How Many Weapons do you own?

[Osborn F Enready]

ZNY said: To say how I prefer to be prepared, and then have the gun-nazis tell me I'm wrong, is just plain obnoxious.

Who told YOU, YOU were wrong?

[Praxius]

Quote by: ZNFYRH Instead of a normal, "In my experience guns are faster and more accurate. Why do you, Prax or ZN, favor knives?"

I prefer blades for a number of reasons.

• Less regulation and requirements for a license.
• No Reload or Expense of Ammunition (Cost Effective)
• I personally feel one requires more skill to be sucessful with a blade in comparison to a firearm.
• If I am going to be placed in the position where I am to take someone's life in defense of my own, I'd much rather get up close and personal and watch the live drain from their eyes and expose myself to the full consiquences of my actions so that I never forget. (The same could be done with a firearm, but to me, it's just not the same)

And don't get me wrong, I like firearms as well.... I was quite the sharp shooter with the Lee Enfield I trained on during my teen years, better then by brother who actually got to play in the 96' Canada Games (I dropped out a couple of months before)

Actually that reminded me I also used to practice Archery..... If I was to go hunting, a Compound Bow is what I'd be using.

[Chaossaber314]

Osborn, you mean beside the variety of threads where someone got killed and you have repeatedly and unapologetically asserted how it wouldn't have happened had they had a gun?

[ZNFYRH]

Praxius

My reasons are similar to yours, but I also (and this has nothing to do with the oversensitive folks in this thread) think that guns are cowardly.

If you are going to take a life, you watch that life leave the person.

If I have the ability to either give a mugger my $20 dummy wallet, stab him, or shoot him, I would give him the $20.

Some things just aren't worth it to me.

My family will be well cared-for in the event of my death. They will never want for money again. My children could live to 120 and never work a day in their lives, and collect money until they day they die.

I have no fear of death, only dying. If that is how I'm supposed to die, then that's how I die. I don't want to, but I'm certainly not going to invite the escalation of violence in the meantime.

[Maryjane]

I'm surprised you guys haven't challenged each other to a spitting contest or maybe an arm wrestling competion yet

What was the question again? Oh yea, two guns. My sister has a 38. I have a 22. There are various other devices to inflict pain scattered around the house. From hockey sticks and baseball bats to chef knives and the ever present pot of hot coffee. I also have a 15 year old half blind arthritic Chessie that will either bite you or crap on you depending on his mood and his ability to stand. OH... AND I have an IPOD.

EIGHT WAYS TO KILL SOMEONE BY USING AN IPOD NANO, ACCORDING TO EX-MARINE BRAD COLLUM. BY KEVIN FLEMING - - - - 1. Break it in half with your hands (very easy to do) and use the glass viewing screen's broken edge as a razorblade to slice the jugular when they are looking the other way. 2. Take off one sock (a dress or tube sock; pantyhose will work in a pinch), place the Nano in the sock, swing it around as fast as you can (being careful to not hit yourself), and whack the intended target right on the temple. 3. Take the reflective shiny part and catch the sun's ray and shine it in a vehicle driver's eyes, or if you are at a rock concert and the lead singer is prancing around on a center stage that protrudes into the audience like a phallus, you can use the same technique. 4. The cord on the earbud headphones can be used to strangle someone. A knee in the back can give extra leverage. 5. Dig a pit about 5 feet deep, then take about 15 3-foot-long stakes 2 inches in diameter and sharpen one end to a fine point, like a very sharp pencil. Jam the sticks at least a foot into the ground, with the sharp ends pointing up. Cover the hole with pine boughs, grass, and leaves. Treat the Nano like a slice of cheese pizza in a deep, hot oven and place it gently in the middle. 6. Carefully unstaple a tea bag and pour the contents on a plate. Break into the lithium-ion battery pack and saturate the tea with the battery's poison, then dry the tea in the sun (or with a hair dryer if you are in a hurry). Put tea back in tea bag and bend the staple back to its original position. Put the tea bag back where you got it. 7. Download to the Nano "We've Only Just Begun" by the Carpenters. Tell someone you will give him or her your Nano if they listen to that song a hundred times in a row. 8. Hide the Nano in a bowl of lutefisk, then take it to the annual Norsefest Lutefisk Eating Competition in Madison, Minnesota.

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: leviathon435 Guns are illegal in most cases in the U.K. and to me that seems extremely sensible. Can I ask the americans whod do have guns why they do? I mean the threat of british colonialists is gone. Are they just for protection against other gun-weilders?

leviathon presumably you have no weapons as such and would dile 999 or ?

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: Maryjane I'm surprised you guys haven't challenged each other to a spitting contest or maybe an arm wrestling competion yet What was the question again? Oh yea, two guns. My sister has a 38. I have a 22. There are various other devices to inflict pain scattered around the house. From hockey sticks and baseball bats to chef knives and the ever present pot of hot coffee. I also have a 15 year old half blind arthritic Chessie that will either bite you or crap on you depending on his mood and his ability to stand. OH... AND I have an IPOD.

Maryjane at last someone who realises the beauty of ingenuity with weapons, guns are wonderful where they are allowed, but it's amazing how those whom are used to having such tools are at a terrible loss when they don't have one

as leviathon435 points out guns are illegal in the UK as are knives so defence is down to skill or the ability to adapt

the so devices might preclude the laws view on using reasonable force thus causing the need to ensure the body is never discovered

[Osborn F Enready]

Chaos said: Osborn, you mean beside the variety of threads where someone got killed and you have repeatedly and unapologetically asserted how it wouldn't have happened had they had a gun?

Once again, I stated what COULD have happened. Since there was no gun, there was no choice. I presented a REASON for ANOTHER CHOICE.

Now, back to the fact that you said I stated something I didn't state?

ZNYFRH said: If you are going to take a life, you watch that life leave the person.

A true statement. One you speak of with experience?

To deny that experience to others, no matter how just the necessity be, is not only hypocritical, but denial of the value of life, and of the choice we all hold and can ONLY make for ourselves.

Only then can one morally value their value of life, by choosing to live, or choosing to die, when faced with a TRULY morally unjust threat.

[leviathon435]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel leviathon presumably you have no weapons as such and would dile 999 or ?

I think my answer to that is yes but I'm not sure what you're getting at, n what situation would a gun help? Presumably the point is to stop th violence and/or protect family/freinds, if this is the case I can not see how a gun can really help, so yes calling 999 is probably my answer though yo need to be more specific.

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: leviathon435 I think my answer to that is yes but I'm not sure what you're getting at, n what situation would a gun help? Presumably the point is to stop th violence and/or protect family/freinds, if this is the case I can not see how a gun can really help, so yes calling 999 is probably my answer though yo need to be more specific.

leviathon you seem an honourable citizen by calling the authorities

as you may have noticed by my cooments guns are not the only weapons

and whilst we in the UK cannot own guns without the correct licence and it is highly doubtful the law would consider them reasonable force when used for self defence of property there are other possibilites and I question if you choose only the phone or have "something else" handy

you needn't answer if you consider the question too intrusive for such an open media

[Osborn F Enready]

leviathon, is every life valued equally to you?

Do you value your mothers life as much as the bum on the street?

Do you value your childs life as much as your own?

Things that have value, are worth protecting. Those who understand that, often seek to provide themselves with as many choices to perform that task, as possible, with the least room for error.

Owning a firearm, and being proficient with it, training yourself to act in the face of danger using action as opposed to inaction, is the best proven method of self-defense. That is why many choose not to relinquish their arms, and even moreso, not at the request of government, who historicly has been the worst abuser of this lack of defense.

[leviathon435]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel leviathon you seem an honourable citizen by calling the authorities as you may have noticed by my cooments guns are not the only weapons and whilst we in the UK cannot own guns without the correct licence and it is highly doubtful the law would consider them reasonable force when used for self defence of property there are other possibilites and I question if you choose only the phone or have "something else" handy you needn't answer if you consider the question too intrusive for such an open media

Ah, i see your question now, and the answer is no, I have nothing else to hand, Obviously I have kitchen knives in my house which could be used as a weapon but I would not consider using them. The weapon i consider to be most useful is my brain and whilst it may sound a bit cliched I would try to avoid a violent confrontation with my quick-thinking, at least enough to postpone violence untill police have arrived. this is not just naivity (pardon my spelling) on my part, the fact is that I would not be capable of using force even if i had the physical means.

[Keith Hamburger]

Quote by: leviathon435 Well for hunting I see as possibly more acceptable, maybe unnecassary but i have nothing against hunting. I also see the problem that you percieve but I think it may be true that, to misquote slightly, "if you live by the gun you die by the gun". A culture which allows guns will have more gun-crime, at least that's what I think. P.s. I think i've accidentally quoted Tupac.

However, if you look at overall crime statistics, total crime increases with a decrease in LEGAL firearm ownership. When criminals can get an advantage with a baseball bat, then you might not have a gun crime, but you will have crime.

Hell, if the guy's bigger than you and all he has is his fists, he can take anything he wants from you when guns are illegal. I hear there's a big problem with muggings in the UK, and most aren't even reported because nothing happens to the perps.

Actually, there's another problem in the UK. If you resist a criminal at all in the UK you can be punished. Most people in the civilized world would consider it insane to punish someone for trying to protect themselves and their property.

Keith

[Chaossaber314]

Quote by: Osborn Once again, I stated what COULD have happened. Since there was no gun, there was no choice. I presented a REASON for ANOTHER CHOICE. Now, back to the fact that you said I stated something I didn't state?

Oh BS. When it comes to guns you make a habit of talking in absolutes which is a shame because you're usually not as close minded about other issues.

[Keith Hamburger]

Quote by: ruksak I had him sighted. No way he could have drawn down on me. The adrenaline was pumping, I was ready to shoot his ass. He made a loud proclamation with many a witness; "I'm gonna beat the f*cking sh*t out of you." Giving me just cause for deadly force if necessary.

At this time, I haven't read past this post, but I'm certain that you will get flack for stating that is cause. However, a threat of violence with the ability to follow through is clearly assault.

In Colorado you can use deadly force against someone who assaults you, or someone else in your presence. And, you're not required to back down. If the assailant flees, you are allowed to pursue and use deadly force.

Not that I'm likely to pursue, but I'm sure as hell not likely to back down, either.

Keith

[Keith Hamburger]

Quote by: Chaossaber314 Agreed. Some people in this thread (not everyone) sound almost like they would actually like to use their firearm against a human being. Maybe they don't want to go around shooting people, but it seems as though some here would get off on mortally wounding an intruder or someone who attacked them. I guess I just can't relate to that sadistic attitude.

Given the hotheads around, it would be easy enough to taunt someone into an assault that would justify the use of deadly force.

If any of us were wanting "go around shooting people" it would be no problem to do so and get away with it.

Perhaps you should recheck your premises.

Keith

[Osborn F Enready]

Chaos said: Oh BS. When it comes to guns you make a habit of talking in absolutes which is a shame because you're usually not as close minded about other issues.

I always make a habit of talking in absolutes. That is the basis of reason. You are alive, or you are dead. Life and death are absolutes.

A firearm is used to protect, an absolute.

Yes, I talk in absolutes, and use terms like "concrete", "tangible" to define what is and what is not.

Everyone here seems to agree life is worth protecting. Why is there a debate at the cost of that protection?

[ZNFYRH]

Quote by: Osborn A true statement. One you speak of with experience?

Unfortunately, yes.

Quote by: Osborn To deny that experience to others, no matter how just the necessity be, is not only hypocritical, but denial of the value of life, and of the choice we all hold and can ONLY make for ourselves.

When I say watch, I mean within arms reach.

Taking a life without touching the person is cowardly, and causes you to not understand the ramifications of what you have done.

I have had to take a life both with a firearm and within arms reach, the former first, and after the latter I know I never want to do it again.

[Chaossaber314]

Quote by: Osborn I always make a habit of talking in absolutes. That is the basis of reason. You are alive, or you are dead. Life and death are absolutes.

Then you negate your claim about talking about what could have been then.

A firearm is used to protect, an absolute.

Incorrect. A firearm is used to kill. Providing that the weapon was used successfully, the justifiability of said killing is for a jury of your peers to decide. Whether or not you succeed in utilizing the device for its manufactured purpose is not a failure in the premise of the weapon but the result of mechanical or user error, intentional or not.

[Osborn F Enready]

ZNYFRH said: Unfortunately, yes.

Its unfortunate that happened, and I can state without reserve I hope I never have to deal with that.

ZNYFRH said: Taking a life without touching the person is cowardly, and causes you to not understand the ramifications of what you have done.

Excuse me, but I don't view an attack with unjust force worthy of my risk, nor do I value the life of someone taking that risk enough to do it for the simple "value of life" argument.

I also don't appreciate the cowardly accusation in the roundabout, but....

ZNYFRH said: I have had to take a life both with a firearm and within arms reach, the former first, and after the latter I know I never want to do it again.

Thats a personal choice, with all due respect.