When is it okay to steal?

[truthreality]

All rules are ultimately grounded in how some (select) group of people feel about an issue and what consensus they reach.

I think the general population is fine with the illegality of theft.

I believe in allowing yourself to feel things, and in knowing what you feel.

Yes I do to. I also believe in analyzing my feelings before I make a decision so I do not make an irrational choice.

The antipiracy goons are a rather vicious bunch.

As are all law enforcement officials because they are dealing with criminals who generally need to be dealt with strictly.

$675,000 fines for music on some random kid. What do you make of that?

http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...ill_be_lowered

First he is not a "kid". He is a postdoctoral student. Hardly a kid. Second, he tried to distribute stolen property for profit.

I want them to do that. Maybe not to me specifically, but the more they go way beyond reason and try to intimidate the general public the more people will want to edit the laws a bit. It is all arbitrary after all, and all these clowns must do to change how things work in this country at a very fundamental level is further provoke the reasonable public into having an opinion.

I don't see changes in laws against theft anytime soon.

[finder]

All rules are ultimately grounded in how some (select) group of people feel about an issue and what consensus they reach. I believe in allowing yourself to feel things, and in knowing what you feel.

The antipiracy goons are a rather vicious bunch. $675,000 fines for music on some random kid. What do you make of that?

http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...ill_be_lowered

I want them to do that. Maybe not to me specifically, but the more they go way beyond reason and try to intimidate the general public the more people will want to edit the laws a bit. It is all arbitrary after all, and all these clowns must do to change how things work in this country at a very fundamental level is further provoke the reasonable public into having an opinion.

I specifically chose entertainment because it is something people do not require. I didn't exactly need to rescue a single item from that bookstore either. I wanted to because people were attempting to deal with other people unfairly.

My gosh Thanatos, are you really arguing that two wrongs make a right?
Maybe a new thread should be started for price fixing and government payoffs?

[finder]

However Thanatos, you did stir up an opinion in me on this subject. If we were occupied by a foreign army and they were starving the survivors of their initial aggression; then I'd be tempted to steal from them. But that would be a radically different scenerio then just stealing from someone because I was hungry and couldn't buy food for some reason. A little humility may go a long way further then theft. Just ask, it wouldn't take long before someone would have compassion.

[Questatement]

I have a sense of fairness, and I'm not alone.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4207351.stm

Of course, when in doubt, do what the monkeys do. The classic, atheist fall back when against the ropes.

While you're at it, don't forget to throw a little feces at your neighbor and ejaculate on the little school girls at the zoo.

[truthreality]

Of course, when in doubt, do what the monkeys do. The classic, atheist fall back when against the ropes.

While you're at it, don't forget to throw a little feces at your neighbor and ejaculate on the little school girls at the zoo.

Your in no position to talk since the Book of Mythology you defend was written by savages with knowledge and morality less then monkeys.

[iolo]

Under the Laws of Hywel, if you had unsuccessfully asked for food in two parishes, you could legally take a chicken in the third. It seems to me that it is utterly wrong to take from those in need, but morally okay to take from the rich, who stole it anyway. The trouble is that the practice may reduce you morally, lowering you to the level of millionaires.

[Dieval]

Continued from this thread:



I stole lab notebooks and stationary from the university bookstore while paying $40,000 a year in tuition. Why? Well, it was very overpriced.

If I am feeling overcharged or underserved, I will attempt to steal from you and I will usually get away with it.

Microsoft thinks their office software is worth quite a lot and it sucks more than it should. OpenOffice thinks their software is free and it is awesome. Except, I need the compatibility. Gee, I could afford the $349, but maybe I'm just going to download it illegally...

Christians and patent lawyers find my morals terrifying. I find them terrifying, so I guess we're even.



I have a sense of fairness, and I'm not alone.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4207351.stm

You can justify your stealing when you really want something and can't afford it....that doesn't make it "okay" to steal.

These days, about the only time I would be able to justify stealing is in a life & death situation (hurricane, earthquake, fire, something along that line). Stationary, MS Office and Diablo 3 don't even come close to that type of situation. (MS also makes student versions of their software available for $99 and I've even seen it offered for around $30 before....D3 also has a real money auction house which can only be achieved using their secure servers).

[Thanatos]

However Thanatos, you did stir up an opinion in me on this subject. If we were occupied by a foreign army and they were starving the survivors of their initial aggression; then I'd be tempted to steal from them. But that would be a radically different scenerio then just stealing from someone because I was hungry and couldn't buy food for some reason. A little humility may go a long way further then theft. Just ask, it wouldn't take long before someone would have compassion.

It seems like aggression to me to set up a price-gouging scheme. It is a distortion of the social contract.

I haven't addressed hunger and desperation yet because they complicate things. Everyone will steal if they are hungry enough, regardless of whether this is seen as right. I'd be very tolerant of people who were looting food and water whether it was after an invasion or a disaster; while that may not be categorically right, it is something human beings can categorically be expected to do. Only a saint would rather starve to death than attempt to steal, and I'd hate to lose a perfectly good saint over the price of a bag of potatoes.

[grandpa]

It seems like aggression to me to set up a
price-gouging scheme.
It is a distortion of the social contract.

Capitalism is in many ways aggressive, and the social contract isn't real.

Grandpa h.

[Dieval]

Capitalism is in many ways aggressive, and the social contract isn't real.

Grandpa h.

It is a dog-eat-dog world....eat or be eaten... best to learn that at an early age if you want to survive

[iolo]

It is a dog-eat-dog world....eat or be eaten... best to learn that at an early age if you want to survive

If you live amongst nasty dogs, I suppose.

[Thanatos]

If you live amongst nasty dogs, I suppose.

I live amongst monkeys. I hope they're better; I'm not a fan of eating others or being eaten myself.