Mexico Demands U.S. Allow More Immigration

[Disinterested]

Mexico Demands U.S. Allow More Immigration By MARK STEVENSON, Associated Press Writer
Tue Jan 10, 2:09 AM ET

MEXICO CITY - Diplomats from Mexico and Central America on Monday demanded guest worker programs and the legalization of undocumented migrants in the United States, while criticizing a U.S. proposal for tougher border enforcement.

Meeting in Mexico's capital, the regional officials pledged to do more to fight migrant trafficking, but indirectly condemned a U.S. bill that would make illegal entry a felony and extend border walls.

"Migrants, regardless of their migratory status, should not be treated like criminals," they said.

The countries represented at the meeting — including Mexico, Nicaragua, Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras, Belize and Panama — created a working group to design a regional policy to avoid migrant abuse and to follow the course of the legislation.

"There has to be an integrated reform that includes a temporary worker program, but also the regularization of those people who are already living in receptor countries," Mexican Foreign Relations Secretary Luis Ernesto Derbez said.

Derbez has called the measure — which passed the U.S. House of Representatives last month but still must go before the Senate — "stupid and underhanded," but was somewhat more restrained on Monday, saying "it's not the Mexican government's position to tell the U.S. Senate what to do."

The U.S. proposal has caused widespread resentment in Mexico, where some have accused President Vicente Fox's administration of not being assertive enough in opposing it. Fox has called the bill shameful.

Mexicans working in the United States are a huge source of revenue for Mexico, sending home more than $16 billion in remittances in 2004, Mexico's second largest source of foreign currency after oil exports according to the country's central bank.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060110/...BhBHNlYwM5NjQ-

[Matt W]

I'd agree that the USA needs to think seriously about a 'Guest Worker' Visa, or even a 'Working Holiday' visa. The rest...well. Up to the American public, really, but I do think a nation of immigrants being 'tough on immigration' is somewhat ridiculous.

[Apeman81]

This "nation of Immigrants", as a sovereign nation, has the right and the responsibility to control the flow of incoming peoples to this nation. Even the strongest, largest economy in the world cannot support an unchecked increase of illegal aliens draining the economy, either by siphoning wealth off to foreign lands, or by not paying taxes on their earnings.

Guest worker program? At least that would serve to solve the tax losses.

[Disinterested]

Please quantify how illegal aliens are "draining the economy." No blabbing allowed. I'd like to see quantifiable statistics that may be independently verified and their sources for your claim. Thank you.

[tinybear]

I can't see why Mexico has a right to demand anything, can you? Nor do they need to since their citizens simply walk across the border as things now stand.

[Disinterested]

Mexico's economy would disintegrate without remittances from Mexicans working in the U.S. Despite claims to the contrary, the great majority of illegal aliens come here to work and remit a large amount of their pay back to their struggling families in Mexico. Also despite claims to the contrary, places like las vegas would grind to a screeching halt without illegal labor.

[tinybear]

The law needs to be enforced. So either make then legal or deport them. Without enforcement, the law is nothing but a joke!

[Mr.Vicchio]

The answer can be found in the $$ trail. What is the second largest source of income in Mexico? Yeah, money coming from workers in the USA sending it back to Mexico.

[Disinterested]

Many laws are broken every day, even by our most upstanding all-american citizens no less. How laws are enforced is generally arbitrary and usually determined more by socio-economics and race rather than fairness and justice for all.

[Protostar]

Quote by: Disinterested Mexico's economy would disintegrate without remittances from Mexicans working in the U.S. Despite claims to the contrary, the great majority of illegal aliens come here to work and remit a large amount of their pay back to their struggling families in Mexico. Also despite claims to the contrary, places like las vegas would grind to a screeching halt without illegal labor.

Why should we care about Mexico's economy? If it fails, that's their problem not ours. I have no problem with immigrants so long as they come here legally. Otherwise, they are just criminals as far as I am concerned. I think we should have FAR stricter border regulations. I am in favor of building a wall across the Mexican border. Hell if the Chinese can do it, why can't we? Futhermore, illegal immigrants drain tax dollars because we educate their children (ideally, the children of illegal immigrants born here would still be illegal) and give them medical assistance (again, ideally hospitals would be able to turn away those who are unable to pay, virtually eliminating this problem).

[Disinterested]

What part of Las Vegas' economy would grind to a halt didn't you understand? Entire sectors of U.S. industry including but not limited to the following would severely suffer without illegal mexican labor:

--Agriculture
--Cleaning
--Services
--Restaurants
--Construction
--Landscaping

If there were no need, there would be no immigration. And, I don't want to hear the argument that illegal mexicans are willing to work for less than americans. So what? That's an economic law of supply and demand at work. The reality is that most illegals are here to provide a better life for their families and within one to two generations their children and their children's children contribute greatly to the GDP of the United States. It's the way it's always been in this country and it's the primary reason why the U.S. has remained an economic powerhouse for so long.

[lili462]

They don't have the right to demand anything, they aren't even apart of this country. Mexico is like an annoying neighbor that knocks on our door constantly asking to borrow something. Just because they are our neighbor doesn't mean they can just demand stuff from us...Does Canada make demands for us? Do we have loads of Canadians crossing the boarder everyday illegally? Working illegally in the United States? If we do, then i never heard of it. Instead of relying on the States so much, mexico needs to do something themselves about there countrys economy, apparently that is the problem or else they wouldn't be coming here and looking for work. Unless some people have failed to notice, we have plenty of real american citizens that need jobs. It makes me sick that illegal aliens have jobs in our country and some of our real citizens go without....What a ****ed up system eh?

[Protostar]

Quote by: Disinterested What part of Las Vegas' economy would grind to a halt didn't you understand?

Do I live in Las Vegas? Why would that matter to me?

Quote by: Disinterested Entire sectors of U.S. industry including but not limited to the following would severely suffer without illegal mexican labor: --Agriculture --Cleaning --Services --Restaurants --Construction --Landscaping

Too bad. They would either adapt or fail. I see no reason to bend the laws just to appease businesses. If we got rid of all the socialist regulations in place, that would help small businesses, but the socialists will never understand this.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Will Mexico allow Americans to own property in Mexico? No. So its all about One Way sovereignity. They want to re-populate Aztlan, but will not give up a square inch in return.

[Disinterested]

So the U.S. should do things that shoot themselves in the foot because other nations do things that shoot themselves in the foot. That makes sense. Did you know that although Mexico sits on some of the world's largest oil deposits, they cannot get them out of the ground because Mexican law states that their can be no foreign firms in the oil industry in Mexico? The state controlled firm Pemex has a monopoly on all things oil. Furthermore, no Mexican oil can be exported since it's a "strategic resource." This combination of not allowing foreign expertise and capital into Mexico to get the oil out of the ground, refine it, and distribute it is killing their economy never mind their inability to export it and make a killing.

Protectionism is a bad, bad thing for everyone involved.

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: Disinterested What part of Las Vegas' economy would grind to a halt didn't you understand? Entire sectors of U.S. industry including but not limited to the following would severely suffer without illegal mexican labor: --Agriculture --Cleaning --Services --Restaurants --Construction --Landscaping

Please quantify how "Las Vegas' economy would grind to a halt ." No blabbing allowed. I'd like to see quantifiable statistics that may be independently verified and their sources for your claim. Thank you.

[Disinterested]

Here you go:

RENO GAZETTE-JOURNAL: Nevada businesses, unions team up for immigration reform
Doug Abrahms (online@rgj.com)
GANNETT NEWS SERVICE
October 29, 2005

WASHINGTON -- Nevada businesses and some labor unions have forged an unlikely alliance to push immigration reform that would legalize most of the estimated 11 million illegal immigrants living in the United States and expand a guest worker program.

Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid recently brought together the state's largest union and the Las Vegas Chamber of Commerce to support legislation by Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., that calls for providing legal status and tightening border control.

Businesses, especially in Las Vegas, are backing the measure because they see a vast need for workers in the construction, casino and restaurant industries.

MGM Mirage has 2,500 job openings in its hotels and casinos nationwide, although most are in Las Vegas, said Jovita Thomas-Williams, vice president of labor relations.

"We're trying to fill jobs," she said. "It's tough all over the country, but particularly in Las Vegas."

In Northern Nevada, where the labor market isn't as tight as it is in Las Vegas, immigration reform is not as big an issue.

But Luther Mack, who owns 10 McDonald's restaurants in the Reno area, said he would have a harder time recruiting workers if a law was passed to curtail the number of illegal immigrants in the area.

"Without the foreign workers in the food service industry, you probably wouldn't have any workers," Mack said.

Michael Lynch, who heads the Builders Association of Northern Nevada, said the area's construction companies have been able to find enough workers. The industry continues to fill its ranks by promoting jobs in the trades through schools as a way to make a good living, he said.

In Las Vegas, the issue is more pressing because of the area's stunning growth. About 80,000 jobs were created in the region between August 2004 and August this year, said Christina Dugan, a Las Vegas chamber spokeswoman.

The Culinary Workers Union, the big union that represents most of the workers in Las Vegas casinos, also supports McCain's legislation, co-sponsored by Sen. Edward Kennedy, D-Mass., because it would provide legal status for some of its members and make family reunification easier, said D. Taylor, secretary treasurer of Local 226 in Las Vegas.

The McCain-Kennedy bill would require illegal immigrants to pay a fine, go through background checks and wait six years before being able to get permanent legal status.

"This is a very big issue for our union," Taylor said. "It's pretty strange to have the culinary union having a news conference with the chamber."

This alliance in Nevada mirrors the national scene, where the U.S. Chamber of Commerce is working with the Service Employees International Union to push through comprehensive immigration reform that includes legal status for people working in the U.S. illegally and expanding guest worker programs.

Business and labor leaders say the alliance reflects the growing numbers of illegal immigrants in the U.S. work force and their value to certain industries.

The McCain-Kennedy bill is among several immigration reform proposals circulating on Capitol Hill. President Bush has endorsed the concept of a guest worker program that allows illegal immigrants to remain in the U.S. for up to six years before returning home, although details remain sketchy.

But conservative GOP lawmakers are cool to the idea. Several GOP House members have endorsed a bill by U.S. Rep. J.D. Hayworth, R-Ariz., to increase fines on illegal immigrants and U.S. companies that hire them. It also calls for hiring 10,000 Homeland Security Department agents to oversee workplace enforcement. A bill by U.S. Sens. John Cornyn, R-Texas, and Jon Kyl, R-Ariz., would require illegal immigrants to return home within five years and then apply for legal status.

Many immigrants simply want to work in the U.S. and then go home with money they've earned and skills they've learned, Cornyn said last week. His bill was "based on a work-and-return program, not a work-and-stay program," he said.

Reid said enforcement-only immigration bills won't work. He said a more comprehensive plan like the McCain bill is needed.

"We do need to stop illegal immigration," he said. "But stopping illegal immigration doesn't take care of our problems."

Reid supports allowing illegal immigrants who pay a fine and pass a background check to stay in the U.S. But he says they deserve no preference when applying for permanent legal status. He also supports beefing up border security for economic and national security reasons.

HIGHLIGHTS OF MCCAIN-KENNEDY BILL

Illegal immigrants: Would require a $1,000 fine, background checks and evidence of employment. Work permits would be valid for six years, during which time workers could switch jobs and travel abroad.

Border enforcement: Would require evaluation of border enforcement strategy, the use of aerial surveillance and the manner in which Central American gangs are tracked, with more cooperation among states and foreign governments.

Home country obligations: Would encourage foreign countries to enter into immigration agreements with the United States to help control the flow of immigrants and encourage repatriation.

Other features: The bill would boost the number of work and family visas, make it easier for immigrants with work visas to earn green cards and call for harsher fines on employers who hire large numbers of illegal immigrants.
Highlights of Cornyn-Kyl bill

Treatment of current illegal immigrants: Would require a $1,000 fine, background checks and evidence of employment in the United States for at least a year. An immigrant could work for up to five years but then must return to his or her home country. A worker who loses a job would have 30 days to find a new one or must return home.

Border enforcement: Would speed deportation of illegal immigrants, set up mandatory bond minimums for illegal immigrants from Central America, authorize 10,000 new U.S. Border Patrol agents and 1,250 Customs and Border Protection officers, increase detention capacity by 10,000 beds and authorize more immigration judges.

Home country obligations: Would require bilateral agreements with countries before their citizens could participate in work visa programs. These countries would agree to accept its nationals within three days after deportation, would work with U.S. officials to control illegal immigration and smuggling and provide the U.S. government with data on foreign citizens' travel.

Other features: The bill would require immigrants with work visas to leave the United States to change citizenship status, would limit court reviews of immigration cases and would impose harsher penalties on immigrants who overstay their visas.

ON THE WEB:

http://www.uschamber.com, U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
http://www.culinaryunion226.org, Culinary Workers Union Local 226.
http://reid.senate.gov, Sen. Harry Reid.
http://www.cis.org, Center for Immigration Studies.
http://www.immigrationforum.org, National Immigration Forum.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Disinterested This combination of not allowing foreign expertise and capital into Mexico to get the oil out of the ground, refine it, and distribute it is killing their economy never mind their inability to export it and make a killing.

Are you saying there are no Mexicans smart enough to poke a hole in the ground? You underestimate them. They are doing what China is doing. Waiting us out. They will have leverage when we run out, because they are not in the same mad rush to exhaust our non-renewable resource. Its strategy, not stupidity.

[Apeman81]

Quote by: Disinterested What part of Las Vegas' economy would grind to a halt didn't you understand? Entire sectors of U.S. industry including but not limited to the following would severely suffer without illegal mexican labor: --Agriculture --Cleaning --Services --Restaurants --Construction --Landscaping If there were no need, there would be no immigration. And, I don't want to hear the argument that illegal mexicans are willing to work for less than americans. So what? That's an economic law of supply and demand at work. The reality is that most illegals are here to provide a better life for their families and within one to two generations their children and their children's children contribute greatly to the GDP of the United States. It's the way it's always been in this country and it's the primary reason why the U.S. has remained an economic powerhouse for so long.

Unless the United States were able to, a) stop all future illegal immigration, b) find and deport every illegal alien currently performing the jobs related to the industries you mentioned at one time, and c) stopped all legal immigration of people who would be willing to take the place of the removed illegal aliens, your dire assertion of “grinding to a halt” would not come to pass.

Many other nations are perfectly capable of running an economy without the huge influx of illegal workers. Automation and modernization, especially in the area of agriculture, have not been adapted in the United States as they have not been required. Cheap labor allows for a lowered investment in expensive machinery.

Legal workers would be as willing to “to provide a better life for their families.” In so doing, the tax drain would be eliminated.

Sir, the plain truth is that Mexico is turning a blind eye to the illegal traffic of law breakers and international border scoffers to enter the U.S. because the Mexican Government has not incentive of doing otherwise. The corruption inherent to its government along with the highly stratified wealth distribution means that each border crosser leaving Mexico is an automatic betterment to the Mexican economy.

Let us not confuse the issue. The question is not one of immigration, but of illegal immigration. The flow of wealth from our nation as well as the lack of taxation of wages to illegal immigrants draws from our economy.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Disinterested doesn't undestand the concept of Capitalism. :OMG with no illegals there will be no one to work!"

No, what would happen is that the business would have to pay more to entice American's to do the job. Example, New Orleans, Several Fast Food resturants have been offering, hold yourself for this one, signing bonuses for people to work for them.

It's how the system works, if you can hire a person to work for 4 dollars an hour you do it. If you can't get anyone for 4 dollars and hour you are forced to either close your business or raise wages to attract employees.

I think Disinterested has illiegals working for him and doesn't want to pay people more.