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**Jack** · Dec 17, 2005, 12:05 am

With the upcoming HappyDays (my own feeble attempt at humor combined with political correctness), I thought we could use a good debate that shouldn't offer any chance to flame or be flamed.

I was listening to two linguists argue the other day. The issue thay were differing over was the use of the word "done" as opposed to "finished".

One felt that common usage had made the two terms synonymous when used in reference to tasks being completed or a job being wrapped up. They said that, "I'm done for the day", "Are you done with your dinner?" and "Call me when you're done" are acceptable.

The other argued (you should hear linguists going after each other, it can get vicious) that the proper term to use in the above examples would be "finished". "Done" is for basting turkeys or baking cookies. Humans are not "done" when they are "finished".

So...are we done or are we finished...or both? Do we care?

Perhaps more interesting would be to ask if we even need formal rules of grammer anymore. Are they having a hard time keeping up with common usage? Should usage be common or strictly dictated? Does a broad, rich command of the language command respect anymore? Do we still equate being well-spoken and a higher level of intelligence or education?

bishop · Dec 17, 2005, 12:11 am

well, i used to live in jersey.. i'd go with "done"..

**Jack** · Dec 17, 2005, 12:17 am

New Jersey or Jersey in the U.K.?
Speaking of which, I wonder what our British cousins think about this, being the "Mother Tongue" and all that.

Zealot · Dec 17, 2005, 12:18 am

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

With the upcoming HappyDays (my own feeble attempt at humor combined with political correctness), I thought we could use a good debate that shouldn't offer any chance to flame or be flamed.

I was listening to two linguists argue the other day. The issue thay were differing over was the use of the word "done" as opposed to "finished".

One felt that common usage had made the two terms synonymous when used in reference to tasks being completed or a job being wrapped up. They said that, "I'm done for the day", "Are you done with your dinner?" and "Call me when you're done" are acceptable.

The other argued (you should hear linguists going after each other, it can get vicious) that the proper term to use in the above examples would be "finished". "Done" is for basting turkeys or baking cookies. Humans are not "done" when they are "finished".

So...are we done or are we finished...or both? Do we care?

Perhaps more interesting would be to ask if we even need formal rules of grammer anymore. Are they having a hard time keeping up with common usage? Should usage be common or strictly dictated? Does a broad, rich command of the language command respect anymore? Do we still equate being well-spoken and a higher level of intelligence or education?

Wrapped up is better!

bishop · Dec 17, 2005, 12:23 am

heh.. jersey as in "cawfee"...

(weird that in living almost 2 years in boston, my jersey accent's only grown stronger.)

**Jack** · Dec 17, 2005, 12:24 am

Hmmm, how would I respond to someone asking me to, "call when you're wrapped up with dinner" or even, "call me when dinner's wrapped up"?

Protostar · Dec 17, 2005, 07:52 pm

GIT 'ER DONE!!

shield772 · Dec 17, 2005, 07:56 pm

Ummmm let me see I would say finished would be proper english but that done would be proper american

pubmanager · Dec 17, 2005, 08:59 pm

As one who speaks the "mother tongue" my humble opinion is that in spoken english it is perfectly acceptable use which ever word you like provided that the person you are talking to can understand what you are saying as words only take meaning through the interpretation of the listeners.

The nuances, texture and idiosyncracies of a living language are to be enjoyed. Words evolve; their accepted meaning changes with time, context, location and more. Not only that but new words enter the language through popular use and the same words can have two meanings that are completely opposite e.g. Bad = Good when used in context.

I'm not sure in reality that there is such a thing as 'proper spoken' English. Rather there is english as it was yesterday and english as it is today.

Would it be proper english to use 'thou' instead of 'you'? It certainly was considered 'proper' once.

Am I finnished?

I'll be finnished when I'm done.

I'm done.

Compugasm · Dec 18, 2005, 07:53 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

I was listening to two linguists argue the other day. The issue thay were differing over was the use of the word "done" as opposed to "finished".

Richard Letterer? It's a re-run of a show two months ago. He must be taking the HappyDays off.

**Jack** · Dec 18, 2005, 07:56 pm

Ah, another NPR fan. :)

Laurie · Dec 19, 2005, 09:18 am

Quote:

Quote by: shield772

Ummmm let me see I would say finished would be proper english but that done would be proper american

As a person with an American Father and an English Mother, and spending fairly equal amounts of time in both countries, I would say that you are probably correct... pubmanager's analogy got it down to a T I think.

lsbskins1 · Dec 19, 2005, 05:11 pm

Ahhh,

English is such a wonderful, adaptive language. Just try and trap it in a box and you are...

Milton Bradley · Dec 19, 2005, 07:18 pm

I use, and prefer done, until I'm actually finished. Finished implies that you are done.

RickSp · Dec 19, 2005, 07:45 pm

I would loosely subdivide that which is "done" and "finished" by whether the tense is active or passive. Done, being the past tense of "to do", is more active. Finished seems to be more passive, at least to my ear.

That being said, both seem to work.

So I guess, I'm done.

bishop · Dec 19, 2005, 07:58 pm

i'm getting into a bit of the new england lingo lately...

i still say "done" because of my gutteral jersey accent and dialect... but up here, we say "all set"..

*you done/finished with that?* *yup, i'm all set.*

Milton Bradley · Dec 19, 2005, 08:32 pm

Quote:

Quote by: bishop

i'm getting into a bit of the new england lingo lately...

i still say "done" because of my gutteral jersey accent and dialect... but up here, we say "all set"..

*you done/finished with that?* *yup, i'm all set.*

Thats actually pretty common around these parts as well.

belverron · Dec 19, 2005, 10:57 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

The other argued (you should hear linguists going after each other, it can get vicious) that the proper term to use in the above examples would be "finished". "Done" is for basting turkeys or baking cookies. Humans are not "done" when they are "finished".

If you want to get really technical, it is not the turkey but the basting that is "done," or rather has been done to the turkey. It's more important to observe the forms of the vernacular then the technicalities, of course, but if that's really what the linguist said, then apparently I'm a better linguist.

**Jack** · Dec 19, 2005, 11:01 pm

What they meant by the turkey being "done" is that it is fully cooked, done cooking if you will.

Milton Bradley · Dec 20, 2005, 07:36 am

Quote:

Quote by: Isherwood

What they meant by the turkey being "done" is that it is fully cooked, done cooking if you will.

So, in other words, that turkey is finished.

Stick a fork in his ass, and turm him over, he's done.

Dec 17, 2005, 12:05 am	#1 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 13,779	"Done" or "finished"? With the upcoming HappyDays (my own feeble attempt at humor combined with political correctness), I thought we could use a good debate that shouldn't offer any chance to flame or be flamed. I was listening to two linguists argue the other day. The issue thay were differing over was the use of the word "done" as opposed to "finished". One felt that common usage had made the two terms synonymous when used in reference to tasks being completed or a job being wrapped up. They said that, "I'm done for the day", "Are you done with your dinner?" and "Call me when you're done" are acceptable. The other argued (you should hear linguists going after each other, it can get vicious) that the proper term to use in the above examples would be "finished". "Done" is for basting turkeys or baking cookies. Humans are not "done" when they are "finished". So...are we done or are we finished...or both? Do we care? Perhaps more interesting would be to ask if we even need formal rules of grammer anymore. Are they having a hard time keeping up with common usage? Should usage be common or strictly dictated? Does a broad, rich command of the language command respect anymore? Do we still equate being well-spoken and a higher level of intelligence or education? The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

Dec 17, 2005, 12:11 am	#2 (permalink) (top)
bishop moderat-e/o-r Location: boston Posts: 11,184	well, i used to live in jersey.. i'd go with "done".. hope for america... http://www.ronpaul2008.com/

Dec 17, 2005, 12:17 am	#3 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 13,779	New Jersey or Jersey in the U.K.? Speaking of which, I wonder what our British cousins think about this, being the "Mother Tongue" and all that. The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

Dec 17, 2005, 12:23 am	#5 (permalink) (top)
bishop moderat-e/o-r Location: boston Posts: 11,184	heh.. jersey as in "cawfee"... (weird that in living almost 2 years in boston, my jersey accent's only grown stronger.) hope for america... http://www.ronpaul2008.com/

Dec 17, 2005, 12:24 am	#6 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 13,779	Hmmm, how would I respond to someone asking me to, "call when you're wrapped up with dinner" or even, "call me when dinner's wrapped up"? The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

Dec 17, 2005, 07:52 pm	#7 (permalink) (top)
Protostar Hardcore Capitalist Location: North Carolina Posts: 759	GIT 'ER DONE!! "I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." . . . Susan B. Anthony

Dec 17, 2005, 07:56 pm	#8 (permalink) (top)
shield772 68 Dead LEO's in 08 Location: Washington, WV Posts: 1,757	Ummmm let me see I would say finished would be proper english but that done would be proper american Republican Liberty Caucus Moderate Republican Officer Down Memorial Page

Dec 17, 2005, 08:59 pm	#9 (permalink) (top)
pubmanager start drinking up Location: london Posts: 582	As one who speaks the "mother tongue" my humble opinion is that in spoken english it is perfectly acceptable use which ever word you like provided that the person you are talking to can understand what you are saying as words only take meaning through the interpretation of the listeners. The nuances, texture and idiosyncracies of a living language are to be enjoyed. Words evolve; their accepted meaning changes with time, context, location and more. Not only that but new words enter the language through popular use and the same words can have two meanings that are completely opposite e.g. Bad = Good when used in context. I'm not sure in reality that there is such a thing as 'proper spoken' English. Rather there is english as it was yesterday and english as it is today. Would it be proper english to use 'thou' instead of 'you'? It certainly was considered 'proper' once. Am I finnished? I'll be finnished when I'm done. I'm done. "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid." - Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

Dec 18, 2005, 07:56 pm	#11 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 13,779	Ah, another NPR fan. :) The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)

Dec 19, 2005, 05:11 pm	#13 (permalink) (top)
lsbskins1 Redskins Rule Location: South-Western Virginia Posts: 2,475	Ahhh, English is such a wonderful, adaptive language. Just try and trap it in a box and you are... All I see when I look down, something jumpin' on the ground, Scratchin' dirt, cluckin' in the barnyard - Tell me, could that be you? John Kay

Dec 19, 2005, 07:18 pm	#14 (permalink) (top)
Milton Bradley BANNED Location: Ohio Province, Rep. of Comerica Posts: 7,320	I use, and prefer done, until I'm actually finished. Finished implies that you are done.

Dec 19, 2005, 07:45 pm	#15 (permalink) (top)
RickSp Volcanic Erupter Posts: 9,589	I would loosely subdivide that which is "done" and "finished" by whether the tense is active or passive. Done, being the past tense of "to do", is more active. Finished seems to be more passive, at least to my ear. That being said, both seem to work. So I guess, I'm done. Rick "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." Sinclair Lewis

Dec 19, 2005, 07:58 pm	#16 (permalink) (top)
bishop moderat-e/o-r Location: boston Posts: 11,184	i'm getting into a bit of the new england lingo lately... i still say "done" because of my gutteral jersey accent and dialect... but up here, we say "all set".. you done/finished with that? yup, i'm all set. hope for america... http://www.ronpaul2008.com/

Dec 19, 2005, 11:01 pm	#19 (permalink) (top)
Jack formerly Isherwood Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 13,779	What they meant by the turkey being "done" is that it is fully cooked, done cooking if you will. The Forum Rules Radical Atheist Heathen Queer Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be. (Ashleigh Brilliant)