Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

Nicole · Aug 31, 2003, 01:07 pm

I got into a United Pentecostal church when I was 8 years old and suffered therein for 8 more years. I quit when I was 16 and no longer have a religion. I'm a very moral person with strict beliefs on how one should live their life, but I have yet to find a church that reflects my beliefs.

In the UPC organization, I believe they've lost the true meaning behind Christianity. They are totally caught up in appearance and acquiring power. They've forgotten that what is on the inside is most important. In fact, I was ridiculed and picked on to an unbearable degree while in that religion. When I was just a little girl, adults and kids alike would gang up on me and bring me to tears with absolutely no remorse. I was taught that I could not associate with 'sinners' and had no friends in school either. I think I was better for the experience and it taught me that I should never say hurtful things to another person because of the damage it could cause. But at the same time, I feel like I'm better off without 'religion.' I can be a good person without an organization to fall back on.

I do believe in God and believe that there are guidelines one must follow, found in the Bible. I hope to someday find a church to attend.

Um Yeah · Aug 31, 2003, 06:37 pm

I was born Roman Catholic, Im not actually sure what I am now but I consider myself a Christian. Im a fan of Jesus.

G. Adams · Aug 31, 2003, 08:16 pm

Began Catholic, went atheist, lost my faith in atheism, now i'd like to say I'm a buddhist but my social consciounce won't let me sit back and achieve nirvana while millions die of starvation just to keep a minority rich.

Fallen Angel · Sep 1, 2003, 12:01 am

Quote:

Originally posted by Nicole@Aug 31 2003, 01:07 PM
I got into a United Pentecostal church when I was 8 years old and suffered therein for 8 more years. I quit when I was 16 and no longer have a religion. I'm a very moral person with strict beliefs on how one should live their life, but I have yet to find a church that reflects my beliefs.

In the UPC organization, I believe they've lost the true meaning behind Christianity. They are totally caught up in appearance and acquiring power. They've forgotten that what is on the inside is most important. In fact, I was ridiculed and picked on to an unbearable degree while in that religion. When I was just a little girl, adults and kids alike would gang up on me and bring me to tears with absolutely no remorse. I was taught that I could not associate with 'sinners' and had no friends in school either. I think I was better for the experience and it taught me that I should never say hurtful things to another person because of the damage it could cause. But at the same time, I feel like I'm better off without 'religion.' I can be a good person without an organization to fall back on.

I do believe in God and believe that there are guidelines one must follow, found in the Bible. I hope to someday find a church to attend.

Any religous organisation that has to bully and intimidate its members about anything is fundementally wrong to start with, either you simply believe in what that organisation offers with no pressure on you or you walk away with no questions asked from either party.
If you are however disrupting or mocking their belief they have every right to remove you from themselves if you will not listen to their reasoning first, which has to be simply that, reasoning, not bullying.

GreatWyrm of Babylon · Sep 1, 2003, 12:31 am

Fallen Angel
Two things:
First, I believe this topic was to list beliefs and conclusions not to debate them.
Second, by what logic are you questioning a poster in a non-debate topic to claim you are not a bully?

Fallen Angel · Sep 1, 2003, 12:43 am

Quote:

Originally posted by GreatWyrm of Babylon@Sep 1 2003, 12:31 AM
Fallen Angel
Two things:
First, I believe this topic was to list beliefs and conclusions not to debate them.
Second, by what logic are you questioning a poster in a non-debate topic to claim you are not a bully?

Um first I don't think you have any right to say something is not allowed to be debated, unless your worried your own view can't stand up to examination.
Second I don't see how I was bullying anyone.

Nicole · Sep 1, 2003, 12:55 am

I followed the religion to a T when I was younger- I never mocked or started any dispute. Their actions were to bring me down to their level and to try and cause me to be so unsure of myself that I would need their approval for all of my actions. Luckily my parents weren't into that religion, and I was able to leave when I did. I suffered from panic attacks and fears of social situations for some time thereafter.

I don't mind the question, for the record. It was legitimate.

Fallen Angel · Sep 1, 2003, 01:00 am

Quote:

Originally posted by Nicole@Sep 1 2003, 12:55 AM
I followed the religion to a T when I was younger- I never mocked or started any dispute. Their actions were to bring me down to their level and to try and cause me to be so unsure of myself that I would need their approval for all of my actions. Luckily my parents weren't into that religion, and I was able to leave when I did. I suffered from panic attacks and fears of social situations for some time thereafter.

I don't mind the question, for the record. It was legitimate.

I never meant to imply you were mocking it Nicole, I went through the same crap when I was growing up.
I thought for years if no one prayed before every meal, they would go to hell, anyone that did'nt believe in Jesus was evil.
It took me about ten years to shake it off.
Jesus said follow me and you will have eternal life, he didnt say you had no choice.

Nicole · Sep 1, 2003, 01:03 am

My mistake :)

Fallen Angel · Sep 1, 2003, 01:05 am

Not at all.

GreatWyrm of Babylon · Sep 1, 2003, 01:42 am

Fallen Angel

Quote:

Um first I don't think you have any right to say something is not allowed to be debated, unless your worried your own view can't stand up to examination.
Second I don't see how I was bullying anyone.

Er, it was not me that I was defending. How can that have anything to do with "my view". I we happily defend myself on any subject you name, just start a topic. :)

This topic implied it just wanted religions and reasonings listed. You implied you were a bully when you chose to take offense at someones solicited opinion. You asked their opinion, they were not attacking you personally. Therefore it implies this was whole topic was simply an excuse to attack those that disagreed with you rather than the curiousity topic it implied it was.

Fallen Angel · Sep 1, 2003, 04:21 am

Whats wrong with taking offence to someone or something, if your saying I have no right to then you don't believe in free speech,
I didnt say you can't say that, I just said I found it offensive to me, is'nt that how you work things out?

greendeath · Sep 1, 2003, 05:59 am

To GreatWyrm (and i quote):

Quote:

Welcome to Volconvo! The overall mission of
Volconvo is simple; provide and maintain an
unrestricted environment where people with
different backgrounds can debate

You show great incompetance.

GreatWyrm of Babylon · Sep 1, 2003, 03:53 pm

deadgreenthing
Well, I see we have at least one individual that has already surrendered. He has not only failed to present any arguement to his case, he has started with a personal attack. Sorry, dustmote, being a troll carries no weight with me.

But then I suspect being the first of your kind to attack me is status in the circles that you live in. So congrats on being the first to resort to flame before logic.

I would point out to you that this topic was not introduced as a debate, but you failed to catch it the first time, so I will not bother to further assualt your IQ by asking it to read what is beyond it again...

zkreso · Sep 1, 2003, 04:17 pm

*sigh* back to the topic...

I was not raised with any religion so I don't really know what to believe.
I think that religion is a biological feature of the human brain. If all religions disappeared right now, there would still evolve new ones from our need to explain certain things, just as cavemen worshipped the sun.
Why that feature is there is not known to me. Evolution perhaps? One might also say that god put it there, but that would be a contradicition to the contradiction. :)

GreatWyrm of Babylon · Sep 1, 2003, 04:26 pm

The feature exists to identify threats. If we get sick we look for something to avoid, if our neighbor dies we look to see if it is something that can kill us as well. The problem is that it also affects abstract concepts where not knowing does not place us in any danger. I doubt we could have survived this long w/o the 'defect'.

fedfem · Sep 1, 2003, 06:25 pm

I agree the need or desire for "religion" exists. Before the advent of organized religion, nature and observable powers were venerated and sometimes worshipped. Although there were fights and territorial disputes before revealed religion....they didn't compare to those that came from so-called revealed religion. Religion subdues the masses for good and bad. A truly educated person can never be part of organized religion, except for social reasons. There is a good book called, "The God Part of the Brain". It explains why humans are naturally drawn to religions based on ritualistic and symbolic thought processes. As long as there are unanswered questions there will always be a God. Organized Religion attempts to answer the primal questions. In this day and age of knowledge it is becoming more and more difficult to convert the educated.

G. Adams · Sep 1, 2003, 08:17 pm

I watched a program that stated that when people hit that meditative, trance like state two portions on either side of brain shut off. This could explain the feeling of peace that people attribute to God/coming closer to enlightenment.

I'd personally go with Jung, on God at least. That man creates ideal images of himself, so that he has something to aspire to.

**Pooeypants** · Sep 2, 2003, 06:46 am

I think the time for religion is over. We have well established societies now and many ppl are living normal lives as agnostics or atheists. I mean in the modern world, most of the younger generation (UK) here can't even be bothered with religion. It's obsolete imo.

greendeath · Sep 3, 2003, 03:06 pm

Alright GreatWyrm, that was not a personal attack by any means, it was a truthful statement.

Why should you have the right to hand out "personal attacks" to whoever you please, yet when I do it, i am a mythical creature? Because saying what you said to Fallen Angel is pretty much considered a "personal attack" by your logic.

Aug 31, 2003, 06:37 pm	#22 (permalink) (top)
Um Yeah Sedimentary Rock Location: NY Posts: 4	I was born Roman Catholic, Im not actually sure what I am now but I consider myself a Christian. Im a fan of Jesus. Pretty Kawaii For A White Guy.http://www.gamespy.com/avatars/av/AT/at215.gif

Aug 31, 2003, 08:16 pm	#23 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	Began Catholic, went atheist, lost my faith in atheism, now i'd like to say I'm a buddhist but my social consciounce won't let me sit back and achieve nirvana while millions die of starvation just to keep a minority rich. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Sep 1, 2003, 12:31 am	#25 (permalink) (top)
GreatWyrm of Babylon Avatar of Tiamut Location: Dallas, Texas (Irving) Posts: 848	Fallen Angel Two things: First, I believe this topic was to list beliefs and conclusions not to debate them. Second, by what logic are you questioning a poster in a non-debate topic to claim you are not a bully? Logical Fallicies Link

Sep 1, 2003, 03:53 pm	#34 (permalink) (top)
GreatWyrm of Babylon Avatar of Tiamut Location: Dallas, Texas (Irving) Posts: 848	deadgreenthing Well, I see we have at least one individual that has already surrendered. He has not only failed to present any arguement to his case, he has started with a personal attack. Sorry, dustmote, being a troll carries no weight with me. But then I suspect being the first of your kind to attack me is status in the circles that you live in. So congrats on being the first to resort to flame before logic. I would point out to you that this topic was not introduced as a debate, but you failed to catch it the first time, so I will not bother to further assualt your IQ by asking it to read what is beyond it again... Logical Fallicies Link

Sep 1, 2003, 04:26 pm	#36 (permalink) (top)
GreatWyrm of Babylon Avatar of Tiamut Location: Dallas, Texas (Irving) Posts: 848	The feature exists to identify threats. If we get sick we look for something to avoid, if our neighbor dies we look to see if it is something that can kill us as well. The problem is that it also affects abstract concepts where not knowing does not place us in any danger. I doubt we could have survived this long w/o the 'defect'. Logical Fallicies Link

Aug 31, 2003, 01:07 pm	#21 (permalink) (top)
Nicole Sedimentary Rock Location: Missouri, USA Posts: 19	I got into a United Pentecostal church when I was 8 years old and suffered therein for 8 more years. I quit when I was 16 and no longer have a religion. I'm a very moral person with strict beliefs on how one should live their life, but I have yet to find a church that reflects my beliefs. In the UPC organization, I believe they've lost the true meaning behind Christianity. They are totally caught up in appearance and acquiring power. They've forgotten that what is on the inside is most important. In fact, I was ridiculed and picked on to an unbearable degree while in that religion. When I was just a little girl, adults and kids alike would gang up on me and bring me to tears with absolutely no remorse. I was taught that I could not associate with 'sinners' and had no friends in school either. I think I was better for the experience and it taught me that I should never say hurtful things to another person because of the damage it could cause. But at the same time, I feel like I'm better off without 'religion.' I can be a good person without an organization to fall back on. I do believe in God and believe that there are guidelines one must follow, found in the Bible. I hope to someday find a church to attend.

Sep 1, 2003, 12:55 am	#27 (permalink) (top)
Nicole Sedimentary Rock Location: Missouri, USA Posts: 19	I followed the religion to a T when I was younger- I never mocked or started any dispute. Their actions were to bring me down to their level and to try and cause me to be so unsure of myself that I would need their approval for all of my actions. Luckily my parents weren't into that religion, and I was able to leave when I did. I suffered from panic attacks and fears of social situations for some time thereafter. I don't mind the question, for the record. It was legitimate.

Sep 1, 2003, 01:03 am	#29 (permalink) (top)
Nicole Sedimentary Rock Location: Missouri, USA Posts: 19	My mistake :)

Sep 1, 2003, 01:05 am	#30 (permalink) (top)
Fallen Angel Igneous Magma Location: Sydney,Australia. Posts: 333	Not at all.

Sep 1, 2003, 04:21 am	#32 (permalink) (top)
Fallen Angel Igneous Magma Location: Sydney,Australia. Posts: 333	Whats wrong with taking offence to someone or something, if your saying I have no right to then you don't believe in free speech, I didnt say you can't say that, I just said I found it offensive to me, is'nt that how you work things out?

Sep 1, 2003, 04:17 pm	#35 (permalink) (top)
zkreso Sedimentary Rock Location: Norway Posts: 21	sigh back to the topic... I was not raised with any religion so I don't really know what to believe. I think that religion is a biological feature of the human brain. If all religions disappeared right now, there would still evolve new ones from our need to explain certain things, just as cavemen worshipped the sun. Why that feature is there is not known to me. Evolution perhaps? One might also say that god put it there, but that would be a contradicition to the contradiction. :)

Sep 1, 2003, 06:25 pm	#37 (permalink) (top)
fedfem Igneous Magma Location: Northeastern, USA Posts: 606	I agree the need or desire for "religion" exists. Before the advent of organized religion, nature and observable powers were venerated and sometimes worshipped. Although there were fights and territorial disputes before revealed religion....they didn't compare to those that came from so-called revealed religion. Religion subdues the masses for good and bad. A truly educated person can never be part of organized religion, except for social reasons. There is a good book called, "The God Part of the Brain". It explains why humans are naturally drawn to religions based on ritualistic and symbolic thought processes. As long as there are unanswered questions there will always be a God. Organized Religion attempts to answer the primal questions. In this day and age of knowledge it is becoming more and more difficult to convert the educated.

Sep 1, 2003, 08:17 pm	#38 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	I watched a program that stated that when people hit that meditative, trance like state two portions on either side of brain shut off. This could explain the feeling of peace that people attribute to God/coming closer to enlightenment. I'd personally go with Jung, on God at least. That man creates ideal images of himself, so that he has something to aspire to. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Sep 2, 2003, 06:46 am	#39 (permalink) (top)
Pooeypants Neo Moderator Location: England Posts: 5,546	I think the time for religion is over. We have well established societies now and many ppl are living normal lives as agnostics or atheists. I mean in the modern world, most of the younger generation (UK) here can't even be bothered with religion. It's obsolete imo. War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is strength Harness the power of Ingsoc, then you can capture someone killed the year before

Sep 3, 2003, 03:06 pm	#40 (permalink) (top)
greendeath Molten Ash Posts: 47	Alright GreatWyrm, that was not a personal attack by any means, it was a truthful statement. Why should you have the right to hand out "personal attacks" to whoever you please, yet when I do it, i am a mythical creature? Because saying what you said to Fallen Angel is pretty much considered a "personal attack" by your logic.