U.S. troops can leave 'anytime,' Iraqi P.M. says

[Osborn F Enready]

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Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki shrugged off U.S. doubts of his government's military and political progress Saturday, saying Iraqi forces are capable and American troops can leave "anytime they want." "We say in full confidence that we are able, God willing, to take the responsibility completely in running the security file if the international forces withdraw at anytime they want," he said. One of al-Maliki's close advisers, Shiite lawmaker Hassan al-Suneid, bristled over the American pressure, telling The Associated Press that "the situation looks as if it is an experiment in an American laboratory [judging] whether we succeed or fail." He sharply criticized the U.S. military, saying it was committing human rights violations and embarrassing the Iraqi government through such tactics as building a wall around Baghdad's Sunni neighborhood of Azamiyah and launching repeated raids on suspected Shiite militiamen in the capital's slum of Sadr City. He also criticized U.S. overtures to Sunni groups in Anbar and Diyala provinces, encouraging former insurgents to join the fight against al Qaeda in Iraq. "These are gangs of killers," he said. In addition, he said that al-Maliki has problems with the top U.S. commander, Gen. David Petraeus, who he said works along a "purely American vision." "There are disagreements that the strategy that Petraeus is following might succeed in confronting al Qaeda in the early period but it will leave Iraq an armed nation, an armed society and militias," al-Suneid said.

Now what will be the excuse to stay there?!?

[Chaossaber314]

I'm curious if Maliki really believes that the Iraqi military could take on the current problems of his country or if it's just an attempt at empty pride.

[thx1138]

That's it the Prime Minister says the U.S. can leave anytime.
Any staying after this can only be seen a foregin "Ocupation" against the will of the government of that country.

Just like with Syria in Lebanon, which the U.S. came out against.

The question now is will the U.S. practice what it preaches.

Cue now for all the excuses to stay there by the "nut-balls" who feel this was a fair and just war.

[shawmutt]

Good, let's pack it up and head out.

[Chaossaber314]

Quote by: thx1138 That's it the Prime Minister says the U.S. can leave anytime. Any staying after this can only be seen a foregin "Ocupation" against the will of the government of that country.

You're confusing him saying that we can do something with him saying that we should do something.

It's comparable to teaching your child to drive and having them assert that they know how to drive already before they manage to kill the engine the first time.

[thx1138]

You're confusing him saying that we can do something with him saying that we should do something.

You're confusing what is right to do with what the U.S. will do.

The fact is that the U.S. attacked a country that did not attack it and is now ocupaing that country.

That is exactly what the U.S.S.R. did in Afghanistan, which the U.S. supported Mujahideen insurgents against.

Which brings up the point how is Iran or Syria supporting insurgents in Iraq any different then the U.S. supporting the Mujahideen insurgents against the U.S.S.R.?

It's the same.

[Chaossaber314]

You're confusing what is right to do with what the U.S. will do.

No, I made no implication what-so-ever in regards to the US or the US's right to be there. We were discussing the intent of the Al maliki in making his comments.

Try and keep the tirades to a minimum.

[Osborn F Enready]

The fact is, Maliki said it, and the representatives had previously voted on the idea of the U.S. leaving, and supported the idea, as they see the U.S. currently as occupiers.

We should have left long ago, but then again, we shouldn't have been there in the first place.

[The Decider]

Quote by: Chaossaber314 You're confusing him saying that we can do something with him saying that we should do something. It's comparable to teaching your child to drive and having them assert that they know how to drive already before they manage to kill the engine the first time.

Maliki did say that Iraq would need more equipment and training before we left. But US combat operations could end now, according to Maliki, without endangering peace in the region. He might be wrong like a "child" in your analogy, but that "child" behaves like an adult---especially when he travels to Iran for talks with his close allies there. Iran, after all, cared for Maliki the Child when America supported Saddam Hussein. Child or not, if Maliki thinks he can survive without US troops, Bush will have a tough time convincing anybody that Maliki is wrong.

Bush's weak case for the "surge" just got weaker.

[Battig1370]

The Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has closer ties with Iran than with USA. The Shiites welcomed US ARMY to remove Saddam Hussien and his power base, but now Shiites who are also the enemy the USA wants to rule Iraq. But the US doesn't want to help the Shiites have their way in Iraq. From all this caos in Iraq Al Qaede has come in and established itself.

US troops can leave anytime says Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, but saddened to say, the US troops are there to stay until the game is finished. To win in Iraq is to have a pro-America grovernment and that's never going to happen.

As of today, I haven't met any muslims the are friends of Israel. This is different topic but is very much related to what is happening in the middle -east.

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: thx1138 You're confusing what is right to do with what the U.S. will do. The fact is that the U.S. attacked a country that did not attack it and is now ocupaing that country. That is exactly what the U.S.S.R. did in Afghanistan, which the U.S. supported Mujahideen insurgents against. Which brings up the point how is Iran or Syria supporting insurgents in Iraq any different then the U.S. supporting the Mujahideen insurgents against the U.S.S.R.? It's the same.

Then we should learn from that mistake; the Iraqi government must be able to fight off the religious fanatics that would otherwise turn Iraq into a brutal theocracy.

[Praxius]

Quote by: Chaossaber314 I'm curious if Maliki really believes that the Iraqi military could take on the current problems of his country or if it's just an attempt at empty pride.

It's irrelevent.... it's a so-called democratic country.... if their Prime Minister says they are willing to take the responsibility, then who is the US to stand in their way and baby sit them?

It's already proven a failed mission, and it's getting worse.... perhaps what is needed is for people to actually listen to the Iraqi people for a change and what they want, rahter then what the US government dictates to us in the media...... when have they ever spoken the truth?

Chances are they feel it's not going to get much worse then what it is, and the more the US stays there, the worse it will become. How are they suppose to reach agreements with one another with a forign force there at their backs, telling them how to do things?

If there is no other hidden alterior motive for Bush to keep troops in there, then there is no longer any reason to pull the troops out.... Now!

If Bush pulls some stupid ass stunt like saying something like "We're staying there for our best interests in case the country begins to harbor terrorists." Then by jesus.... someone better do something about him..... seriously..... get him out of power one way or another.....

[Battig1370]

September 12, 2006 · Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki meets with Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad during the Iraqi leader's first state visit to that nation. Since the fall of Saddam Hussein in 2003, a new Iraqi government dominated by Shiite Muslims has sought closer ties with their neighbor.

[Chaossaber314]

Quote by: Praxius It's irrelevent.... it's a so-called democratic country.... if their Prime Minister says they are willing to take the responsibility, then who is the US to stand in their way and baby sit them?

It's not irrelevant because when we pull out of Iraq I don't want to have to go back 4-5 years down the road because it turns out they can't handle what they said they could and it's already our responsibility for making it that way.


The other thing is just because I say that if my girlfriend became pregnant I could get a second job and we could scrape by and survive, doesn't mean I want my girlfriend to get pregnant. Talking about contingencies doesn't mean you want to use them.

[Praxius]

Quote by: Chaossaber314 It's not irrelevant because when we pull out of Iraq I don't want to have to go back 4-5 years down the road because it turns out they can't handle what they said they could and it's already our responsibility for making it that way.

Yeah well as you said, you guys started the crap over there.... if things come back your way in the future, you have nobody else to blame but yourselves and the leader you followed. If Iraq fails in this, you can't blame them, because at least they tried a different approach from whatever lame mission you guys think is working.

You're mission there already has no direction, has no end, no sucesses, and adding more troops hasn't worked has it? Bush has no real plan.... he just asked for us all to give it a chance to work...... WHAT TO WORK? To what end? All that's going on is a pile of US troops policing Iraq.... that's it.... and they're being killed daily.

The other thing is just because I say that if my girlfriend became pregnant I could get a second job and we could scrape by and survive, doesn't mean I want my girlfriend to get pregnant. Talking about contingencies doesn't mean you want to use them.

So if Iraq says they no longer need your assistance, you guys are gonna say "Oh they don't mean that, we'll stay?"

Come on now.

Maybe what is needed in Iraq is for them to have relations with Iran.... or some other muslim country there..... apparently working with you guys has failed miserably.... perhaps working with another country which understands them, and who won't attempt to place on them some forign government, like a democracy, or whathaveyou..... they might stop their fighting.

The core of the fighting is that one faction feels that the other faction has the US influencing them and trying to ruin their way of life, and vice versa.... remove the forign influences and they might actually solve their problems.......

What's going on in Iraq could easily be compared to a pile of elementary students giving the subtitute teacher a living hell and to prove that they don't want him or her, but want their original teacher..... it's an act of defiance towards the US, their invasion, their occupation and the removal of the leader they knew....... keeping Iraq unstable until you leave is probably their plans from day one...... just to prove that they wern't just gonna suck up whatever you guys fed them.

I know for sure that if the US was invaded by another country, occupied, your leaders removed and the invading force tried to impose a different form of government, you guys would insurge, and make sure their plans failed..... it's simple patriotism on their part..... yeah they're killing each other, but their ways are not our ways, and you or I can not expect them to understand, or vice versa.

You guys figured they would want Saddam out of there, that you could make their lives better..... but those faults you all saw, they were a part of their everydays lives, they didn't care.......

It's the exact same thing as another country invading you guys because they see the poor, the rich, unequality, and injustices that you guys complain about everyday, poor healthcare, high crime rates, etc..... to them it seems like something serious, but to you guys.... it's just everyday life, you just like to complain sometimes. Just because you guys have all kinds of things to complain about, doesn't mean you would give up your country..... so why should you expect them to do the same?

Pull Out!

[Tashah]

General Petraeus and his staff will be testifying before Congress in September. That is one tipping point. The next comes in April of 2008 with required and extensive troop rotations. I have strong reservations on whether or not it will be either politically possible or militarily feasible to retain the current number of US forces in Iraq beyond these tipping points.

It is a given that the US must - sometime - withdraw from Iraq. Just curious here. How many of you think Iraq can maintain unity and how many of you expect a fracturing along ethnic/religious lines?

[Matt W]

I'm not entirely sure. I would expect an ongoing civil war for some years, with not-so-covert backing from Iran, Saudi, Syria, and, of course, US 'advisors'. I would bet on Turkey making a strike into the Kurdish north and trying to smoke out the insurgents there - unfortunately they're the ones actively involved in keeping that part of Iraq stable, so the whole country goes to the dogs.

Unfortunately, I don't think prolonging it is going to make it any easier - more people will die, and the atrocities will get nastier as the factions fight without trying to attract the attention of the US too much.

[Chaossaber314]

Quote by: Praxius Yeah well as you said, you guys started the crap over there.... if things come back your way in the future, you have nobody else to blame but yourselves and the leader you followed.

Which is why you don't just quit since we'll end up having to go back anywy. You get a new commander in chief and finish the job he started and lied us into.

So if Iraq says they no longer need your assistance, you guys are gonna say "Oh they don't mean that, we'll stay?"

It's my opinion that the quote was taken out of context. I think the "god willing" part of that indicates that even his attempt at looking somewhat competent in security was marred by serious doubt.

[Matt W]

Which is why you don't just quit since we'll end up having to go back anywy.

Like Vietnam? Really?

[ZNFYRH]

Who cares what happens to them?

Their legitimate government leadership is telling us that he no longer wants our military in his country.

I'm willing to bet that if we don't leave by the end of the year, the Iraqi gov't will petition the U.N. to order us to leave and claim that we are an occupation force.