G8 clashes turn violent

[rcne]

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe...day/index.html

Warning as G8 clashes turn violent Tuesday, July 5, 2005; Posted: 2:48 p.m. EDT (18:48 GMT) Police remove a protester during a demonstration in Edinburgh Monday. Image: EDINBURGH, Scotland -- As many as 100 protesters have begun appearing in court following violent clashes with police as officials promised zero tolerance for troublemakers ahead of Wednesday's G8 summit. Riot police in Edinburgh were bombarded with paving stones, bricks and park benches by protesters who officials said descended on the Scottish capital intent on causing disruption. Police said about 100 people were arrested Monday, including what officials called "key" anarchist suspects who had traveled to Scotland from across Europe. "Make no bones about it, if we encounter people who are prepared to use violence to achieve their aims ... we will take robust action," Tayside Police Chief Constable John Vine told reporters Tuesday in Auchterarder, the village closest to the Gleneagles resort where the world leaders will gather. "We want to allow the peaceful protest of the majority to take place unhindered by any rogue elements who are set on disruption and confrontation," he said. "We will not flinch where we encounter such behavior and will deal with it in a robust and measured way."

Why do the activists think that any violent demonstration will have the slightest impact on the G8?

Free media coverage for their or any cause is the only reason I can see . After all why protest if no one knows, TV time and print media is limited to sensationalism and the self proclaimed activists know this.

[dotcoma]

Yes, these nutcases think that by harming authorities and by screaming they make a difference. The truth is they just make their cause so tin-foil and ignored.

[Sonart]

No!!!! Yet another G8 slash WTO meeting has brought out the anarchists??? Say it ain't so!

.

[RickSp]

Quote by: Sonart No!!!! Yet another G8 slash WTO meeting has brought out the anarchists??? Say it ain't so!

These meetings do seem to attract anarchists and war criminals with hordes of journalists to cover each.

[PatrickHenry]

Quote by: RickSp These meetings do seem to attract anarchists and war criminals with hordes of journalists to cover each.

The G8 themselves qualify as criminals for the economic hitman approach to world domination, true, Rick. (I think this is what you meant) The anarchists: some are undoubtedly agents provocateurs. Maybe some are having some misguided "fun." And others are extreme idealogues who think that "any means necessary" applies to the globalist v peasant struggle.

[grandpa]

Quote by: RickSp These meetings do seem to attract anarchists and war criminals with hordes of journalists to cover each.

Could I quote you on that some time in the future?

Grandpa h.

[dotcoma]

Quote by: PatrickHenry The G8 themselves qualify as criminals for the economic hitman approach to world domination, true, Rick. (I think this is what you meant) The anarchists: some are undoubtedly agents provocateurs. Maybe some are having some misguided "fun." And others are extreme idealogues who think that "any means necessary" applies to the globalist v peasant struggle.

You are insulting a group that meets to discuss how to help the developing countries? They do not have to do this you know..lol

[PatrickHenry]

Allow me to correct your perceptions:

Quote by: dotcoma a group that meets to discuss how to "help" the developing countries

Quotation marks, ("), mine. See how much more sense it makes?

[dotcoma]

Quote by: PatrickHenry Allow me to correct your perceptions: Quotation marks, ("), mine. See how much more sense it makes?

They pump billions into them Patrick. How is the effort harming these countries as you seem to be implying. At least it is being discussed. They do not have to do this...

[PatrickHenry]

They loan them billions. The money is siphoned away by elites, just like in the US. Then the working classes are stuck with the bills.

The World Bank and IMF then "improve" their economies by forcing wage cuts and firesale prices on infrastructure.

Not to mention the cooperation with CIA assassinations and coups.

From Confessions of an Economic Hitman by John Perkins
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Gl...rtIV_CEHM.html

p203

In the years since I first went there [Ecuador], in 1968, this tiny country evolved into the quintessential victim of the corporatocracy. My contemporaries and I, and our modern corporate equivalents, had managed to bring it to virtual bankruptcy. We loaned it billions of dollars so it could hire our engineering and construction firms to build projects that would help its richest families. As a result, in those three decades, the official poverty level grew from 50 to 70 percent, under- or unemployment increased from 15 to 70 percent, public debt increased from $240 million to $16 billion, and the share of national resources allocated to the poorest citizens declined from 20 percent to 6 percent. Today, Ecuador must devote nearly 50 percent of its national budget simply to paying off its debts - instead of to helping the millions of its citizens who are officially classified as dangerously impoverished.' The situation in Ecuador clearly demonstrates that this was not the result of a conspiracy; it was a process that had occurred during both Democratic and Republican administrations, a process that had involved all the major multinational banks, many corporations, and foreign aid missions from a multitude of countries. The United States played the lead role, but we had not acted alone. During those three decades, thousands of men and women participated in bringing Ecuador to the tenuous position it found itself in at the beginning of the millennium. Some of them, like me, had been aware of what they were doing, but the vast majority had merely performed the tasks they had been taught in business, engineering, and law schools, or had followed the lead of bosses in my mold, who demonstrated the system by their own greedy example and through rewards and punishments calculated to perpetuate it. Such participants saw the parts they played as benign, at worst; in the most optimistic view, they were helping an impoverished nation. Although unconscious, deceived, and - in many cases - self-deluded, these players were not members of any clandestine conspiracy; rather, they were the product of a system that promotes the most subtle and effective form of imperialism the world has ever witnessed. No one had to go out and seek men and women who could be bribed or threatened - they had already been recruited by companies, banks, and government agencies. The bribes consisted of salaries, bonuses, pensions, and insurance policies; the threats were based on social mores, peer pressure, and unspoken questions about the future of their children's education. The system had succeeded spectacularly. By the time the new millennium rolled in, Ecuador was thoroughly entrapped. We had her, just as a Mafia don has the man whose daughter's wedding and small business he has financed and then refinanced. Like any good Mafiosi, we had taken our time. We could afford to be patient, knowing that beneath Ecuador's rain forests lies a sea of oil, knowing that the proper day would come.

[castille]

Violence is a pretty common trait of radical ideologies such as socialism, anarchism, and fascism. The socialists/nazis believe that violence is a "good" thing, what with their revolutions and all.

Just remember, during the 1930s in Europe, the most common fights were between the communists and fascists.

[dotcoma]

Patrick, you make it sound like the corruption in Africa is somehow our fault..

We try. Some of that money makes it I am sure.

[PatrickHenry]

Quote by: dotcoma Patrick, you make it sound like the corruption in Africa is somehow our fault.. We try. Some of that money makes it I am sure.

I don't understand your reference to "our fault." Do you mean yours and mine? Do you mean the citizens of the US collectively? Or do you mistakenly identify yourself with the Overlords of the global economy whose goal is to enrich a very small slice at the top, while impoverishing everyone else? A clandestine agenda, hidden behind the smokescreen of "free trade."

You say "we try"; I think there is very little trying on your part or mine either for that matter. The situation is a subject of mainstream media propaganda just like everything else in the world of politics. You owe it to yourself to brush up on the reality of life outside the developed world...

Try this: http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/index.html

[tinybear]

I hear that the protesters are 'professionals', i.e. they get paid to organize and stage/incite these and many other similar protests. Does anyone know whether there's any truth in this?

Actually, if the powers that be wish to see an end to such protests, my advice to them is to hold these meetings in an authoritarian country (such as China for example).

[Nono]

Quote by: Sonart No!!!! Yet another G8 slash WTO meeting has brought out the anarchists??? Say it ain't so!

Not sure I'd even grace them with the description "anarchist" (though they'd probably call themselves that). A lot are just thugs. We had them where I live for the G8 two years ago and it was highly embarrassing: windows smashed, molotov cocktails thrown, etc.
Naturally, they reflect badly on the real "G8 protesters". (Which makes ya wonder, eh? Remember how Nixon's people used to plant gibbering hecklers at Spiro's appearances in the '72 campaign to make the Republicans look good?)

Anyway, I took part in the real protests two years ago, not because I'm opposed to the leaders of these eight countries getting together to discuss things but just to remind them that a lot of people don't share their race-to-the-sweatshop ideology.

[PatrickHenry]

Like I said, Nono. Agents provocateurs, hooligans, uninhibited antis as well as the peaceful folks like you were...

[G. Adams]

Quote by: tinybear I hear that the protesters are 'professionals', i.e. they get paid to organize and stage/incite these and many other similar protests. Does anyone know whether there's any truth in this? Actually, if the powers that be wish to see an end to such protests, my advice to them is to hold these meetings in an authoritarian country (such as China for example).

I think they are using the word professional loosely, I believe they mean to say these are protest veterans who turn up to as much as possible, some of them with permanent networks to organise the protests.

The UK police are well versed in 'neutralising' any protest, and by neutralise I mean kill. What the police do is herd the protesters along the street, preferably into a corner with only two exits, then blockade the front and plug the back. The protesters get stuck and sit around for 9 hours and all the steam is out of them then they go home. This 'corner' is preferably as far away as possible from those who are meant to hear the protest ei Westminster, Gleneagles Hotel etc

Additional tactics by the police are agent provocateurs planted by police, which they have admitted to using in the past, so no doubt they still do. They also look for the group of close knit people, they're usually all selling the Socialist Worker or something similar. When they spot them they hit one of them, the rest come running, the police batter those too, more from the crowd turn up. By then the BBC turn up and start reporting all these violent protesters. If they didn't have the police within site of the protest, the most you would have is a few bust windows, but with the police there it aggravates the protesters whose only aim is to demonstrate peacefully, as is their right.

[G. Adams]

Quote by: Nono Not sure I'd even grace them with the description "anarchist" (though they'd probably call themselves that). A lot are just thugs. We had them where I live for the G8 two years ago and it was highly embarrassing: windows smashed, molotov cocktails thrown, etc. Naturally, they reflect badly on the real "G8 protesters". (Which makes ya wonder, eh? Remember how Nixon's people used to plant gibbering hecklers at Spiro's appearances in the '72 campaign to make the Republicans look good?) Anyway, I took part in the real protests two years ago, not because I'm opposed to the leaders of these eight countries getting together to discuss things but just to remind them that a lot of people don't share their race-to-the-sweatshop ideology.

What was embarrasing, if I remember rightly (though this might have been Italy, not Swizerland) was when the police killed a protesters who was dangling by a rope tied to a bridge over a busy motorway. He was a long way up above this road. Instead of pulling the guy up, the police cut the rope on him, and he crashed to a messy death.

The best that can be said about the protests here is that it is unlikely the police will be firing tear gas and bringing out the water cannons like on the continent.

[rcne]

PH, thats why the WB always has debt reduction, debt forgiveness, low interest loans, restructuring debt.

Anything to ""help"" (I added quotes to your quotes) the poor nations progress with financial aid.

If those funds are siphoned off by internal corruption, how is the WB or G8 responsible. If string were attached and G8 or WB auditors were involved to make sure the funds were applied as required, the WB and G8 would then be accused of interference of a sovereign governments ability to govern.

[Nono]

Quote by: G.Adams What was embarrasing, if I remember rightly (though this might have been Italy, not Swizerland) was when the police killed a protesters who was dangling by a rope tied to a bridge over a busy motorway.

I think you're conflating Switzerland 2003 with Genoa 2001. In Genoa there was a full-scale police riot in which a perfectly peaceful protestor was murdered by cops (no exaggeration -- this is a fact borne out be subsequent investigation). This led the Süddeutsche Zeitung -- just to take one example -- to suggest that perhaps Berlusconi's Italy wasn't fit for membership of the EU.

In Switzerland two years ago some asshole supsended himself from a motorway bridge over a creek, the rope stretching across the motorway and thus blocking traffic. This, you might say, was suicidal behaviour. Along came the cops and very stupidly cut the rope. The dude survived the fall and the cops were duly called murderous.
That guy, in my view, belongs in the "rowdy" category of people merely wishing to make an idiotic spectacle of themselves (guess he was a member of the special kamakazi section).

Personally I think the Swiss government should have given the G8 the finger: Y'all wanna have yore shindig across the lake there? Fine. Yore problem, not ours.