Roxdog vs Castille

[dotcoma]

Judging by your answer, you obviously made him up. Do you want to share any more of your magical friends with me?

You know, I'm a pretty laidback, peaceful dude but if you were in front of me and said this I'd slap you like you were Charlie Murphy...

[dotcoma]

China arrests Roman Catholic priests, detains Protestant church members Associated Press May. 17, 2004 07:15 AM SHANGHAI, China - Authorities in northern China detained two priests from the underground Roman Catholic Church as they were about to begin classes on natural birth control and theology, a Connecticut-based lobby group said Monday. Police in Dingzhou, a city in Hebei province, refused to comment on the Cardinal Kung Foundation's report that they detained Lu Genjun, 42, and Cheng Xiaoli, 40. The Stamford, Conn.-based foundation provides support to the Catholic church in China and monitors the communist government's efforts to suppress it. Lu, ordained in 1990, was recently released from a labor camp after spending three years there. The report said he was detained in Dingzhou. Cheng's whereabouts were unknown. China broke ties with the Vatican in 1951 and demands that Catholics worship only in churches approved by the China Patriotic Catholic Association, a state-controlled body that does not recognize papal authority. Many Chinese Catholics, however, remain loyal to the pope and risk arrest by worshipping in unofficial churches and private homes. The state church claims 4 million believers, but the Cardinal Kung Foundation said the unofficial church has 12 million followers. Many believers and some priests move between the two churches. Hebei province, next to Beijing, is a stronghold of Catholic sentiment. A number of priests there have been detained, some for years. In a separate report, the New York-based Committee for Investigation on Persecution of Religion in China said Xu Shuangfu, founder of a Protestant evangelical group, was kidnapped last month while visiting the northeastern province of Heilongjiang. Dozens of church members have been arrested in a police crackdown, and one was beaten to death, the Committee said. Police in Heilongjiang would not comment on the report. Protestants also are required to worship in state-sanctioned churches, and independent church organizers and worshippers are routinely harassed and detained.

http://www.themercury.news.com.au/common/s...5%5E401,00.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/8BA...A5F12FEB9D4.htm
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewForeignBureaus....R20020729b.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,120136,00.html
http://www.tibet.ca/en/wtnarchive/1998/4/17_6.html
http://www.cardinalkungfoundation.org/
http://www.catholicexchange.com/vm/index.a...=3&art_id=23824
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/2156621.stm
http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=25526
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/850704/posts
http://www.holyspiritcatholicchurch.org/vm...sp?art_id=18550

Chinese Catholic Priest Gets Six Years for Publishing Bible BEIJING, May 27 (AFP) - A Catholic priest in China has been sentenced to six years in prison for illegally publishing the bible in a Chinese county where seven underground churches have been closed recently, a rights group reported Saturday. Police charged Jiang Shurang with illegally publishing the bible and other religious books and for carrying out business illegally, the Information Centre for Human Rights and Democracy said. The Hong Kong-based centre said in a faxed statement however that Jiang, sentenced on April 25 following his detention in December, gave most of the books away to others and did not make money from their sale. An officer with a police detention centre in Cangnan county in eastern Zhejiang province confirmed Jiang was being held there but said he was not aware he had been sentenced. The centre said police had closed down at least seven unregistered Catholic churches in Cangnan county since February, while the whereabouts of five Catholic priests based there remained unknown after they had been taken into detention in January. Two Catholic churches co-exist in China. The official one pledges allegiance to the Communist Party and does not recognise the Pope's authority. The other clandestine church is loyal to the Pope. The official church has around four million followers, while the underground church claims around 10 million.

As you can see it's tough to be both Chinese AND free to control your own destiny. A lot of refugees have sought asylum in the US and Europe, where I formally resided. There are TONS of Chinese nationals in Dublin of all places. Did you know that? No? I must have made it up then....jackass.

[castille]

So....where does it say the priest is missing his legs?

(By the way, just curious, has that priest ever engaged in illegal relations with children?)

There are TONS of Chinese nationals in Dublin of all places.

So? They could be immigrants, not refugees. Ask all of them whether they hate the Chinese government.

By the way I'd advise all Chinese to get out of Ireland. Racial attacks against Chinese in Ireland are increasing, and judging by the comments on the Peoples Daily forums from Chinese-in-Ireland, it doesnt look like Irish folks like non-white people. Go to a more tolerant country like France.

I'm a pretty laidback, peaceful dude but if you were in front of me and said this I'd slap you like you were Charlie Murphy

I don't beat women.

[dotcoma]

By the way I'd advise all Chinese to get out of Ireland

Dude, you don't have the slightest clue...

[castille]

These recent attacks come after a spate of racist attacks upon the Chinese community earlier in June. The level of attacks over the past few years appears to be increasing at an alarming rate.

More than a third of those polled said they would not like to work with Asian, Afro-Caribbean or Chinese people

Alarmingly the number of racist attacks on children doubled - rising from 8.5% of total attacks in 1996 to more than 16% in 1999.

http://www.monitoring-group.co.uk/News%20a...st_violence.htm

They assaulted two pregnant Chinese women then broke a man's nose by smashing him in the face with a brick.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_irelan...and/3338091.stm
www.irr.org.uk/europebulletin/ united_kingdom/violence_harassment

Wow, even I didnt realise it was this serious. I wonder if any blacks/Indians are also targeted? Oh wait, the Africans are.

[castille]

By the way, you still haven't answered my question addressing your lie: You said that the priest had his legs broken. Is there any evidence to confirm this, or is lying one of your debate tactics?

[dotcoma]

No, they beat and starve people to death but no one's ever lost their legs. Not once.

[castille]

First, you say they broke his legs (which you now admit you lied about). Now you're saying they beat/starve people? Got any proof?

With people like you I can see where the Irish get their racist rep. Hey try not to beat up any chinks and negros, ok?

[dotcoma]

I never admitted to anything. And I posted an article. Try reading...

"Dozens of church members have been arrested in a police crackdown, and one was beaten to death, the Committee said. "

[castille]

For a conspiracy theorist, you're a crap liar.

Originally posted by roxdog, Yes, I know. I've actually met a priest that had his legs, um, removed, by the Chinese govt...and It's not just the Walker Report, it's about a thousand other sources as well....

So....where are the thousand resources verifying his legs were removed? Even 1 would be good.

[dotcoma]

This is silly. Your support of a totalitarian, terroristic regime crumbles in front of everyone and you accuse me of lying. And I'm not a conspiracy theorists. That's a defense mechanism you've allowed yourself to create in order to justify the life you lead.

[dotcoma]

http://www1.umn.edu/humanrts/commission/th...ORAD1.htm#China

China

Information transmitted to the Government

102. By letter dated 14 July 1995 the Special Rapporteur advised the Government that he had continued to receive information indicating that the use of torture and ill-treatment against persons held in police stations, detention centres, prisons and labour camps was occurring with frequency. According to the reports, many persons detained for political reasons were convicted of offences partly or wholly on the basis of "confessions" that had been obtained through the application of torture during interrogation.

103. The Special Rapporteur indicated that he had received particular allegations in regard to the conditions at Guangzhou No. 1 Re-education through Labour Centre, Hua county, Guangdong province. The administration of beatings and other forms of ill-treatment for small infractions at the camp was said to be common. Production quotas were reportedly set at levels which in effect required prisoners, including the sick or disabled, to work for approximately 14 hours per day, seven days per week, performing such tasks as carrying and loading heavy stones onto boats. Food provisions were reported to be inadequate and ill prisoners were said to be provided little or no medical treatment. Inmates considered to work at a slow pace were allegedly beaten, sometimes to the point of unconsciousness. One prisoner, Chen Pokong, allegedly had his hands and feet squashed with stones by guards at the camp.

104. The Special Rapporteur also transmitted information according to which the torture and ill-treatment of persons arrested for political reasons in Tibet was particularly pervasive. The methods of such torture reportedly include beatings, electric shocks, deprivation of food and drink, exposure to cold, handcuffing or shackling for long periods, and denial of medical treatment. In this regard, the Special Rapporteur communicated information on the cases summarized in the following paragraphs and reminded the Government of a number of cases in Tibet transmitted in 1994 regarding which no reply had been received.

105. Gyaltsen Kelsang, a nun, was reportedly beaten following her arrest from Garu nunnery on 14 June 1993. While serving a two-year term at Drapchi prison in Lhasa for participation in a pro-independence demonstration, she was allegedly beaten severely and as a result was confined to bed for 20 days. Soon after being diagnosed at a police hospital in November 1994 as suffering from severe kidney problems, she lost movement in her lower limbs and developed speech impairment. She was eventually sent home on medical parole and later spent nine weeks at the Tibetan medical hospital. She died on 20 February 1995, seven days after her release from hospital.

106. Lodroe Gyatso, a professional dancer serving a sentence of 15 years in Drapchi prison, was allegedly beaten severely on 4 March 1995, after he had distributed pro-independence literature and shouted slogans in the prison. He continued to receive daily beatings in a confinement cell measuring six feet by six feet. The Middle People's Court reportedly recommended to the Higher People's Court that he be executed for his political actions in the prison.

107. Khetsul and Yeshi Pema, from Lhundrup county, and Ngawang Drozler and Gyaltsen Wangmo, from Lhokha, were among five nuns who were reportedly arrested on 8 February 1995 after engaging in a protest outside the Jokhang temple. They were allegedly beaten severely during their arrest.

108. Pasang and Ngodrup, both monks from Jokhang, were reportedly arrested on 8 January 1995 and severely beaten over the course of three days in Gutsa Detention Centre in Lhasa. Pasang suffered severe back pain and was unable to stand as a result of his treatment. The monks were allegedly threatened with further punishment if they revealed information about the treatment that they had received.

109. Lobsang Palden, Chimé Dorje, Pema Tsering, Jampa Tashi, and Lobsang Tsegyal, monks from the Serwa monastery, reportedly removed two nameplates and affixed pro-independence posters to the headquarters of the Lingkha district people's government, Pashö county, and later shouted slogans and affixed posters to the walls of other government and military offices on 29 March 1994. They were arrested, after which they were allegedly kept suspended by their thumbs at the gate of the county public security bureau and beaten severely during interrogation. They were subsequently sentenced to terms of imprisonment.

110. The Special Rapporteur also transmitted to the Government information he had received indicating that juveniles detained for political reasons in Gutsa Detention Centre are held together with adult prisoners, rather than in the juvenile section of the facility. In Drapchi prison, adults and juveniles were reportedly kept together because separate juvenile sections did not exist. Juveniles were allegedly forced to do hard labour and to work in unsanitary conditions with adults in prisons, detention centres, reform through labour detachments or re-education through labour detachments.

111. The Special Rapporteur communicated the cases of beatings of juveniles in Tibet described in the following paragraphs.

112. Champa Tsondrue and Lobsang Choezin, both 17-year-old novice monks at Ganden Choekhor monastery in Penpo Lhundrup county, were reportedly arrested on 20 June 1994 after participating in a peaceful demonstration at the Barkhor in Lhasa. They were allegedly beaten severely by security officials and taken to Gutsa Detention Centre.

113. Tenzin Dekyong, a 16-year-old novice from Michungri nunnery, was reportedly arrested on 13 March 1993 during a peaceful demonstration. She was allegedly beaten and taken to Gutsa Detention Centre.

114. Pema Oeser, a 16-year-old novice form Nagar nunnery in Lhundrup county, was reportedly beaten after being arrested with three other nuns on 17 August 1993 during a demonstration in Lhasa.

115. Dhundup Gyalpo, a 17-year-old monk, was reportedly arrested on 26 June 1993 outside Gyaldon monastery, Lhundrup county, during a protest against the arrest of a boy accused of posting pro-independence materials. Dhundup Gyalpo was allegedly beaten by police and threw stones at them in response. He was said currently to be serving a three-year administrative sentence.

116. Sherab Ngawang, a 12-year-old novice from Michungri nunnery, was reportedly arrested on 3 February 1992 during a peaceful demonstration in Lhasa. She was taken to Gutsa Detention Centre and allegedly beaten. She was sentenced in May 1992 to three years' "re-education through labour" and sent to Trisam Re-education through Labour Detachment.

117. In a letter transmitted on 4 October 1995, the Special Rapporteur advised the Government that he had received additional information with respect to Sherab Ngawang, according to which she had received treatment in more than one hospital in Lhasa following the completion of her three-year sentence in February 1995. The treatment was administered for injuries to her kidneys and lungs sustained as the result of torture by four guards, who had allegedly beaten her with electric batons and a plastic tube filled with sand, stamped upon her and kicked her. The guards were said to have inflicted this treatment in reprisal for her having made a face at them when they closed her cell door one evening. She died on 15 May 1995 in Maldrogungkar, allegedly as a result of injuries sustained from the beating. A Tibetan undertaker who dismembered her body in accordance with traditional funeral rites reportedly indicated that her kidneys bore signs of acute damage and marks of injury appeared on her lungs.

118. In the 4 October letter, the Special Rapporteur also transmitted the cases summarized in the following paragraphs.

119. Rigzin Tsultrim, reportedly arrested in May 1993 during a demonstration near the Barkhor in Lhasa, was allegedly kicked, beaten and subjected to shocks to his face with an electric baton. At the police station his thumbs were cuffed diagonally behind his back and he was forced to sit on his knees for eight hours, causing him to fall over frequently. When he fell, police officers allegedly beat him on the ribs, stomach and thighs. On one occasion he was reportedly kicked in the jaw and as a result lost two molars. Later he was taken to the police station courtyard, where officers allegedly applied electric shocks to his chest, back, hands and palms, causing him to pass out, whereafter he was revived with water and again beaten. He was then placed into a cell with handcuffs and leg cuffs for three days and nights without food or water. During further interrogation he was kicked in the shins and punched in the stomach. He was eventually released from custody.

120. Sonam Tashi was reportedly arrested on 26 May 1993, after having participated in a demonstration at the Barkhor the previous day. Over the course of a number of interrogation sessions, he was allegedly beaten severely and as a result sustained multiple internal injuries. He was released from prison in late 1994, but died in early 1995, allegedly from the injuries he had sustained during interrogation.

121. Tamdin Tsering was allegedly beaten to death on 7 September 1994 by four forestry officials while he and his family were tending their potato farm in Linyen county of Laodu district in Amdo province.

122. Jigme Gyatso, a monk from Tsayu township in Xiahe, was reportedly detained on 19 May 1995 by the Xiahe county police on suspicion of involvement in putting up pro-independence posters at Labrang monastery in Amdo. He was allegedly beaten severely, as a result of which he has become partially paralysed, unable to move his arms and legs. Doctors at the Xiahe county hospital were said to have refused to treat him because of his political record. He was later admitted to the traditional Tibetan medical hospital for treatment.

Urgent appeals sent and replies received

123. On 27 January 1995 the Special Rapporteur sent an urgent appeal on behalf of Tong Yi, who was serving a sentence at the Hewan Labour Camp in Wuhan, Hubei province. She had allegedly been beaten on the face and body repeatedly on 16 January 1995 by two inmates or "trustees" who had been designated by the camp authorities to supervise other detainees. The beatings were reportedly inflicted after she had complained to labour camp authorities about her long hours of work, reportedly well in excess of the maximum of eight hours per day mandated by prison regulations. One day after she complained to camp officials about the beatings, more than 10 prisoners allegedly subjected her to another series of beatings, as a result of which her face and body were swollen and covered with bruises. Her parents were reportedly denied permission to see her and fears were expressed that she might be subjected to further ill-treatment.

124. On 25 February 1995 the Government replied that Tong Yi had not been beaten by other inmates or wardens, but rather a work-related quarrel had broken out between her and other members of her work team, which led to pushing and shoving. The incident ended when wardens appeared. Re-educatees at the camp worked only eight hours and the work was not strenuous.

125. In the above-mentioned letter of 14 July 1995, the Special Rapporteur apprised the Government of new information that he had received with respect to Tong Yi. The source of the information had reconfirmed the allegations with respect to her case and indicated they had also been confirmed by Tong Yi's relatives. A relative who visited her in prison observed bruising and other scarring on her face.

Replies received with respect to information contained in previous reports

126. On 28 November 1994 the Special Rapporteur transmitted an urgent appeal on behalf of Zhang Lin, a political activist detained at the Nanhu labour camp, who had allegedly been subjected to torture because he was unable to perform work for medical reasons. On 19 April 1995 the Government replied that Zhang Lin had spent six days at the local hospital in Nanhu and was diagnosed as suffering "mild neuralgia". He was prescribed abundant activity to improve his blood circulation and was accordingly assigned appropriate activities, such as work in the vegetable garden. After refusing to report for work, he was taken to Xuancheng district No. 2 hospital and the doctors diagnosed "mild inflammation of the peripheral nerves" and recommended activity and strengthening exercises and prescribed medication. Zhang had admitted that his allegations of mistreatment by wardens were designed to put pressure on the Government to release him. No incident such as that involving his alleged beating with electric prods had occurred.

127. On 30 November 1995 the Special Rapporteur sent an urgent appeal on behalf of journalist Gao Yu, who was allegedly being denied medication for heart disease in detention in Beijing. On 19 April 1995 the Government replied that, after entering Yanqing prison in Beijing to serve a sentence for disclosing State secrets, Gao Yu claimed to suffer from coronary heart disease, but a check-up at the prison found no such symptoms. She was found to have high blood pressure, but medication had been provided and she was now in normal health.

[dotcoma]

http://portland.indymedia.org/es/2003/12/277073.shtml


http://www.tibet.com/Women/twdiirrpt.html
" the arresting officers cut off one of her nipples "

[dotcoma]

Originally posted by castille, First, you say they broke his legs (which you now admit you lied about). Now you're saying they beat/starve people? Got any proof? With people like you I can see where the Irish get their racist rep. Hey try not to beat up any chinks and negros, ok?

This is slanderous. You're such a punk.

[castille]

Again, you are throwing more and more "evidence" at me to cover up your lie.

I'll ask again - where are your "thousand resources" (which you stated) to prove that you met this priest whose legs were removed by the Chinese government?


Your quote is below.

Originally posted by roxdog, Yes, I know. I've actually met a priest that had his legs, um, removed, by the Chinese govt...and It's not just the Walker Report, it's about a thousand other sources as well....