Report: Bush eased domestic spy rules after 9/11

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: ericsp23 I watched a bit of Bush's speech this morning, and at one point he said that Article 2 of the Constitution gave him authority to do this. .

I think there is a much simpler answer. When he says, "Article 2 of the Constitution gives me that responsibility and the authority necessary to fulfill it." he might be counting on the fact that most Americans don't have a clue as to just what Article 2 actually IS and they just assume because Bush knows it he must be right.

[RickSp]

Quote by: Scribbler1 I think there is a much simpler answer. When he says, "Article 2 of the Constitution gives me that responsibility and the authority necessary to fulfill it." he might be counting on the fact that most Americans don't have a clue as to just what Article 2 actually IS and they just assume because Bush knows it he must be right.

Bush is effectively claiming that Article II gives him dictatorial powers. It doesn't.

I would be very interested if any of the Bushbots would care to point out where in Article II these alleged power might be enumerated. I presume that they would refer to Article II, Section 2.

Section 2. The President shall be commander in chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the militia of the several states, when called into the actual service of the United States; he may require the opinion, in writing, of the principal officer in each of the executive departments, upon any subject relating to the duties of their respective offices, and he shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment.

None of which supercedes the Fourth Amendment, which Bush has clearly violated:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Personally I think we should indeed be focussing on Article II of the Constitution, specifically on Section 4:

Section 4. The President, Vice President and all civil officers of the United States, shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors.

So come all you loyal Bush supporters, where exactly in the Constitution does it say that illegal wiretaps are just fine and dandy?

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: RickSp Bush is effectively claiming that Article II gives him dictatorial powers. It doesn't.

And my point was most people don't know what Article 2 IS and they are not likely to look it up so when Bush mentions it they assume he must be right. After all, since the President knows what the section IS he must logically know what he can't do under it.

It's a matter of faith, something the majority of people in this country have a surplus of, as opposed to intelligence.

[Milton Bradley]

Quote by: Scribbler1 It's a matter of faith, something the majority of people in this country have a surplus of, as opposed to intelligence.

Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner. Tell him what he's won Johnny...

[Apeman81]

I sincerely hope that you here on this board, and especially the democrat leadership, continue to focus their attention on attempting, by any means, to search desperately for any chink in Bush’s legal armor.

I want you all to bleat and mewl about how “Bush lied” about the same Intel that congressional democrats like John Kerry read. I hope you keep up the din about Bush’s “Illegal” wiretapping. The Part about U.S. citizens is a nice, if not accurate, touch. The fact that leading Democrat Senators like Rockefeller knew about, and did nothing about it for years, is a bonus for me.

You see, Bush is never going to run for president again. Never. But Kerry wants to. And won’t his speeches about Saddam’s WMDs just be a gas to playback? And what kind of answers will Rockefeller provide we he’s asked about having written about his misgivings of the wiretapping while doing absolutely nothing to follow up on them.

Ride Bush like he was wearing a saddle. Continue to ignore any progress in Iraq. Continue to call it an illegal war. I mean, after all, no leading Dem did anything to stop it. Oh, some whined and mewled about it, but when given the chance to vote to pull out our troops from Bush’s illegal war, they voted to allow it to continue.

So please. Concentrate on Bush. Continue to spread demonstrable half-truths and make groundless assertions of criminal acts. Really, the American people will always side with those that make accusations they can’t back up. They love hearing about purported criminal activity that slowly dies away as nothing sticks.

Keep up the good work. I’ll sit back and watch as the current democrat leadership moves the party further and further into obscurity. Maybe then the old democrat values will resurface. But I doubt it.

[Matt W]

Have you anything on-topic to add, Apeman81?

[Apeman81]

Quote by: Matt W Have you anything on-topic to add, Apeman81?

See #20 and 21. This is a conclusion to those posts. Too many here simply parrot what some democrat operatives release to the fawning press. Just trying to open some eys and free them to think for themselves.

[Clarence]

Quote by: Apeman81 I sincerely hope that you here on this board, and especially the democrat leadership, continue to focus their attention on attempting, by any means, to search desperately for any chink in Bush’s legal armor.

Hah, he's gonna need some armor. Maybe he should get O.J.'s lawyers

I want you all to bleat and mewl about how “Bush lied” about the same Intel that congressional democrats like John Kerry read.

you're right, he did provide congress with misleading and even false intel. Some of it obtained through rendidtion. Wery noble of you to point out.

I hope you keep up the din about Bush’s “Illegal” wiretapping.

I do too.

The Part about U.S. citizens is a nice, if not accurate, touch. The fact that leading Democrat Senators like Rockefeller knew about, and did nothing about it for years, is a bonus for me.

They didn't know much and we knew nothing. They're trying to do something now though, and you're scared.

You see, Bush is never going to run for president again. Never. But Kerry wants to.

Kerry won't make it past the primaries and Bush will spend the next presidential term defending himself in court if there's any justice left in the land of the free.

And what kind of answers will Rockefeller provide we he’s asked about having written about his misgivings of the wiretapping while doing absolutely nothing to follow up on them.

Maybe he knew that there would be a massive spin campaign and he didn't want to give Rush and O'reilly time to think it up. As it stands, You're defense is weak and ill-natured.

Ride Bush like he was wearing a saddle. Continue to ignore any progress in Iraq.

At least the Iraqis are voting. That wasn't a stated reason for war in 2003.

Continue to call it an illegal war. I mean, after all, no leading Dem did anything to stop it.

Some did, but were accused of being unpatriotic. Alot of congressmen gave Bush the benefit of the doubt and now it's used against them.

Oh, some whined and mewled about it, but when given the chance to vote to pull out our troops from Bush’s illegal war, they voted to allow it to continue.

that was a stunt. Hardly anybody wants to pull out today. That would be cruel to the Iraqis and irresponsible of Americans considering it is our President doing this.

Really, the American people will always side with those that make accusations they can’t back up. They love hearing about purported criminal activity that slowly dies away as nothing sticks.

That's a very un-american speach. I'll remember that. You're no Patriot. You hate America.

Keep up the good work. I’ll sit back and watch as the current democrat leadership moves the party further and further into obscurity. Maybe then the old democrat values will resurface. But I doubt it.

You keep sitting back, toadie. Good people will stand up and kick the chair out from under your ass. Anti-constitution=Anti-american.

[rmnunez]

Senate extends PATRIOT Act 6 months:

The US Senate on Wednesday ended a high-stakes impasse and voted to extend for six months key provisions of the anti-terrorism USA Patriot Act set to expire in 10 days. The temporary extension, approved without dissent, would provide time to try to resolve differences over safeguards for civil liberties before making permanent most of the provisions the Bush administration deems vital in its war on terrorism. http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr...TY-PATRIOT.xml

But they approved McCain's amendment to curtail torture:

Bush finally was forced to accept the amendment pushed by Arizona Republican Sen. John McCain after Senate and House votes showed overwhelming support for it in the wake of scandals over abuse of detainees at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq, harsh interrogations at the US prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and reports the CIA ran secret prisons abroad to hold terrorism suspects. In a concession to the White House, the defense policy bill curbs the ability of inmates at Guantanamo to challenge their detention in federal court. It also lets information gleaned by coercion be used against Guantanamo inmates. http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr...TY-TORTURE.xml

[Clarence]

Quote by: rmnunez >> The temporary extension, approved without dissent, would provide time to try to resolve differences over safeguards for civil liberties before making permanent most of the provisions the Bush administration deems vital in its war on terrorism. http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr...TY-PATRIOT.xml

Democracy at its best. I wish the procedings were more transparent to you and me. But then that would be aiding the terrorists. :rolleyes:

[gr8fuldaniel]

Now that the cats out of the bag, this figurehead is gonna cut and run. No need for justices when the whole damned court is bypassed.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...122000685.html

Spy Court Judge Quits In Protest Jurist Concerned Bush Order Tainted Work of Secret Panel By Carol D. Leonnig and Dafna Linzer Washington Post Staff Writers Wednesday, December 21, 2005; Page A01 A federal judge has resigned from the court that oversees government surveillance in intelligence cases in protest of President Bush's secret authorization of a domestic spying program, according to two sources. U.S. District Judge James Robertson, one of 11 members of the secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court, sent a letter to Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. late Monday notifying him of his resignation without providing an explanation.

[rmnunez]

I think a few here who see things so clearly, might appreciate intelligent and educated legislators who are better informed and have been briefed on the relevant issues, found they could need 6 months to "resolve differences over safeguards for civil liberties". It cannot be that clear the PATRIOT Act is a tool a Bushian 'junta' is using to usurp atributes and impose some new repressive regime across the US.