Coldest winter in years, Environment Canada warns

[Praxius]

Related for the Records in this thread:



CTV.ca | U.S. Midwest in icy grip of storm

DES MOINES, Iowa -- Schools closed for thousands of youngsters, Iowa's biggest airport shut down and thick layers of ice brought down more power lines Tuesday as a major ice storm glazed the nation's midsection. At least 22 deaths had been blamed on the storm system since the waves of sleet and freezing rain started during the weekend. Hundreds of thousands of homes and businesses had no electricity. Officials in Missouri, Kansas and Oklahoma had declared states of emergency. President Bush declared an emergency in Oklahoma on Tuesday, ordering federal aid to supplement state and local response efforts. Iowa's largest school district closed for the day in Des Moines, telling its nearly 31,000 students to stay home, and kids across most of Oklahoma and in the Kansas City, Mo., area stayed home for a second day. Schools also were closed in parts of Wisconsin, including Milwaukee Public Schools with 85,000 students. "We thought about our kids on foot," said Milwaukee schools spokeswoman Roseann St. Aubin. Some drivers couldn't even get to their buses, she said. About an inch of ice was expected Tuesday over parts of Iowa, followed by up to 5 inches of sleet and snow. "It's a pretty good ice-maker," said Frank Boksa, a National Weather Service forecaster. Ice as much as an inch thick had accumulated on trees, power lines, streets and car windshields Monday in parts of Oklahoma and Missouri, with thinner layers elsewhere. Nearly 600,000 Oklahoma homes and businesses still had no electricity Tuesday, most of them since Monday when power lines began snapping under the weight of ice and falling branches -- the biggest power outage in state history. Utilities in Missouri reported more than 100,000 homes and business without power and Kansas utilities said probably more than 70,000 were blacked out Tuesday, with some in the dark since Sunday. "This is a big one. We've got a massive situation here and it's probably going to be a week to 10 days before we get power on to everybody," said Ed Bettinger, a spokesman for Public Service Company of Oklahoma. "It looks like a war zone." Iowa's two major utilities reported over 17,000 customers without power Tuesday. The storm even put a crimp on presidential campaigning, with Republican Mike Huckabee canceling stops in western Iowa and former President Bill Clinton calling off appearances in eastern Iowa on behalf of his wife, Hillary Rodham Clinton. Des Moines International Airport closed because of ice late Monday and could be closed most of Tuesday, said spokesman Roy Criss. The airport, which also was shut down by winter weather two weeks ago, has 138 arrivals and departures per day, he said. "This rain keeps refreezing. We put chemicals down, it melts and the freezes again. We can't stay ahead of it," Criss said. "This is not fun."

Ah, always with the chemicals as a solution..... that's enviromentally friendly

Many travelers also were grounded at Chicago, where about 250 flights were canceled Tuesday morning at O'Hare International Airport and departure delays averaging 15 to 30 minutes, said Karen Pride of the city's Department of Aviation. Kansas City International Airport in Missouri canceled more than 90 flights Tuesday morning, but spokesman Joe McBride said that was probably due to problems at other airports. Southeastern Nebraska also had power outages Tuesday and some flights in and out of Omaha's Eppley Airfield were canceled. The Federal Emergency Management Agency and the Army Corps of Engineers sent 50 generators and three truckloads of bottled water from Texas to distribute to blacked-out areas of Oklahoma. At least 22 deaths -- most of them in traffic accidents -- had been blamed on the ice and cold since the weekend, including 15 in Oklahoma, four in Kansas, and three in Missouri.

My geez people, that's an awful lot of deaths for an ice storm.... either people gotta get some snow tires on their cars or somebody needs to go back to driver's ed and learn how to drive in the winter time.... frig. Either that, or stay the hell home people..... just because you have a fancy SUV, that doesn't mean you can fly down the road at highway speeds and think you're gonna stick on the road like velcro..... news flash.... it doesn't work that way.

But worst power outage in state history and it was due to ice storms?

Hmmmm......

[brien]

But worst power outage in state history and it was due to ice storms

Absolutely. A few years ago there was one in Maine that took out most of the state. They are worse than snow storms b/c the ice forms on the trees, the branches collapse from the weight , and down on the power lines go.

You would think in the 21st Century most power lines would be buried to pre-empt this situation. But hey, that may cost someone some money they otherwise spend in wars.

[tivodan1116]

Quote by: Praxius Ah, always with the chemicals as a solution..... that's enviromentally friendly

Uhhh... what would you suggest instead? People going around with hairdryers to de-ice the roads?

My geez people, that's an awful lot of deaths for an ice storm...

I'd still take an ice/snow storm over any other form of severe weather - how many people die in your average hurricane?

Either that, or stay the hell home people..... just because you have a fancy SUV, that doesn't mean you can fly down the road at highway speeds and think you're gonna stick on the road like velcro..... news flash.... it doesn't work that way.

News flash - you have no evidence that any of the deaths occurred in this manner. Maybe all 22 were people having an emergency and driving conservatively... Maybe they were all drunk drivers... unlikely scenarios, but no more unproven than your needless swipe at the unfortunate people who lost their lives.

[Praxius]

Quote by: tivodan1116 Uhhh... what would you suggest instead? People going around with hairdryers to de-ice the roads?

There's something called Salt and Sand... if it's too cold, then suck it up and wait until it reaches Zero again so it is effective, as they clearly proven these chemicals don't do squat.

And besides, don't be so silly, hair dryers would just melt it and then freeze again, wasting more energy and causing more pollution

I'd still take an ice/snow storm over any other form of severe weather - how many people die in your average hurricane?

Last major hurricane where I live? Two I believe..... a tree collapsed on an ambulance out due to the hurricane and killed a paramedic (Bit of cruel irony there) and the other I don't remember much detail, but it wasn't many. Although I know it took some people up to a month to get power back.... I was out for three days.

Frig growing up, Hurricanes were awsome and I was always outside when they occured.... taking a big orange tarp with my brother and cousins, grabbing each corner and going for a trip 10 feet or so in a field is quite fun.

News flash - you have no evidence that any of the deaths occurred in this manner.

NEWS FLASH! READ!

At least 22 deaths -- most of them in traffic accidents -- had been blamed on the ice and cold since the weekend, including 15 in Oklahoma, four in Kansas, and three in Missouri.

Maybe all 22 were people having an emergency and driving conservatively.

I drive through snow storms all the time.... the only time snow and ice during a storm can cause accidents, is when you're going to fast, you don't know your vehicles' limits, you need winter tires installed or your tires are bald.

The only other explination is those idiots don't know how to drive in a snow storm, therefore they should have stayed home.

And that's gotta be some bad luck for all of those 22 had all emergencies and all of them died along the way due to their emergencies from getting into accidents...... now who's grasping for straws?

.. Maybe they were all drunk drivers...

Then ALL of them wouldn't have been contributed to the weather as they stated, and would have been DUI incidences.

unlikely scenarios, but no more unproven than your needless swipe at the unfortunate people who lost their lives.

Not even remotely.

I've traveled accross most of Eastern Canada over the years, I have lived in various locations, and through my own experience watching people ahead of me and behind me, as well as further reports on the radios in regards to accidents during snow storms (Which are far and few in between in Canada per each snow storm) most have been speeding, and passing others in a hurry to get to where they want, and driving erratic because of everybody else who slowed down to take it easy. They zip back and forth through lanes, going the normal speed limit, and then 5 mins more of driving you see the same idiot in the ditch and flipped several times...... they pose a great risk not just to themselves but everybody else around them. And I also imagine this phenomina isn't just isolated to my country.

I have no sympathy for the stupid. That ammount of deaths in a short period of time due to what they claimed were "mostly in traffic accidents" in relation to the snow and ice storms, clearly shows a lack of knowlege of what is required to drive in a snow storm collectively.

People are taught about hydroplaning during rain storms, people down there appear as though they require further education on snow and ice storms..... it's a part of our culture to drive in such weather, which is why in comparisons of deaths related to snow/ice storms, Canada has a lower %.

Oh but then this is where I imagine you will state there is a bigger population in the US compared to Canada, therefore innacurate.......

To beat some time, tell you what..... take the ammount of deaths in those select states, and tally them to the entire list of dead in Canada related to the same snow storms which hit you guys and us at the same time, and see who had more deaths related to traffic or the weather alone for that matter and tell me what you get.

[tivodan1116]

Quote by: Praxius There's something called Salt and Sand... if it's too cold, then suck it up and wait until it reaches Zero again so it is effective, as they clearly proven these chemicals don't do squat.

Salt and sand cannot be used, nor would they be effective on airplane runways. That is what the speaker was discussing.

The most commonly used de-icer on runways is either ethylene glycol or propylene glycol.

Salt and sand are not effective because to work they largely rely on vehicles running over the same path over and over again to spread them into ice.

Furthermore, the granules of salt and sand on the runway would cause poor traction and kick up dangerous particles that could get swept into engines and damage control surfaces on the runways at the high speeds airplanes would be moving over them.

I have no sympathy for the stupid. That ammount of deaths in a short period of time due to what they claimed were "mostly in traffic accidents" in relation to the snow and ice storms, clearly shows a lack of knowlege of what is required to drive in a snow storm collectively.

But you didn't say that. What you said was:

Quote by: Praxius Either that, or stay the hell home people..... just because you have a fancy SUV, that doesn't mean you can fly down the road at highway speeds and think you're gonna stick on the road like velcro..... news flash.... it doesn't work that way.

You have no proof that people were either driving a "fancy SUV" or that they were "fly[ing] down the road at highway speeds".

Maybe they were driving a front wheel drive sedan and were going 15mph, but slid on ice nonetheless and rolled down an embankment.

My point is that you needlessly blame a certain class of vehicles and assume a behavior for which you have no evidence.

[Praxius]

Quote by: tivodan1116 You have no proof that people were either driving a "fancy SUV" or that they were "fly[ing] down the road at highway speeds".

Well I'm very glad you pointed that out, and allow me to search for some footage I just saw on tv of one tool flying into a telephone pole, and another guy explaining how he hit some slush and hydroplaned off a small cliff.....

eah.... Does anybody in here know how fast a car much be going before you can hydroplane?

Anyone?

How about hydroplaning with a combination of ice and water?

... well no videos online yet, but this will do:

The Columbus Dispatch : Ice-storm death toll rises to 13

On ice-covered Interstate 40 west of Okemah, Okla., four people died in "one huge cluster of an accident" that involved 11 vehicles, including a tractor-trailer rig, said Highway Patrol Trooper Betsey Randolph. All 11 vehicles burned, she said. Eight other people also died on icy Oklahoma roads, and Missouri had one death on a slippery highway.

Now let's compare that to this from around the same time from the same storm:

Southern Ontario ice storm creates traffic woes

Freezing rain and snow hitting the Greater Toronto Area have caused treacherous driving conditions and delays or cancellations of dozens of flights out of Pearson International Airport. About 200 accidents were reported Monday morning across the region, Ontario Provincial Police said. There were no serious injuries. By late afternoon, that number had risen to about 500.

No serious injuries out of around 500 vehicle accidents.... you think we might statistically have one death. Granted most went off the roads and into guardrails must like what has occurred in the US, but the only thing which would have increase the potential for death in both cases would be what I described above.....

• The main common factor in these deaths (Also including the fact that some caught on fire in the US) would have been speed.

• My other point towards the SUV's is that when it comes to staying on the ground compared to other vehicles, SUV's are one of the most unstable, and even during good conditions, at high speed turns, they will flip much easier then regular sized, lower to the ground vehicles.

keep your eyes peeled to the news today and tomorrow and see if you can catch some of these collisions they show.... you will notice most are going quite fast for the weather.... AKA: someone requires more education in driving in most cases.

Maybe they were driving a front wheel drive sedan and were going 15mph, but slid on ice nonetheless and rolled down an embankment.

Happens here as well... See above.

My point is that you needlessly blame a certain class of vehicles and assume a behavior for which you have no evidence.

Oh wow, well excuse me all to hell, I didn't think you would have taken such offense to such a comment towards SUV's, which are already known to be prone to flipping.

If you want evidence, go look it up and open your eyes to some of the news for once, rather then trying to get people to spoon feed you information.

Once again, see above for starters. I'm hungry and I'm going to eat.

[Nono]

tivo, sweetie, you and your fellow bitter-end doubters are free to doubt as much as you like. I'm of a skeptical disposition myself.

But the evidence is squarely against you, i.e. while it's theoretically possible that all this has nothing to do with human activity, the scientific community thinks that such highly theoretical mental gymnastics are a mighty stretch. No absolute proof is possible? No absolute proof is possible of a whole range of scientific verities, but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it is (all give-me-proof aside) probably a duck.

And here's why people like you have an interest in taking the blinders off: By treating it as human-generated, you might just avoid the worst effects. But if you don't treat it that way and you're skepticism proves unfounded (extremely likely) you're screwed.

That's why.

[Praxius]

But see I already understand all this old news they're talking about..... and it's all been getting worse then better for decades since they've been talking about this.

Their original predictions were that all this was gonna smack us in the mid-late 90's but that current time's predictions. They also claim things are indeed much worse when it comes to pollution now then 20 years ago..... so wouldn't that have logically increased the speed of this massive world's end to say the early 90's?

Now it's another 30-50 years.... how the hell does that work?

Is this your card?

No.....


Is this your card?

No.....


Is this your card?

No.....

Like your duck logic.... one pile of crap is still a pile of crap..... if you back that pile of crap up with a bigger pile of crap..... it's just a bigger and more noticeable pile of crap.

You have the majority of our scientists claiming it's "Global Warming"

You also have a considerable amount of scientists claiming it's "Climate Change"

Honestly, do you think the planet would have been formed and created as it was, by it's own materials and minerals, it's own gases and fuels, everything that is on this planet, would in turn kill itself?

I'm not talking about us, I'm talking about the things we use and make from the earth's resources.

We shape and modify materials and chemicals to make other things for our needs on this planet... technically we are not putting anything new into the world that which wasn't already here. How the planet reacts to the different ways it returns remains to be seen.....

I haven't disputed what's coming out way..... I'm just disputing how it's coming our way.

[Nemiroff]

There are at least 5 threads on global warming, with many many pages on each one. Sorry but that's way too much reading, after a certain point, starting a new thread should be encouraged, especially if the main topic is slightly different. And the more pollution thing was a joke.

Instead of saying, some places get cold some get hot, but the planet as a whole is getting hot, can someone please name a couple of places where the temp is increasing, cause I have yet to hear anything saying that

[Sonart]

.

Quote by: Praxius Their original predictions were that all this was gonna smack us in the mid-late 90's but that current time's predictions. They also claim things are indeed much worse when it comes to pollution now then 20 years ago..... so wouldn't that have logically increased the speed of this massive world's end to say the early 90's? Now it's another 30-50 years.... how the hell does that work?

Really? You care to show us those "original predictions". Because for the last 5 years scientists have been repeatedly and vehemently telling us that it's happen FASTER than originally predicted.

US science body warns on climate -- "One of the most influential US science organisations dedicated to studying the Earth and its environment says human influence on the climate is increasing. The American Geophysical Union has just adopted a new policy position on global warming in which it states its concern over rising greenhouse gas emissions." -- Dec. 2003

Global Warming Effects Faster Than Feared - Experts -- Oct. 2004

Global Warming Heats Up -- Mar. 2006

Global warming 'is three times faster than worst predictions' -- Jun. 2007

Quote by: Praxius You have the majority of our scientists claiming it's "Global Warming" You also have a considerable amount of scientists claiming it's "Climate Change"

It's the exact same thing, Praxius. Climate Change = Global Warming. The former is simply a less threatening terminology that conservatives prefer when discussing the issue.

Quote by: Praxius We shape and modify materials and chemicals to make other things for our needs on this planet... technically we are not putting anything new into the world that which wasn't already here. How the planet reacts to the different ways it returns remains to be seen.....

Spoken like a true libertarian. Take plain ol CO2, mix it with H2O - water in the atmosphere, and you get carbonic acid, a weak acid rain.

Mix Sulfur Dioxide, a common pollutant from burning coal, with atmospheric H2O, and you get sulfuric acid, a much stronger acid rain.

Mix Nitrogen Dioxide in the atmosphere, you get Nitric Acid. Even stronger.

So yes, we are, in fact, putting something NEW into the world, and right now, we're putting in more CO2 and methane into the atmosphere than the earth's chemical equilibrium, and therefore the evolution of life on earth, was designed for over the milleniums.

.

[Sonart]

.

Quote by: Nemiroff Instead of saying, some places get cold some get hot, but the planet as a whole is getting hot, can someone please name a couple of places where the temp is increasing, cause I have yet to hear anything saying that

Read a friggin' newspaper.

Southeast drought hits crisis point



Lanier Lake in Cumming, Georgia.

.

[mark3748]

Quote by: Sonart . Read a friggin' newspaper. Southeast drought hits crisis point Lanier Lake in Cumming, Georgia. .

drought's have little to do with global warming in this context. Hell, here in Colorado we had a bad drought while the rest of the country had more rain than usual, now we have more precipitation and other parts of the country are having droughts. Remember learning about the Dust Bowl? the drought in California in the 1970s? 1988, when 2,100,000 acres of Yellowstone burned? Were those all caused by global warming? If so, why hasn't it been continual?

[Praxius]

Quote by: Sonart Really? You care to show us those "original predictions". Because for the last 5 years scientists have been repeatedly and vehemently telling us that it's happen FASTER than originally predicted.

Didn't we already go through this? All of your links you just showed are from after 2000.

http://www.warwickhughes.com/blog/?p=101

June 23, 1890, Wednesday Is our climate changing? The succession of temperate Summers and open Winters through several years, culminating last Winter in the almost total failure of the ice crop throughout the valley of the Hudson, makes the question pertinent. The older inhabitants tell us that the Winters are not as cold now as when they were young, and we have all observed a marked diminution of the average cold even in this last decade. Warming Arctic Climate Melting Glaciers Faster, Raising Ocean Level, Scientist Says May 30, 1947, Friday By GLADWIN HILLSpecial to THE NEW YORK TIMES. LOS ANGELES, May 29 — A mysterious warming of the climate is slowly manifesting itself in the Arctic, engendering a “serious international problem,” Dr. Hans Ahlmann, noted Swedish geophysicist, said today. A WARMER EARTH EVIDENT AT POLES; Arctic Findings in Particular Support Theory of Rising Global Temperatures October 8, 1961, Sunday ROME, Oct. 7 — The earth, with few regional exceptions, is undergoing “a persistent cold wave” that began in the Nineteen Forties, a United States weather man told a symposium on climate this week. Weathermen Try to Explain the Why of Spring That Never Was in 1967 May 31, 1967, Wednesday By JOHN NOBLE WILFORD In the year 1816 the year without summer, they called it snow fell in New England and parts of New York in June, July and August. Crops failed. People were impoverished and mystified. Expert Says Arctic Ocean Will Soon Be an Open Sea; Catastrophic Shifts in Climate Feared if Change Occurs Other Specialists See No Thinning of Polar Ice Cap February 20, 1969, Thursday By WALTER SULLIVAN Col. Bernt Balchen, polar explorer and flier, is circulating a paper among polar specialists proposing that the Arctic pack ice is thinning and that the ocean at the North Pole may become an open sea within a decade or two. U.S. and Soviet Press Studies of a Colder Arctic; U.S. and Soviet Press Arctic Studies July 18, 1970, Saturday By WALTER SULLIVAN The United States and the Soviet Union are mounting large-scale investigations to determine why the Arctic climate is becoming more frigid, why parts of the Arctic sea ice have recently become ominously thicker and whether the extent of that ice cover contributes to the onset of ice ages. Climate Experts Assay Ice Age Clues January 27, 1972, Thursday PROVIDENCE, R. I., Jan. 26 — After invading Nebraska and Colorado, the armadillos, faced with increasingly frigid weather, are in retreat from those states toward their ancestral home south of the Mexican border. The winter snow accumulation on Baffin Island has increased 35 per cent in the last decade. Record of a Little Ice Age Is Discovered February 5, 1972, Saturday By WALTER SULLIVAN From a study of ice extracted from deep within the Greenland ice sheet it appears that 89,500 years ago something catastrophic changed the climate from being warmer than today’s to that of a full-fledged ice age. Scientist Fears Equable Climate Around World Could Be Ending October 31, 1972, Tuesday By BOYCE RENSBERGER The current 12,000-year-old era of comfortable climates around the world may be coming to an end, closing another chapter in what a University of Miami scientist believes has been a history of frequent and relatively short-lived ice ages and warm ages. CLIMATE CHANGES CALLED OMINOUS; Scientists Warn Predictions Must Be Made Precise to Avoid Catastrophe May 21, 1975, Wednesday By WALTER SULLIVAN DISPLAYING FIRST PARAGRAPH - The world’s climate is changing. Of that scientists are firmly convinced. But in what direction and why are subjects of deepening debate. WARMING TREND SEEN IN CLIMATE; Two Articles Counter View That Cold Period Is Due August 14, 1975, Thursday By WALTER SULLIVAN Articles in two scientific journals have questioned widely publicized predictions that, in coming decades, the world climate will deteriorate severely affecting food production and, perhaps, initiating a new ice age. Experts Fear Great Peril If SST Fumes Cool Earth December 21, 1975, Sunday By WALTER SULLIVAN A federally sponsored inquiry into the effects of possible climate changes caused by heavy supersonic traffic in the stratosphere has concluded that even a slight cooling could cost the world from $200 billion to 500 times that much in damage done to agriculture, public health and other effects. 2 Climate Experts Decry Predictions of Disasters; Drought in Africa February 22, 1976, Sunday By WALTER SULLIVAN Special to The New York Times BOSTON, Feb. 21–Two authorities on climate change have termed irresponsible recent predictions of an impending ice age or other climatic disaster. The also said that any global effects of man-made air pollution on the climate to date remained obscure. International Team of Specialists Finds No End in Sight to 30-Year Cooling Trend in Northern Hemisphere January 5, 1978, Thursday By WALTER SULLIVAN An international team of specialists has concluded from eight indexes of climate that there is no end in sight to the cooling trend of the last 30 years, at least in the Northern Hemisphere. Climate Specialists, in Poll, Foresee No Catastrophic Weather Changes in Rest of Century; Warning About Carbon Dioxide February 18, 1978, Saturday By WALTER SULLIVAN Special to The New York Times WASHINGTON, Feb. 17–A poll of climate specialists in seven countries has found a consensus that there will be no catastrophic changes in the climate by the end of the century. But the specialists were almost equally divided on whether there would be a warming, a cooling or no change at all. Scientists at World Parley Doubt Climate Variations Are Ominous; Forgetting the Past Major Shifts in Past February 16, 1979, Friday By WALTER SULLIVAN Special to The New York Times GENEVA, Feb. 15 This winter Chicago was paralyzed by snow. Last winter it was Boston. European Russia has just suffered its coldest December in a century. In Britain and Western Europe, the summer of 1976 was the hottest in 250 years. A Vast ‘Interdisciplinary Effort’ To Predict Climate Trend Urged; Neutralization Needed February 24, 1979, Saturday By WALTER SULLIVAN Special to The New York Times GENEVA, Feb. 23–After exchanging views here for two weeks, the people who know more about climate than anyone else in the world have concluded that climate’s future trends can be predicted in a meaningful way only after “an interdisciplinary effort of unprecedented scope.” Scientists Reviving Speculation on Climate and Slipping Antarctic Ice; Theory of Linked Events Evidence in Bones Volcanic Dust Theory In Less Than a Century March 9, 1980, Sunday By WALTER SULLIVAN Scientists are reviving the controversial notion that millions of cubic miles of Antarctic ice can sometimes abruptly slip off the continent into the sea, resulting in extreme increases in global ocean levels and precipitating a dramatic chilling of the world’s climate.

And that was just 1980 and before. Now all of a sudden, everybody is freaking about the entire planey warming up.... after about 100 years of studies stating otherwise for an ice age.

Now would you believe a few reports backed by Gore from just the last 10 years or so, or a pile of reports from over 100 years?

And even shown above, these scientists admitted that nothing will be for certain until we actually experience an effect.

Like the calm before the storm, this so called heat wave we are experiencing or "Global Warming" could be only for a short period of time which would result in a counter balance and possibly produce an ice age for much longer. Scientists have screwed up before, they can screw up now.

It's the exact same thing, Praxius. Climate Change = Global Warming. The former is simply a less threatening terminology that conservatives prefer when discussing the issue.

Shows what you know. Global Warming would be obviously the entire planet "Warming" where Climate Change can be anything and everything either going hotter or colder.... note "Change" not "Warming."

[Praxius]

Spoken like a true libertarian. Take plain ol CO2, mix it with H2O - water in the atmosphere, and you get carbonic acid, a weak acid rain. Mix Sulfur Dioxide, a common pollutant from burning coal, with atmospheric H2O, and you get sulfuric acid, a much stronger acid rain. Mix Nitrogen Dioxide in the atmosphere, you get Nitric Acid. Even stronger. So yes, we are, in fact, putting something NEW into the world, and right now, we're putting in more CO2 and methane into the atmosphere than the earth's chemical equilibrium, and therefore the evolution of life on earth, was designed for over the milleniums.

Yeah so? Toxic gases are created from volcanos and the gases that are released from their eruptions which can also cause acid rain. Toxic gases are also released from burning wood.... all things which continually occur on the planet everyday since it's creation.

And wow... so the planet will be changing from what we have somewhat known for the last millenium..... nothing lasts forever, and I am one who doesn't support in attempting to maintain the climate if it's not what is supposed to occur.

Trying to stop climate change is like trying to stop evolution.... it's foolish.

I'm not blind as to what's coming our way.... I'm just not all pissy and scared of what's to come to the level I feel I must stop the entire world and save it from our own destruction.

What was cold will be warm, what was warm will be cold again..... it's the cycle of life, and I got enough issues in my everyday life to worry about when it comes to countries trying to start the next World War.... I don't need some know-nothings trying to invoke even more fear into the public into something that's too late to fix..... quite honestly I don't think we ever had a chance to fix it.

[Praxius]

Quote by: Sonart . Read a friggin' newspaper. Southeast drought hits crisis point Lanier Lake in Cumming, Georgia. .

Wow... and didn't Texas and a few other States, just get through major flooding? Or was that another part of the country?

What about this big ice/snow storm which just past over most of the US and is about to hit my area tomorrow?

What about that other big snow storm following right up after this storm the US is about to get hit by?

1 week left before Winter officially starts.... seems like it's gonna be Global Warming T-Shirt Weather

[EnragedParrot]

Quote by: Praxius And that was just 1980 and before. Now all of a sudden, everybody is freaking about the entire planey warming up.... after about 100 years of studies stating otherwise for an ice age. Now would you believe a few reports backed by Gore from just the last 10 years or so, or a pile of reports from over 100 years?

As noted in your article, scientists have been aware that anthropogenic emissions of carbon dioxide have been affecting the planet's temperature for well over a century. So we certainly aren't believing "A few reports backed by Gore from the last 10 years," we're believing over a century and a half's worth of research done by thousands of scientists.

Also, your article was, undoubtedly intentionally, misleading. There was actually very little, if any, support for the idea of an imminent ice age in the scientific community. In fact, there wasn't a single article published in the scientific literature predicting any such thing.

Here's a much better history of global warming theory.

Like the calm before the storm, this so called heat wave we are experiencing or "Global Warming" could be only for a short period of time which would result in a counter balance and possibly produce an ice age for much longer.

That isn't likely, unless we stop putting massive amounts of greenhouse gases into the air. Although admittedly, without humanity's influence, the planet would currently be slowly cooling.

[EnragedParrot]

Quote by: Sonart It's the exact same thing, Praxius. Climate Change = Global Warming. The former is simply a less threatening terminology that conservatives prefer when discussing the issue.

Not really. Global warming means an increase in the planet's temperature. Climate change refers to any long term change in average weather patterns over an area. So the two terms are related, but not the same.