Sitting Bull's people break away from US

[Technosoul]

Here is an offical map of the area of land the Lakota nation can claim in this aciton.

http://www.crystalinks.com/sioux.htm...com/sioux.html

The webpage might have links to other issues important to the their nation.

[Chris]

Quote by: ruksak I cannot see as too how this could possibly work. They would be without the help of any United States infrastructure, roads, schools, stores...........how could this work? Sounds like a publicity stunt to me. If they actually had a viable, self contained plan to construct an autonomous nation of their own, I would support it. But from what I've read, this cannot work. Nor will it stand.

It has been working for years. Have you ever looked at the map? These reservations are in the wilderness and already have had their own roads, schools, stores etc.

Quote by: Technosoul Here is an offical map of the area of land the Lakota nation can claim in this aciton. http://www.crystalinks.com/sioux.htm...com/sioux.html The webpage might have links to other issues important to the their nation.

Error404 buddy...

try this
Lakota - Dakota - Sioux Nation - Crystalinks

That map isn't entirely an accurate representation of the boundaries of the reservations...

I may work on getting screenshots of Microsofts streets and trips -to show the boundaries, but not now... they are huge and significant. It is a huge amount of land. A lot less than what they really deserve IMO.

I wonder then if official US geography - is going to count that land as land area or not.

[ruksak]

Quote by: Chris It has been working for years. Have you ever looked at the map? These reservations are in the wilderness and already have had their own roads, schools, stores etc.

Admittedly, I don't know much about American Indian politics. However, are these infrastructures paid for, built and maintained with tax dollars?

[nerdvincent]

Quote by: ruksak However, are these infrastructures paid for, built and maintained with tax dollars?

If so, why bother with them? Let them go and build Sitting Bull Land, and may they live in their own culture as much as they want with their own money. Stop playing Risk with living, thinking people...

[Chris]

Quote by: ruksak Admittedly, I don't know much about American Indian politics. However, are these infrastructures paid for, built and maintained with tax dollars?

If they were, Why would you have a problem with that? They deserve a whole lot more than that after what was done to them and their people.

[Chris]

Came across this on SU

Lakota Freedom Delegation

We are the freedom loving Lakota from the Sioux Indian reservations of Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota and Montana who have suffered from cultural and physical genocide in the colonial apartheid system we have been forced to live under. We are continuing the work that we were asked to do by the traditional chiefs and treaty councils, and 98 Indian Nations at the first Indian Treaty Council meeting at Standing Rock Sioux Indian Country in 1974. During the week of December 17-19, 2007, we traveled to Washington DC and withdrew from the constitutionally mandated treaties to become a free and independent country. We are alerting the Family of Nations we have now reassumed our freedom and independence with the backing of Natural, International, and United States law. We do not represent those BIA or IRA governments beholden to the colonial apartheid system, or those "stay by the fort" Indians who are unwilling claim their freedom.

[nerdvincent]

Good! But how much land do they want?

[Chris]

I wouldnt think they are asking for any more land than they already have

[nerdvincent]

Well then, give them! I'm anti-colonialism, just like America claims to be. Their means to achieve independance are legal and non-violent, they look as if they want to create a good country.
Let them go further, to referendums and stuff. We'll see. WE have nothing to loose.

[ruksak]

Quote by: nerdvincent If so, why bother with them? Let them go and build Sitting Bull Land, and may they live in their own culture as much as they want with their own money. Stop playing Risk with living, thinking people...

I was asking a question. Not meaning to say yay or nay either way. (Hey that rhymed)

A question that has yet to be answered, I might add. I feel it is important. If they wish to recede, what property of the American tax payers do they wish to take?

Why do people take everything as a heated debate? It was a good question I thought.

[nerdvincent]

Of course, a very good one. But what do you want, I'm blinding hot for debate today.
Well I don't know in the USA, but in Canada every ''First Nation'' people are abusing of their supposed ancestral laws. They don't work, they have better cars than us white face, they do cocaine like hell, and they are fat of McDo. All with OUR tax money.

[Nono]

Jeez, vince, what a caricature.
But spoken like a true Québécois, eh?

Quebec has a special problem with the first-nationers, since the francophones rather fancy the image of first nation for themselves.

[nerdvincent]

Exactly
But that's not just caricature. I lived in a little town stuck between half a dozen First nation's special town, and I can tell you that it's creepy. WE don't have McDo though, just a KFC. There is lots of diabetes and cardiac problem (cause:cocaine and amphetamines), and very few of them ever work in their life.

Ok here is a true fact: gvt give them 15 000$ if they go out of town 2 weks or more for ''hunting'' and all their ancestral tricks. Well they built big 200 000 $ wooden houses with TV and PC, at 50 FEET of the town limit. Then they come in my hometown, take a 5000 $ load of drugs and alcohol, then feast for 2 weeks.
10 000 bucks benefits.

[Ken Carman]

Quote by: Zeebadee The native Americans are on their reservations for one reason and one reason only: They couldn't, or wouldn't protect what they were in possession of. The people advocating unrestricted immigration really ought to take note of that fact.

Just like those who stood in Hitler's way, or Stalin's, or...

There is somewhat of a difference between immigration and conquering a people, however.

[Ken Carman]

Quote by: Technosoul Here is an offical map of the area of land the Lakota nation can claim in this aciton. http://www.crystalinks.com/sioux.htm...com/sioux.html The webpage might have links to other issues important to the their nation.

Clicked and got...

Not Found The requested document was not found on this server. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Web Server at crystalinks.com

[Ken Carman]

Quote by: Chris It has been working for years. Have you ever looked at the map? These reservations are in the wilderness and already have had their own roads, schools, stores etc. Error404 buddy... try this Lakota - Dakota - Sioux Nation - Crystalinks That map isn't entirely an accurate representation of the boundaries of the reservations... I may work on getting screenshots of Microsofts streets and trips -to show the boundaries, but not now... they are huge and significant. It is a huge amount of land. A lot less than what they really deserve IMO. I wonder then if official US geography - is going to count that land as land area or not.

That one worked. Wow, that's a hell of a lot of land.

[nerdvincent]

Same for me.

[Suburbanite]

i wonder what naturalization to their country is like

[Sonart]

.

GRASS ROOTS OGLALA LAKOTA OYATE
Official Proclamation

--"The Grass Roots Oglala Lakota Oyate represents the Oglala people of Lakota Ancestry who announce their claim as part of the peta sakowin ( Seven Council Fires) of the Tetuwan Oyate ( Sioux Nation) and are the original caretakers of the land within the Treaties of 1851 and 1868. With the Tiwahe ( family) being the smallest unit of the Oyate and that, the sovereignty of our Oyate lies within the individuals of each Tiwahe. We claim our Sovereignty as Oglala Lakota People."--

--"1. Therefore, we , the Grass Roots Oglala Lakota Oyate do hereby declare our Independence from the dictatorship reigning over the great Tetuwan Oyate/ Oglala Band and demand our Sovereign Immunity Rights as entitled in the 1851 and 1868 Fort Laramie Treaties between the United States and the Tetuwan Lakota Oyate.

2. All legal remedies have been exhausted within the US Justice System and can see no other recourse but to take our case to the World Court.

3. We renounce the IRA (Indian Reorganization Act) system along with all the rights , responsibilities, and Privileges derived. An organization cannot speak for a Nation of peoples.

4. We re-establish and reaffirm the legally agreed upon territorial boundaries of the Tetuwan Oyate as defined in the 1851 and 1868 Treaties.

5. We announce our intention to completely disengage from any further control Alternatively, supervision presently exercised upon us by the United States Government and it's agents (BIA/IRA); we intend to implement the protection and of the intervention of the United Nations Security Council, the General Assembly, and Human Rights Commission to monitor and oversee the orderly transfer of power and authority back to the people.

6. In furtherance of our firm insistence upon full and strict compliance of all articles in the 1851 & 1868 Treaties, we establish the Tetuwan Lakota Oyate International Headquarters.

7. The fact that the 3/4 vote needed to alter our Treaties as stated was never instituted and therefore dictates to us as Tetuwan Oyate that all Acts or Amendments that the U.S. passed after 1868 is without approval from the Lakota people are hereby deemed unconstitutional and illegal."--

The best date I have on this is the copyright, 2001.

Question: what would happen if you declared a revolution and no one cared?

.

[Politicks]

Quote by: another day Hah. Let them try, the lakota indians will only become martyrs of the US's continued tyranny on humanity.

The..."continued tyranny on humanity." Yessiree, that is what we are all about. Tyranny, oppression, hegemony, wanton slaughter of innocents and the whole nine yards. Someone should seriously consider changing the words on the Statue of Liberty to accommodate this new paradigm.

Seriously, it is a symbolic move and for the most part, I side with their perspective. We took their land for crying out loud. We should, as a nation, work harder to ensure their rights and freedoms and be awful proud of the integral part they have played in the history of this nation. Should Russell Means ( Last of the Mohicans ) incite insurrection as a means of separation, he knows the eventual outcome. Let us hope that it never comes to such a desperate act. He is by no means, a pushover. This guy means what he says and appears to be willing to undertake any measures to get there. We don't really want this to go any further. To some extent, vanquished or not, he has more than a leg to stand on, IMHO. This is a much bigger problem than it first may appear.