see if your "faith" makes you a much better person than a person can be without "faith". I would like to see that. But when it fails for you, then be honest with yourself and realize that faith is only a feeling and that feelings can motivate us to try but they do not automatically allow us to succeed just because we try. To succeed requires a great deal more than "faith". And if you had what it takes you would know better than to post these inane arguments.

Starboy

foldvary · Jan 3, 2005, 06:54 pm

I am a minister of the Church of Nature.
The creed of the CoN is natural law.
The CoN is non-exlusive. You can be in the Church of Nature and another religion so long as it is compatible.

tman_ndsu08 · Jan 3, 2005, 06:56 pm

Quote:

Quote by: legallyblonde16

You call us names saying we are forcing our religion on you but yet you're the one being so negative and malecious. If you go by your own logic of not forcing beliefs on others then you wouldn't be stating your beliefs here.

How can you call a lack of belief "your beliefs"?

Starboy · Jan 3, 2005, 08:32 pm

Quote:

Quote by: foldvary

I am a minister of the Church of Nature.
The creed of the CoN is natural law.
The CoN is non-exlusive. You can be in the Church of Nature and another religion so long as it is compatible.

Actually you can be in the CoN even if your religion is not compatible. That is because a religion only thinks it is a bad ass and can tell nature what to do. Nature could give a shit. You are in the CoN whether you like it or not.

Starboy

Dec 30, 2004, 12:51 pm	#522 (permalink) (top)
Dadoo Pure Energy Posts: 384	One Concept, Many Names In any guise, with any name and at any time or place, the Absolute is just that. There is only one amalgamative totality available, and that is the sum of all that is known and as yet, unknown. Many sages and seekers have stated this succinctly throughout history. Religion is a path, spirituality, the incentive and The Absolute is the goal. Regardless of how others in any social or religious group view their beliefs or act upon them, it is up to the individuals, namely yourselves, to find the truth within every religion and have reverence for the implied goal of unification found within the scripture and dogma of most secular religions. When you seek selflessly and discover the core of your own religion, know that this is the very same core all religions harken toward, however muddled or convoluted the current outward manifestation may seem. Have faith in totality and chalk up those glazed, harried religious wannabes to human error and a simple failure within a well-intentioned system to clearly teach the non-secular nature of dogmatic religion and their ultimate aspiration: singular, identical, logically equivalent. Be good, Dadoo

Dec 30, 2004, 12:58 pm	#523 (permalink) (top)
Starboy BANNED: Repeated insults Posts: 4,828	Shouldn't it be many concepts many names? It would be one thing if the people holding all of these many concepts could agree on some single concept but other than they all claim to be "true" and all the rest are wrong there is not much that is common among them. Such arguments that claim they are all the same look to me to be lame attempts to create harmony where there is none or at minimum it is a lame attempt to paper over the issues in the hope that somehow it will just all go away. Starboy Actually now that I think on it, it is really many concepts, same name. They all say things like god, heaven and sin and such but when they use those terms they often mean very different things. Last edited by Starboy; Dec 30, 2004 at 02:48 pm.

Dec 30, 2004, 02:43 pm	#525 (permalink) (top)
...Kate Igneous Magma Location: United States, CST Posts: 393	Sting said, "people go crazy in congregations." Is he a prophet? I'm a protestant, searcher, reading lots of everything. I tend to shy away from stuff that doesn't have some sort of "mainline" following ... so I'm looking at Buddhism, and Buddhist aspects to Christianity. My family recently joined a protestant church, for our son, who wanted to join. And it's the church I grew up in ... . I love the liturgy and the routine and the poeple are just fine with me. too. We have been unchurched for 20 some years, but there's something solid about organized religion that I like, that's okay with me. Still, my desire to discuss the gnostic gospels and the idea that all religions are essentially a reflection of culture, is a bit squelched in Sunday school. So, I'm mostly a searcher, and a bit of a conformist, for social engineering reasons that I anticipate will help my kid find his way through the world. -Kate Last edited by ...Kate; Dec 30, 2004 at 02:45 pm. Reason: typo (profit ... prophet)

Jan 3, 2005, 11:55 am	#526 (permalink) (top)
legallyblonde16 Sedimentary Rock Posts: 20	If you didn't feel a need for God then why would you say stuff like "o my God!" during times of stress or joy. IF you didn't recognize God then you wouldn't feel the need to ever use his name no matter the problems. It is a basic nature within ourselves to seek out God. Just because you fight doesn't mean its not there. Know ye that the Lord he is God: it is he that hath made us,and not we ourselves... Psalms100:3

Jan 3, 2005, 01:11 pm	#527 (permalink) (top)
kellbing Molten Ash Posts: 69	So many people ask this question. It is merely a figure of speech or a common expletive we are using if we use "god's" name. We all use them. If you say something like "he could eat peas until they come out of his ears", you don't actually believe peas would literally come out of his ears, do you? Atheists may say something like "Oh my god", but that doesn't mean we believe in him or that he must exist because we use the phrase. I don't need illusions. I live in the real world.

Jan 3, 2005, 01:56 pm	#528 (permalink) (top)
...Kate Igneous Magma Location: United States, CST Posts: 393	The word has passed into the vernacular, and it's been around for a few centuries. Ooops, [edit] ... The word has been around for a few centuries, and, thus, has passed into the vernacular. "G-d saw what she had made and said that it was good." :eek:

Jan 3, 2005, 02:24 pm	#530 (permalink) (top)
...Kate Igneous Magma Location: United States, CST Posts: 393	su08, that's the spirit. I'm getting this warm fuzzy feeling, getting a picture of your heart now. :) I think legally blonde has a point, but I would urge that it's the fight itself that brings something into existence. If a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to argue it hasn't fallen, has it really fallen (or not fallen) at all? Things that make me go hmmmmm. g-d bless me.

Jan 3, 2005, 02:37 pm	#531 (permalink) (top)
Starboy BANNED: Repeated insults Posts: 4,828	There are lots of gods that we pay homage to in our every day language. The days of the week for instance. Sunday - The Sun god's day, Monday - The Moon god's day, Tuesday - Twia's day - The God of War. Wednesday - Woden's Day, Thursday - Thor's Day, Friday - (Freya's Day - AKA nookie day, or the god of love), Saturday – The god Saturn's Day, So every time you tell someone the day of the week you are paying homage to an ancient god and breaking the law of the Christian god. So all you good Christians just watch your language or you could all just play it safe and shut up. You never know where those "words" came from and what they "truly" mean. Starboy

Jan 3, 2005, 02:39 pm	#532 (permalink) (top)
...Kate Igneous Magma Location: United States, CST Posts: 393	hey Starboy, g-d love you :)

Jan 3, 2005, 02:55 pm	#534 (permalink) (top)
...Kate Igneous Magma Location: United States, CST Posts: 393	It's from Conversations with G-d, which is a very spiritual book. Have you read it? Hi, and nice to meet you, legally blonde.

Jan 3, 2005, 03:58 pm	#536 (permalink) (top)
legallyblonde16 Sedimentary Rock Posts: 20	You call us names saying we are forcing our religion on you but yet you're the one being so negative and malecious. If you go by your own logic of not forcing beliefs on others then you wouldn't be stating your beliefs here. Know ye that the Lord he is God: it is he that hath made us,and not we ourselves... Psalms100:3

Jan 3, 2005, 04:16 pm	#537 (permalink) (top)
Starboy BANNED: Repeated insults Posts: 4,828	Blonde, are you oblivious to what is going on in politics in this country today? You support by way of your religion some of the most un-American activities I have seen in some time. Also what beliefs am I forcing on you? All I am doing is pointing out how stupid your own beliefs are. That is not a belief. Now if you want to sail along on "faith" then have at it, but there is no argument for faith. You either do it, or you don't. It has no justification. Those that would argue to others that it does and to try to convince them to adopt their "faith" are morons. Your best argument is and will always be deeds. Try to see if your "faith" makes you a much better person than a person can be without "faith". I would like to see that. But when it fails for you, then be honest with yourself and realize that faith is only a feeling and that feelings can motivate us to try but they do not automatically allow us to succeed just because we try. To succeed requires a great deal more than "faith". And if you had what it takes you would know better than to post these inane arguments. Starboy

Jan 3, 2005, 06:54 pm	#538 (permalink) (top)
foldvary Sedimentary Rock Location: California Posts: 3	I am a minister of the Church of Nature. The creed of the CoN is natural law. The CoN is non-exlusive. You can be in the Church of Nature and another religion so long as it is compatible.