Was it all bad? Germans look anew at Nazi taboos

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Was it all bad? Germans look anew at Nazi taboos | Editor's Choice | Reuters

BERLIN (Reuters) - A row over a television host's praise for Hitler's family values has exposed deep divisions in Germany over whether it is acceptable to say anything positive about the Nazis, 62 years after the end of World War Two. While Hitler's main legacy -- the murder of 6 million Jews and the destruction caused by the war -- is undisputed, the controversial views of blonde-haired, blue-eyed Eva Herman have grabbed the headlines in Germany for more than a week.

And are there good points as well as bad. Eva Herman is correct and the Germans have a right to see the positive outcomes of the Nazi years! don't they?

[GHook93]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel Was it all bad? Germans look anew at Nazi taboos | Editor's Choice | Reuters And are there good points as well as bad. Eva Herman is correct and the Germans have a right to see the positive outcomes of the Nazi years! don't they?

Sure a bunch of volconvo anti-semites see the extermination of 6 million Jews as positive.

[Praxius]

You can not ignore or deny history, or it'll just repeat again.

One can only learn from the good and the bad from past actions and try to use them better in the future.

Did the Nazis do a lot of evil things? Sure.... there's no need to debate that.

But should everybody be fired and shunned for pointing out the few good things that came out of that era? That's just blaitent shutting down on information due to fear.

Frig, you can't even say that Hitler had an interesting moustache without someone pointing a neo-nazi finger at you.

Someone has a question on what happened during the Holocaust to better understand what happened, and you have the whole world think you're a nazi because you don't accept entirely and without question what was reported as to what happened.

The restriction on the ability to look at different aspects of the Nazi era and to ask questions, both good and bad, is directly Nazi in itself.... as it keeps a strangle hold on the written history of the victors and we all are told to accept it without question, or we're deemed neo-nazis or racist.......

Forced History.

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: GHook93 Sure a bunch of volconvo anti-semites see the extermination of 6 million Jews as positive.

An ambomination that I'm sure appaled many Germans, no one could support such inhumanity.

Now GHook look beyond such horrors and see their acheivements, the cohesion and drive of a society.

[Praxius]

Quote by: GHook93 Sure a bunch of volconvo anti-semites see the extermination of 6 million Jews as positive.

Only a narrow-minded volconvo would quickly jump and say something in regards to the holocaust and leave it at that as the end of debate. :rolleyes:

^ The exact example I was talking about.

Nobody said anything about denying the holocaust happened or that it was a good thing, nor did anybody make any notion towards being anti-semetic.... so how about contributing something to the debate?

How much of todays technology came from Nazi Germany?

Rockets?
Jet Fighters?
Basic Tank Warefare?
The use of a massive Air Force?

[phoenix_fire]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel An ambomination that I'm sure appaled many Germans, no one could support such inhumanity. Now GHook look beyond such horrors and see their acheivements, the cohesion and drive of a society.

When a society's cohesion is based on hatred, racism, murder, and fear, it deserves to and should fall apart.

[phoenix_fire]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel Was it all bad? Germans look anew at Nazi taboos | Editor's Choice | Reuters And are there good points as well as bad. Eva Herman is correct and the Germans have a right to see the positive outcomes of the Nazi years! don't they?

Except this is what she was saying was good:

The Nazis encouraged women to stay at home, look after their husbands, and produce and rear children.

It's a throwback to Social Darwinism: the idea that the women of the master race are defined by their differences from men and that they should perpetuate those differences as much as possible in order to maintain that status. That meant staying in their own "separate sphere" and taking on whatever characteristics and roles that men didn't want. It was reprehensible.

[GHook93]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel An ambomination that I'm sure appaled many Germans, no one could support such inhumanity. Now GHook look beyond such horrors and see their acheivements, the cohesion and drive of a society.

The autoban and jet engines!

[Compugasm]

I would like to thank the Nazis for microwaves.

[The Decider]

Quote by: Praxius But should everybody be fired and shunned for pointing out the few good things that came out of that era? That's just blaitent shutting down on information due to fear. Frig, you can't even say that Hitler had an interesting moustache without someone pointing a neo-nazi finger at you.

You're overlooking one little detail--the OP's example of Hitler's "few good things" was his "family values." You know, like Hitler's plan to kidnap the best "white Aryan" German children for his Master Race breeding program (called Lebensborn)? Or his racial marriage laws? Or his own sordid history with mistress/wife Eva Braun?

Yeah, the guy was real a family role model. Eva Herman is a deluded psycho.

Should she have the right to make the comment? Yeah, sure. But Germany has a censorship law and this comment falls under that law. Unfortunately, the censorship law has the effect of making her demented views a world news item instead of the curious rant it would be in America. The law is counterproductive.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/07/wo...pagewanted=all

Quote by: Praxius Someone has a question on what happened during the Holocaust to better understand what happened, and you have the whole world think you're a nazi because you don't accept entirely and without question what was reported as to what happened.

You mean like "did 6 million Jews actually die?" Despite mountains of evidence--ie population records before and after, German documents, German plans, East European documents, countless eyewitness reports, and recorded confessions, some people deny reality and others defend them because they are denying reality and creating the illusion of a "debate." It's like saying, "someone has a question about the round earth theory (flat earth supporters) to better understand our planet and you have the whole world thinking you're a loon." But I wouldn't censor the Flat Earth Society--their words do more damage to themselves than censorship ever could.

[The Decider]

Quote by: Praxius How much of todays technology came from Nazi Germany? Rockets? Jet Fighters? Basic Tank Warefare? The use of a massive Air Force?

Implements of war. Germans should feel proud about those efficient weapons. And don't forget German nuclear scientists and their contributions to downtown redevelopment in Hiroshima and Nagasaki!

Then again, I suppose we owe Adolf a big thank you for our space program--without his ingenious forced labor policies at rocket sites, America would still be dreaming of a moonwalk--that's if we did reach the moon which some people deny to this very day. We need to more closely examine that conspiracy theory before honoring Hitler just yet.

One more thing--American and European companies contributed to Hitler's momentus "achievements." Like IBM's precursor to the computer that Hitler used to make the trains run on time. Order and efficiency and engineering--Farfegnugen! With an American assist...

IBM And Nazi Germany, Researcher Has New Documents On World War II Conduct - CBS News

[The Bacon Guy]

Quote by: Arawn And are there good points as well as bad

I rather liked the uniforms. Say what you will about them Nazis, they sure knew how to dress.

[lsbskins1]

Someone above has addressed the true crux of the issue. It is not being "open minded and allowing reasonable debate" to treat every question and every argument as if it is reasonable. Must an elementary school teacher treat "but couldn't 1+1=7" as a reasonable question? I mean, we have no absolute knowledge that our whole concept of quantity isn't completely wrong. Does that mean that any question is legitamate and all questions must be treated as if they were posed from a place of honesty? I don't think so. And I challenge anyone out there to name one thing the Nazi's developed that was both helpful and impossible to achieve absent the Nazi "philosophy". It just can not be done. And when you imply that they brought us things that were helpful, you imply that they were good and necessary on some level, and the only point in that implication is to make them seem less repugnant. If that is not your intention, then you are nothing more than a useful pawn for those who do have that intention.

[another day]

Quote by: Praxius How much of todays technology came from Nazi Germany? Rockets? Jet Fighters? Basic Tank Warefare? The use of a massive Air Force?

You see this as positive? More advanced tools for causing death and destruction are a good thing? :eek:

[grandpa]

Quote by: GHook93 Sure a bunch of volconvo anti-semites see the extermination of 6 million Jews as positive.

Where is this "bunch" of people? I've seen one, maybe two holocaust skeptics here.

Grandpa h.

[grandpa]

Quote by: another day You see this as positive? More advanced tools for causing death and destruction are a good thing?

To some people, yes, death and destruction give us better, more
fulfilling lives. By such standards, we could also be grateful for the British Boer War, which, according to historian Chalmer's Johnson, spawned the modern concentration camp.

Grandpa h.

[Thanatos]

Hitler did turn a bombed-out hyperinflated nation into a war machine that nearly destroyed the rest of Western civilization. That's quite an accomplishment. I'm not sure we really want to copy the big economic benefits of a full-throttle wartime economy because this implies that you're probably killing quite a lot of people.

[GHook93]

Quote by: grandpa Where is this "bunch" of people? I've seen one, maybe two holocaust skeptics here. Grandpa h.

That wouldn't be Holocaust skeptics! :rolleyes: That would be people that believe the Holocaust happened and proud of it.

Don't want to name names, since that would be infraction-worthy!

[grandpa]

Quote by: GHook93 That wouldn't be Holocaust skeptics! :rolleyes: That would be people that believe the Holocaust happened and proud of it. Don't want to name names, since that would be infraction-worthy!

I don't see why you get an infraction. It's better to comr forward with full details and elaborations. Otherwise, I'll have to assume you're not telling the truth.

Grandpa h.

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: phoenix_fire When a society's cohesion is based on hatred, racism, murder, and fear, it deserves to and should fall apart.

phoenix the view from within?

Is the star spangled banner begining to tear?