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**Sean** · Oct 10, 2005, 09:43 am

http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/eu...lks/index.html

Quote:

Conservative leader Angela Merkel says she will become Germany's first woman chancellor under a deal with Gerhard Schroeder's Social Democrats.

The deal, which ends Schroeder's seven years in office, breaks a three-week deadlock that started when voters gave Merkel's conservatives a narrow victory but not the majority needed to form a center-right government.

Instead, the two leaders' parties will form a "grand coalition" that bridges the country's right-left split.

Speaking at a news conference Monday, Merkel called the deal "good and fair" and said the parties agreed that "there is no alternative to a reform course" for Germany.

The two parties were "obliged to be successful," she said, expressing confidence she would find agreement on a common foreign policy with the Social Democrats.

She also said establishing good relations with the United States was "an important task."

"We have unanimously agreed that we will start coalition negotiations with the SPD aimed at creating a grand coalition," Merkel told reporters.

"The conservatives will occupy the chancellery. The conservatives and SPD will be represented equally in the Cabinet with ministers. That means it is not possible that the one outvotes the other."

Merkel said her party, the Christian Democrats, and their Bavarian sister party, the Christian Social Union, would have six seats in the new Cabinet in addition to the chancellery, with Schroeder's SPD getting eight seats.

Under the deal, the SPD would head the foreign, finance, labor, justice, health, transport, environment and development ministries, The Associated Press reported.

Nono · Oct 10, 2005, 10:02 am

Schröder sure made her sweat for it. :)
I wonder whether he'll accept a ministerial portfolio. One wonders whether his ego could allow him to play second fiddle.

One also wonders how long the "grand coalition" will last. There is only one previous example of such a coalition in post-war German history: in the late 1960s. It lasted three years, but then that was a time of far greater national consensus than exists today.

tinybear · Oct 10, 2005, 01:51 pm

Grand coalitions don't last very long. Still, it's good news for the USA. :)

rcne · Oct 10, 2005, 03:10 pm

A conservative in Germany (though with odd alliances), and it looks as if Poland will soon join the conservative nation ranks. Whoo-hoo

.

Nono · Oct 11, 2005, 03:44 am

Quote:

Quote by: rcne

Whoo-hoo

In the recent Polish elections they threw out the previous neo-communist government, which wouldn't have been there to throw out had it not been elected the last time. A swing to the right means there was a swing to the left in a previous election, and a swing to the left is possible only if the right is in power. Etc.

Last month Norwegian voters threw out the right-wing government there and elected the Labour leader -- who had already been prime minister in 2000-2001.

I'd calm down in the face of all these "trends". That's politics.

Nono · Oct 11, 2005, 04:00 am

By the way, Schröder himself will not have a post in the new government -- not surprising -- but the SPD will hold key cabinet posts: finance, foreign affairs, justice, transport, health, and labour.

Nono · Oct 18, 2005, 08:26 am

The Bundestag convened today. Why? Because the German constitution requires it to do so at the latest 30 days after the election. Only thing is, there's no government for it to deal with: Merkel's still trying to knock together a "Grand Coalition", and hopes to have done so by 12 November...

I have to say she's not looking very cosy in the saddle. At a news conference last week a female reporter asked her in a concerned tone of voice "How are you doing?" Oh I'm fine, just fine, she replied. Yet the knives are definitely out for her, and not just on the left -- also inside her own party, which she led to a miserable election result.

So for the moment Schröder's still sitting in the chancellor's office, the most serene figure imaginable. :)

Nono · Nov 10, 2005, 11:53 am

Been a tough coupla months for "Maggie" Merkel what with her razor-thin edge over a supremely smirking Schröder and the knives out for her in her own party, not to mention the defection from her prospective cabinet of Christian Democrat supremo Edmund Stoiber. But it looks like a coalition government will be formed by this weekend, though it'll be a watered-down compromise in terms of policy. The Christian Democrats will get their raised value-added tax, but that's about it.

So much for the Germans having 'seen the light' of the fantastic virtues of lean'n'mean freemarketeerism.

Nono · Nov 12, 2005, 02:33 pm

OK, the deal is done.

I just saw an hour-long interview with Lothar de Maizière (you may remember him, goateed little Christian Democrat dweebster who was the first, and last, democratically elected leader of East Germany, and the one who 'discovered' Merkel and plucked her out of nowhere way back when). He's a pretty conservative guy by European standards, but if he were a politician in the US he'd be classified as an absolute leftist. Hell, he even advocates a just distribution of wealth in society and reminds us that there are more important things than supply and demand. My, how things are relative!

Nono · Nov 26, 2005, 04:13 pm

Well, Angela (Maggie) Merkel has been chancellor for a few days now. It's more of an arranged marriage than one based on romantic love, but that's politics.

And practically the first public act of her chancellorship (warmly welcomed by US rightists on this board as America-friendly) was to have her foreign minister remind the United States that even it has to obey the law, and to stop the practice of routing "illegal combatants" through Rhein-Main airbase.

tinybear · Nov 26, 2005, 10:56 pm

I think she needs a facial. What do you think?

Nono · Nov 27, 2005, 05:27 am

I think you tried asking that same question a little while back, but no one saw fit to dignify it with an answer. However, dogged persistence should be rewarded.

So I think she looks just fine as she is -- rather sweet actually.

tinybear · Nov 27, 2005, 01:12 pm

You reckon?

**Matt W** · Nov 27, 2005, 06:33 pm

I reckon you should try and add something of substance, tb.

shield772 · Nov 27, 2005, 06:52 pm

I think she will be good for Germany and will make Germany a better ally for the USA

Nono · Nov 28, 2005, 10:39 am

Well shield, if the first thing she has to do is tell the US to mind its manners and respect German law, it ain't an auspicious start.

tinybear · Nov 28, 2005, 11:59 am

Quote:

Quote by: Matt W

I reckon you should try and add something of substance, tb.

Matt, a woman's face is her fortune. My suggestion has a lot of substance in it. Hey, look, if the woman doesn't polish up her looks she'll not be Chancellor for long. Mark my words.

**Pooeypants** · Nov 28, 2005, 02:07 pm

Quote:

Quote by: tinybear

Matt, a woman's face is her fortune. My suggestion has a lot of substance in it. Hey, look, if the woman doesn't polish up her looks she'll not be Chancellor for long. Mark my words.

Do you realise how many years Maggie Thatcher was in power for?

**Matt W** · Nov 28, 2005, 02:28 pm

No, she's being deliberately ignorant. Again.

Nono · Nov 29, 2005, 05:21 am

What?! Thatcher was a woman? I thought she was Mussolini in drag.

Oct 10, 2005, 10:02 am	#2 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	Schröder sure made her sweat for it. :) I wonder whether he'll accept a ministerial portfolio. One wonders whether his ego could allow him to play second fiddle. One also wonders how long the "grand coalition" will last. There is only one previous example of such a coalition in post-war German history: in the late 1960s. It lasted three years, but then that was a time of far greater national consensus than exists today. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Oct 10, 2005, 03:10 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
rcne Moderator/nobody Posts: 1,566	A conservative in Germany (though with odd alliances), and it looks as if Poland will soon join the conservative nation ranks. Whoo-hoo . Live Long and Prosper (Genetics and Capitalism)

Oct 11, 2005, 04:00 am	#6 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	By the way, Schröder himself will not have a post in the new government -- not surprising -- but the SPD will hold key cabinet posts: finance, foreign affairs, justice, transport, health, and labour. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Oct 18, 2005, 08:26 am	#7 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	The Bundestag convened today. Why? Because the German constitution requires it to do so at the latest 30 days after the election. Only thing is, there's no government for it to deal with: Merkel's still trying to knock together a "Grand Coalition", and hopes to have done so by 12 November... I have to say she's not looking very cosy in the saddle. At a news conference last week a female reporter asked her in a concerned tone of voice "How are you doing?" Oh I'm fine, just fine, she replied. Yet the knives are definitely out for her, and not just on the left -- also inside her own party, which she led to a miserable election result. So for the moment Schröder's still sitting in the chancellor's office, the most serene figure imaginable. :) "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Nov 10, 2005, 11:53 am	#8 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	Been a tough coupla months for "Maggie" Merkel what with her razor-thin edge over a supremely smirking Schröder and the knives out for her in her own party, not to mention the defection from her prospective cabinet of Christian Democrat supremo Edmund Stoiber. But it looks like a coalition government will be formed by this weekend, though it'll be a watered-down compromise in terms of policy. The Christian Democrats will get their raised value-added tax, but that's about it. So much for the Germans having 'seen the light' of the fantastic virtues of lean'n'mean freemarketeerism. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Oct 10, 2005, 01:51 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
tinybear Volcanic Erupter Location: Hong Kong (for now) Posts: 7,016	Grand coalitions don't last very long. Still, it's good news for the USA. :)

Nov 12, 2005, 02:33 pm	#9 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	OK, the deal is done. I just saw an hour-long interview with Lothar de Maizière (you may remember him, goateed little Christian Democrat dweebster who was the first, and last, democratically elected leader of East Germany, and the one who 'discovered' Merkel and plucked her out of nowhere way back when). He's a pretty conservative guy by European standards, but if he were a politician in the US he'd be classified as an absolute leftist. Hell, he even advocates a just distribution of wealth in society and reminds us that there are more important things than supply and demand. My, how things are relative! "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Nov 26, 2005, 04:13 pm	#10 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	Well, Angela (Maggie) Merkel has been chancellor for a few days now. It's more of an arranged marriage than one based on romantic love, but that's politics. And practically the first public act of her chancellorship (warmly welcomed by US rightists on this board as America-friendly) was to have her foreign minister remind the United States that even it has to obey the law, and to stop the practice of routing "illegal combatants" through Rhein-Main airbase. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Nov 26, 2005, 10:56 pm	#11 (permalink) (top)
tinybear Volcanic Erupter Location: Hong Kong (for now) Posts: 7,016	I think she needs a facial. What do you think?

Nov 27, 2005, 05:27 am	#12 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	I think you tried asking that same question a little while back, but no one saw fit to dignify it with an answer. However, dogged persistence should be rewarded. So I think she looks just fine as she is -- rather sweet actually. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Nov 27, 2005, 01:12 pm	#13 (permalink) (top)
tinybear Volcanic Erupter Location: Hong Kong (for now) Posts: 7,016	You reckon?

Nov 27, 2005, 06:33 pm	#14 (permalink) (top)
Matt W Moderator Location: Reading, UK. Posts: 6,384	I reckon you should try and add something of substance, tb. I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered. -George Best, on being asked what he did with his footballing fortunes.

Nov 27, 2005, 06:52 pm	#15 (permalink) (top)
shield772 68 Dead LEO's in 08 Location: Washington, WV Posts: 1,757	I think she will be good for Germany and will make Germany a better ally for the USA Republican Liberty Caucus Moderate Republican Officer Down Memorial Page

Nov 28, 2005, 10:39 am	#16 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	Well shield, if the first thing she has to do is tell the US to mind its manners and respect German law, it ain't an auspicious start. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne

Nov 28, 2005, 02:28 pm	#19 (permalink) (top)
Matt W Moderator Location: Reading, UK. Posts: 6,384	No, she's being deliberately ignorant. Again. I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered. -George Best, on being asked what he did with his footballing fortunes.

Nov 29, 2005, 05:21 am	#20 (permalink) (top)
Nono Throbbing Member Location: Old Europe Posts: 6,930	What?! Thatcher was a woman? I thought she was Mussolini in drag. "I wish I was as cocksure of anything as Tom Macaulay is of everything." -- Viscount Melbourne