The Insanity of Scientology

[Zinkovich]

Scientology is literally insane. Some interesting facts about scientology:

1.)It has it's own navy, called Sea Org, which makes it's members sign a billion year contract
2.)It has constantly harrassed it's critics, and assumes all anti-scientologists are criminals; if you watch some of the videos I will later post,y ou will see some examples of this when they start calling the picketers nazis and implying that they are anti-american, as well as child molestors. Sometimes they get really pull tihngs out of nowhere like "You've never had a job" "You're working with criminals from Nigerian druglords"(I wish I was kidding about the last one :( )
3.)The churches original leaders broks into government offices.
4.) They REALLY do believe in Xenu
5.) They pretty much own the city of Clearwater.

Some videos form XenuTV(please, at LEAST watch the one about the police. It's absolutely shocking, not that the picketers are much better in terms of sanity.)-
Scientology's conquering of clearwater: Scientology and the Clearwater Police
Videos of the webmaster being harassed by Scientologists: My Harassment Chronicles
The craziest of ALL the picket videos: Clearwater Picket - July 26, 2000
More insanity from pickets:
Clearwater Picket - August 19, 2000
Clearwater Picket - September 19, 2000
The Trip to Clearwater - July, 1999
Two scientology "handlers" at work: The OT Committee
All of the legal cases involving scientology, including the one about the break-in of government offices: Legal Videos

So, um, discuss. Do you tihnk scientologists should be called out on their tactics and true nature? How do you think we should deal with scientology, keeping in mind that this issue is also one about religious freedom?

[Chris]

THese people are nuts. That big fat bastard who was pushing people, I just wanted to jump in to the screen and administer an ass kicking.

Bunch of asshats. Like the guy who pushed into the camera.

[Jack]

When it comes to religion, absurd beliefs and the desire to control everyone else and silence their critics is pretty much the norm. Scientology only seems extreme because it's a fairly recent invention. Other theologies are just as strange, but after a couple of thousand years we've started to accept them as reasonable. They aren't. None of them are.

[Zinkovich]

Quote by: Isherwood When it comes to religion, absurd beliefs and the desire to control everyone else and silence their critics is pretty much the norm. Scientology only seems extreme because it's a fairly recent invention. Other theologies are just as strange, but after a couple of thousand years we've started to accept them as reasonable. They aren't. None of them are.

Have you watched any of the videos I posted? How can you say that most religions employ the same tactic?

I certainly don't remember any examples of atheists, for example, being cussed out and shoved around by beligerrent Christians, nor do I see them going to their critics' houses and handing out bald-faced lies about what horrible bigots and child molestors they are.

Scientology is hundreds of times more extreme then most current religious institutions. They've had their own secret service, their own navy(where their leader, L. Ron Hubbard, pretty much had sex with his brainwashed teen groupies), and have many front organizations that are completely dishonest as to their ties to their religion, such as their "Council of Concerned Businessmen", their "Human Rights" group, and thier orginization dedicated to classifying critics as members of hate groups in order to use such accusations in court. They literally have(or, so they claim, had) a list of "suppressive persons", dangerous people that scientologists must hurt in every way they possibly can by ANY means; and it was a commandment. When somone leaves the church and criticizes it afterwards, they are COMPLETELY removed from the church, and anyone who attempts to contact them will be kicked out as well. I could go on for hours about how these people run, but I think you get the point.

Edit: For fucks sake, they've trademarked their religious documents and charge hundreds of thosands of dollars for merely pieces of it. Many of their "therapies" literally use some cold-war era brainwashing techniques on their subjects, and they keep lists of the confessions of their members. Scientology, unlike Christianity, seems to be COMPLETELY composed on the orginizational level of corrupt institutions that cynically want nothing more than a quick buck. There are nice people who are scientologists, don't get me wrong, but the religion has a completely corrupt group in charge of it, who apologize for nothign and harbors no true sympathy towards their devotees.

If you're wondering why I'm so passionate about this, it's because I live near Clearwater, and have a friend who was raised as a scientologist and later left the church. Her parents immediately severed contact with her with some coaxing by the church due to her current status as a picketer, causing her to sink further into depression. Fuck scientology.

[rez]

Quote by: Zinkovich I certainly don't remember any examples of atheists, for example, being cussed out and shoved around by beligerrent Christians, nor do I see them going to their critics' houses and handing out bald-faced lies about what horrible bigots and child molestors they are.

How come you forget about Christians condemning homosexuals by holding up picket signs that say "God hates fags". If you can remember, a Christian will tell an atheist that he/she will burn in hell for eternity.

[Zinkovich]

Quote by: rez How come you forget about Christians condemning homosexuals by holding up picket signs that say "God hates fags". If you can remember, a Christian will tell an atheist that he/she will burn in hell for eternity.

Maybe the minority, but your average Christian? Somehow I doubt it.

Would your average Christian cuss at you and shove you? Hit your camera? Go to your neighborhood and hand out fliers that smear you with unfoudned claims of bigotry and child molestation on your part? How about bullbaiting(taunting you hoping for a violent response)?

I have yet to meet a scientologist during my pickets who didn't respond to me violently or with implications that my girlfriends a whore and that I'm a drug lord. Perhaps it's just because of my stance or something, I don't know.

[Jack]

Examples.

Scientology is hundreds of times more extreme then most current religious institutions. They've had their own secret service, their own navy

Masons.

L. Ron Hubbard, pretty much had sex with his brainwashed teen groupies

Recent scandals involving priests.

When somone leaves the church and criticizes it afterwards, they are COMPLETELY removed from the church, and anyone who attempts to contact them will be kicked out as well

Excommunication.

they've trademarked their religious documents and charge hundreds of thosands of dollars for merely pieces of it

The Catholics and Mormons both have vaults of documents you and I can't see.

Many of their "therapies" literally use some cold-war era brainwashing techniques on their subjects, and they keep lists of the confessions of their members.

The laying on of hands and the confessional.

Scientology, unlike Christianity, seems to be COMPLETELY composed on the orginizational level of corrupt institutions that cynically want nothing more than a quick buck.

How is that unlike christianity?

the religion has a completely corrupt group in charge of it, who apologize for nothign and harbors no true sympathy towards their devotees.

The pope and college of cardinals. Robertson, Falwell...

Go to your neighborhood and hand out fliers that smear you with unfoudned claims of bigotry and child molestation on your part?

Jahovah's Witnesses.

I have a lot of theist friends. That's why I'm so irritated by all religions. Don't limit your wrath.

[grandpa]

It really disappointed me to learn that Beck is a Scientologist.

Grandpa h.

[Zinkovich]

Quote by: grandpa It really disappointed me to learn that Beck is a Scientologist. Grandpa h.

Oh no :( .

Why, Beck why?

No seriously, was he raised as a scientologist or something? Do you have an interview where he talks about his religion?

[grandpa]

Beck - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[phoenix_fire]

Xenu loves you all! No, wait...wrong religion. Seriously though. No...I just don't see how I can take Scientology seriously. And I don't see how athiests can really make a comparison (although I know they try) of this to more conventional religions. I mean, I'll (unnatural as it is for me) assume an athiestic standpoint for a sec. Assuming that all religions are fabrications, one could not say that Scientology and conventional religions are on equal footing. After all, one might be able to see how ancient people would want to explain things that they could not at the time account for scientifically. But almost in mockery of the vast amounts of scientific research we have today (which athiests think disprove the supernatural in general) stands something that calls itself (ironically) Scientology. My point is that if you are an atheist, it should be unfathomable to you that someone would make up a totally new mythology in this day and age.

Ok. Back to my own mindset. *sigh of relief*

[Jern_Sandyer]

Proof that Scientology goes over board is found in the fact that a popular fad site called 'YTMND' which for a period of time had a section devoted to Scientology which was full of anti-scientology pages made by various users. A notible one is called 'The Unfunny Truth About Scientology', which outlines murders, Suicides and other horror stories that all lead back to Scientology. (Mostly corruption in the highest parts). for those of you who haven't read down yet, be warned when viewing this piece, that it contains graphic images. -c

This is a site that usually makes fun of all religions equally. (where they can be made fun of) But the out cry against Scientology was emense as Scientology tried to get the Owner to delete an Anti-Scientology 'YTMND'. I can't remember the exacts as it was a couple of months ago.

[Jack]

My point is that if you are an atheist, it should be unfathomable to you that someone would make up a totally new mythology in this day and age.

It is. It's totally nonsensical. As nonsensical as people persisting in believing a 2000 year old myth that is also being discredited daily as science marches on. If christianity were invented today, it would seem as fantastic as scientology does. And just like scientology, there would still be hundreds of otherwise sensible people willing to believe it.

All religion looks irrational from the outside. Establishing degrees of irrationality seems an useless exercise.

[Chris]

Quote by: Jern_Sandyer Proof that Scientology goes over board is found in the fact that a popular fad site called 'YTMND' which for a period of time had a section devoted to Scientology which was full of anti-scientology pages made by various users. A notible one is called 'The Unfunny Truth About Scientology', which outlines murders, Suicides and other horror stories that all lead back to Scientology. (Mostly corruption in the highest parts). This is a site that usually makes fun of all religions equally. (where they can be made fun of) But the out cry against Scientology was emense as Scientology tried to get the Owner to delete an Anti-Scientology 'YTMND'. I can't remember the exacts as it was a couple of months ago.

Should probably include a "Graphic Image Warning" Warning there buddy.

[Zinkovich]

All religion looks irrational from the outside. Establishing degrees of irrationality seems an useless exercise.

But trying to establish which of these mythological viewpoints is the greater danger is, in my opinion, not a useless exercise.

The more I study scientology, the more I think it is a more immediate danger to the fabric of society. Also, while Christianity has made mistakes often just as henious, Scientology is more easily debunked, dealt with, and exposed. Keeping both of these things in mind, wouldn't it be more pragmatic to deal with Sceintology before it develops, rather then trying to expose the worst parts of a meme that has a greater cultural foundation(i.e. Christianity)?

Note: To those who are reading this and not atheistic in viewpoint, realize that I do not believe in stamping out ideas for any reason whatsoever; the means which I believe dangeorous ideas should be dealt is with numerous methods of exposure and offering cultural alternatives that provide the same kind of fulfillment. So, I am not for the censorship of religious ideals outright, nor persecution based on such ideals. Just want to make that clear before I come off as Stalinesque in attitude or something.

[Jern_Sandyer]

Quote by: Chris Should probably include a "Graphic Image Warning" Warning there buddy.

Sorry, thanks I forgot.

Edit: OK I can edit this message but no that one that's just plain odd.

[Autolykos]

Scientology is one man's attempt to enrich himself at others' expense. The entire "religion" is based on blackmail. "Auditing" involves confessing your deepest, darkest fears and fantasies on tape. Once recorded, those tapes are held over your head in order to extort more money from you. "Oh, you can't pay us this much... well, it would be unfortunate if your wife found out about your mistress." That kind of thing, and worse.

What's most sad about Scientology is the fact that there are so many needy people in this day and age. In a way, L. Ron Hubbard was a genius. He capitalized on the fact that millions of people are looking everywhere to solve their problems and feel better. Everywhere but inside themselves, that is. Why else did he prattle on and on against psychology and psychiatry? Because they actually tend to help people with their problems.

Scientology is nothing but a scam and L. Ron Hubbard was nothing but a first-class huckster. It's the mother of all modern-day cults. The rest of them are nothing but shadows in comparison. You would do well to stay away from Scientology at all costs.

- Rob

[lsbskins1]

Good old mister Hubbard's true stroke of genius was his abilitly to mix just enough rational truth with the bullstuff. He appeals to the pride of people . He raises crop after crop of jack-asses of all trades, people who know just enough about any subject to be REALLY dangerous, but who conceive of themselves as Jeffersonian in the "depth and variety of knowledge" they have "gathered". Really kinda frightening.

[Chris]

Quote by: Jern_Sandyer Sorry, thanks I forgot. Edit: OK I can edit this message but no that one that's just plain odd.

No worries, I eidted it for you.

[underbear1]

Scientology sure works great for changing male celebrities from being gay


worked like a charm