Tattoos

[Jack]

The Marines have been told that they cannot have tattoos on their arms and legs from this point on in a recent policy change. My late Dad, a former sailor and Marine, had tattoos from one end of his body to the other.

This recent fascination with tattoos interests me. They were popular in the 50s, the popularity wained from the 60s until quite recently.

So what's your take on tattoos? Are they body art or mutilation? Do they have meaning or are they simply decoration? Do they say anything about the maturity of the person sporting them? Are employers correct in not hiring people who have excessive tattoos for certain jobs?

[gw120]

I think it's wrong for the marines to discriminate against people with tattoos. We're in a war, a stupid war, but we're still in it. We need all the soldiers we can get, especially considering we're sending in an extra 20k troops. What the fuck does it matter what he/she wants to do to her body? Is the ink gonna mess up someone's gun? Is it gonna tell the enemy we're leaving soon? And why are they only not allowed to have them on their arms and legs? That makes no fucking sense. Like for some magical reason the tattoos on someone's chest or back don't do whatever the ones on the arms and legs do.

In reply to your questions, they're body art, calling it body mutilation is like calling abstract art bullshit. Some have meaning, some are just stupid, like if someone has say a picture of someone who's died than that's got meaning, a tribal tattoo around your wrist is just decoration, not that decoration's bad. They say little to nothing of the maturity of someone who sports them. And employers aren't right in not hiring them, unless they're like trying to get a job for Fox News and they're tattoo says "Fox Sucks" and it's somewhere highly visible, like their forehead.

[PatrickHenry]

Quote by: gw120 employers aren't right in not hiring them, unless they're like trying to get a job for Fox News and they're tattoo says "Fox Sucks" and it's somewhere highly visible, like their forehead.

I would like to tattoo "FOX sucks" on all their talking heads. Smirk.

[Jack]

How about the wanna-be gansta's who get teardrop tattoos? Would you feel comfortable being served your Big Mac by a guy who wants you to believe that he's killed someone?

[Gods_Mercenary]

No, and they are mutilation, granted, a self inflicted mutilation. Art? Maybe, but not art I have any interest viewing. I just don't see the justification for getting one, especially when people may pre-judge you.

[The Bacon Guy]

Quote by: gw And employers aren't right in not hiring them, unless they're like trying to get a job for Fox News and they're tattoo says "Fox Sucks" and it's somewhere highly visible, like their forehead.

Image is important in any business which involves customer service, and tattoos aren't conducive with a good image. Customers are turned off by them. Why should a company sacrifice profits for the sake of some guy's tattoo?

As for tattoos in general, I wouldn't get one. It's too permanent for someone like myself who doesn't like being tied down to anything unnecessarily. If you want one, go for it. I think they can look good on some people; it's just not my thing.

[G. Adams]

Didn't we thoroughly cover this before?

I think private employers have the right to discriminate on any grounds they wish, it's their business. If they lose the best employees or customers because of their practices are moronic, they lose out. When it comes to government employment, it's different. If they can justify these tattoo regulations, then so be it. However I don't see how they could. Tats on the arms and legs can be covered and won't be seen when in uniform, so I can't imagine their being a problem.

Your other questions; it is both art and mutilation. Any permanent disfigurement to the body is mutilation, but that doesn't deny it's artistic merit. It can have meaning, or it can be pure adornment, it all depends upon the person. My own tattoo is meaningful to me, and those who recognise it appreciate that meaning. Being inked doesn't tell you anything about the maturity of the individual, you would have to get to know the reasons behind the tattoo first before any such judgement could be made.

On on a personal note, I love tattoos and can't wait to afford another, since I've now got a personal reason to justify it (I get tattoos to mark moments in my life) and I know which one I want.

[Jack]

I'm glad to see that although I may have used language in the questions that could be perceived as judgmental, I wasn't myself trying to be so. But many of those who question the practice of tattooing do couch their opinions in judgmental terms, and those are the terms I was replicating.

Personally I consider some tattoos absolutely beautiful, some are too personal to judge while others are just plain ugly or too weird (many of dad's fell into the category).

What is your opinion on having significant other's names etched into your flesh? At what point in a relationship do you consider it safe to have a person's name hosted on your body? I think dad had several different women's names somewhere on him, and he had to frequently find a design that covered them fully so the next girl wouldn't get all bent.

[fushigi]

Quote by: Isherwood What is your opinion on having significant other's names etched into your flesh? At what point in a relationship do you consider it safe to have a person's name hosted on your body? I think dad had several different women's names somewhere on him, and he had to frequently find a design that covered them fully so the next girl wouldn't get all bent.

I think it's a damn stupid idea, and I bet your dad did the Homer Simpson forehead smack more than once when he and his special ladyfriend said sayonara.

I remember hearing that Johnny Depp had "Winona Forever" tattooed on his chest at one time; when their romance hit the skids he had to have it changed to "Wino Forever" with something (probably a bottle of blue label) covering the "ona" up.

My advice on tattoos - unless you're under 40 years old, get something that means absolutely nothing to you. There's no way anything completely meaningful to you at any younger age could possibly have the same meaning for you at 50 or 60, and it'll embarrass you when people ask you what it means.

I speak from experience, as a guy with a moiety knife from Riven tattooed on his leg. I was 20, what the hell did I know? I used to struggle to try and explain what it was to people, now I just say I don't know what it is - just a cool symbol (that's why I got it, anyway). That's much easier.

[G. Adams]

Quote by: Isherwood What is your opinion on having significant other's names etched into your flesh? At what point in a relationship do you consider it safe to have a person's name hosted on your body? I think dad had several different women's names somewhere on him, and he had to frequently find a design that covered them fully so the next girl wouldn't get all bent.

Just don't do it. Get something that represents them perhaps, like an animal or a symbol so theres no awkward questions in future relationships. Then, although you might change relationships, you can just have that symbol of a reminder of what must have, at some point, been an intense relationship. Or as a warning to not be a drunken eejit.

Quote by: fushigi My advice on tattoos - unless you're under 40 years old, get something that means absolutely nothing to you. There's no way anything completely meaningful to you at any younger age could possibly have the same meaning for you at 50 or 60, and it'll embarrass you when people ask you what it means

I disagree. Not everyone under 40 is so flakey and inconsistant that they change so much. It just requires plenty of forethought into getting one. It took me over a year of consideration on which one I wanted, looking into it's background, and then having a big moment in my life in which to have it commemorate as well as it's original symbolism.

[Osborn F Enready]

Like anything else, to be tattoed or not is a personal choice, and this is yet another example of over-reach by the powers that be to play god to those they have leverage on.

[CoffeeSaint]

I agree with Os. I wouldn't want anyone's name tattooed on me, not even my wife, who is the love of my life. But that's me; if someone else wants a name tattooed on, who am I to tell them it's a bad idea? Of all the stupid things people do to themselves, even all the body modifications people put themselves through, I think having "Betty Jane" somewhere on you is pretty minor. I have a bigger problem with people who give themselves giant ear-holes -- though again, that's just me. Tattoos are easy enough to cover up or remove, should your ideas about them change later on.

fushigi, I'm with you on choosing something "meaningful" when you are young; I got a tattoo when I was 17, and my girlfriend at the time got the same tattoo in the same place, because, y'know, we were going to be together forever and ever. Or until we broke up 6 months later. You know, either way is good. But I was lucky: we picked a tattoo that just looked cool, so I'm not ashamed of it now. Another friend who went with us got a tattoo he thought was very meaningful at the time: Tigger, holding a sunflower with a yin-yang in the middle. I bet he really regrets that now.

Ish, your dad shouldn't have tried to cover up the old women's names; he should have told the new woman that she would have to work hard to get into the Hall of Fame, so to speak. :)

[shawmutt]

I speak from experience, as a guy with a moiety knife from Riven tattooed on his leg. I was 20, what the hell did I know? I used to struggle to try and explain what it was to people, now I just say I don't know what it is - just a cool symbol (that's why I got it, anyway). That's much easier.

Same.



At 20, it was "well, you see dude, the dragon...right...well he's the most powerful beast I can think of...and...ok get this...blah blah yada yada."

At 30, (ok now 31 :()it's just something I saw on a book cover and said, "hey, that would look cool on my arm!"

Although one of my goals in life was to get a tattoo, and therefore it's important in that respect, the tat is just as much a part of me as my hand or foot--I don't think much about it, it's just there. Once the novelty wore off, it just wasn't as cool as I thought it would be.

[CoffeeSaint]

Quote by: shawmutt Same.

Is that dragon from the cover of The Hobbit?

[shawmutt]

Dragon Tears by Dean Koontz

[Marilyn Monroe]

Quote by: Gods_Mercenary No, and they are mutilation, granted, a self inflicted mutilation. Art? Maybe, but not art I have any interest viewing. I just don't see the justification for getting one, especially when people may pre-judge you.

They are all pretty much dog-ugly to me. They look like cartoons on the skin, unfortunately they are permanent. They aren't art, they are copies of drawings that look like crap. Real art is on canvas, and can be purchased and hung on a wall.

[Gods_Mercenary]

I agree if you take it from a pre fab drawing and copy it, then it's not art, but if you do it free style or of your own invention, maybe.

[CoffeeSaint]

My wife drew both of her own tattoos (a seahorse and a Chinese-style dragon). She's an artist, and those tattoos are art. Admittedly, her drawings on paper look better, but there are always limitations in the medium; the fact that these drawings are literally alive, since they are fixed onto living flesh, gives them something that paper art can never have.

[fushigi]

Quote by: CoffeeSaint Another friend who went with us got a tattoo he thought was very meaningful at the time: Tigger, holding a sunflower with a yin-yang in the middle. I bet he really regrets that now.

Heh, he surely does, unless he had it covered up already.

Had a buddy in college who got a tattoo on his inner thigh of Thumper from Bambi ejaculating.

Actually that guy was frigging nuts so I doubt he's even alive now to regret it.

[fushigi]

Stuff in foreign languages is cool too - but make damn sure it's right first. When I was in New Orleans and just starting to study Chinese characters, I found that 1/3 of the tattoos I saw using them were incorrect. Even backwards. Can you imagine how comedic that must be for Chinese?

Thai and Sanskrit both look pretty awesome too, and you don't have to worry about the tat looking "cartoonish."